Ron Paul on the Income Tax

ViRedd

New Member

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Cough Up[/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]by Ron Paul[/FONT][FONT=Georgia, Times New Roman, Times, serif][/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]
[/FONT]by Ron Paul

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]April 15th, our national tax day, comes this year just as Congress prepares to pass the 2007 federal budget. If you think paying taxes was painful this year, I’ve got some bad news: the new budget is a grotesque illustration of everything wrong with the federal government. At $2.7 trillion, it’s the largest budget in U.S. history by a long shot. Like it or not, the pressure to raise your taxes will be enormous in coming years no matter who controls Congress. The amount of money government spends, borrows, and prints simply cannot be sustained. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]For most people, their income tax return represents their most meaningful interaction with the federal government. It requires them to confess their actions over the past year to the IRS in excruciating detail. It's an annual ritual guaranteed to elicit strong feelings of disgust. Thanks to the deception of income tax withholding, however, some people actually look forward to tax time and a much-anticipated refund. Imagine how quickly Americans would demand lower taxes and spending if they had to write the federal government a check each month. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Most people understandably want a simpler income tax system, but it’s useless to discuss tax reform without spending reform. Who wants a 40% flat tax? Who wants a national sales tax if it adds 50% to the retail price of everything we buy? In other words, why change the tax structure if spending stays the same? Once we accept that Congress needs $2.7 trillion from us, the only question is how it will be collected. The current answer is the labyrinthine tax code, which pits taxpayers against each other in a political scramble to make sure the other guy pays. The truth is that Congress does not need $2.7 trillion, or anything close to it, to fund the proper constitutional functions of the federal government. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]The only tax reform needed is to lower or abolish ex[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]isting taxes. When reform proposals seem complicated, the reason is simple: they obscure their true nature as schemes to shift the tax burden around. It’s not who pays or how we pay; it’s how much we pay. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]The real enemy of tax reform is the spending culture in Washington. Let me repeat: we will never have tax reform in this country until Congress changes its spending habits. The reform rhetoric, regardless of which party it comes from, never changes the reality that federal spending grows every year. Congress spent $2.4 trillion in the last Bush budget; the new budget proposes to spend $2.7 trillion. The same unconstitutional agencies are funded, the same unwise programs are perpetuated, but at higher levels than last year. The previous budget serves merely as a baseline; the only question in any given year is how much spending will increase. Once created, no spending program is ever eliminated. The cycle goes on and on, with different administrations and different people in Congress.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]But could America exist without an income tax? The idea seems radical, yet in truth America did just fine without a federal income tax for the first 126 years of her history. Prior to 1913, the government operated with revenues raised through tariffs, excise taxes, and property taxes, without ever touching a worker's paycheck. Even today, individual income taxes account for only approximately one-third of federal revenue. Eliminating one-third of the proposed 2007 budget would still leave federal spending at roughly $1.8 trillion – a sum greater than the budget just 6 years ago in 2000! Does anyone seriously believe we could not find ways to cut spending back to 2000 levels? Perhaps the idea of an America without an income tax is not so radical after all. It’s something to think about this week as we approach April 15th.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]April 11, 2006[/FONT]​










[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]Dr. Ron Paul is a Republican member of Congress from Texas.[/FONT]
 

medicineman

New Member
But could America exist without an income tax? The idea seems radical, yet in truth America did just fine without a federal income tax for the first 126 years of her history Yeah, it was just fine if you were a rich land owner or a rich anything. The poor had no plan to help them at all. There were no safety nets for the less fortunate among us and the poor had 2 choices, be dirt poor or rob banks, which would you choose? Now tell me about all the peons that became millionaires, But that leaves out the millions of poor that had squat! Taxation is here to stay. the plutocrats want to slice the pie in their favor, thats all!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Med ...

You are a devout, classic, class envy warrior. In spite of all the evidence of history and the failures of socialism, you stand strong against freedom. Gotta hand it to ya Bro.

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
Med ...

You are a devout, classic, class envy warrior. In spite of all the evidence of history and the failures of socialism, you stand strong against freedom. Gotta hand it to ya Bro.

Vi
Well thanks Vi, I'm glad you noticed. I'll probably be with the mob that takes down your town, I'll be sure to grab your stereo equipment for myself as I've heard it's the Dank!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Yer right ... it is the Dank! *lol* The problem is, I have the secret code. Unless you throw the correct switch, you'll be blown to smithereens.

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
I'd say fuck you ... but that would be rude.

Vi
Have I tapped a nerve mr. Vi, I'm sorry, but was it not you that called me rude. Tch.Tch. Was it not you that called me a class warrior. I guess the revealing of the warriors tendicies seemed to annoy you. If I were a "warrior" I think you would find me a formidable one. I can play head games with the best, but try not to on these sites, as that is the sure sign of Ego at work. I'll not abide insults without questioning the reason!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Med ... the "fuck you" comment was meant in jest. And no ... you don't annoy me, nor have you struck a nerve. And yes ... I have an ego that is still undamaged by the totalitarians who would abuse it, curse it and destroy it. And yes ... I view you as a class warrior based upon your posts.

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
Med ... the "fuck you" comment was meant in jest. And no ... you don't annoy me, nor have you struck a nerve. And yes ... I have an ego that is still undamaged by the totalitarians who would abuse it, curse it and destroy it. And yes ... I view you as a class warrior based upon your posts.

Vi
Well you may be right, and a noble profession it is, Class warrior. If it werent for class warriors, we'd still be under feudel rule. still be controlled by the likes of any dictator that could strongarm his way into power, (Sort of a G.W. Bush on steroids). In fact I know you are right, class warrior, I like the sound of that, Kill a rich man for Christ, or Budda, or Allah, it doesn't matter, just kill a rich asshole. I'll be getting my arsenal in order, and be prepared for the big battle, lets see there about 3 million rich assholes and 300 million of us, seems the odds are tilted in our favor, in fact I've enough guns to arm a squad and then some. Since I know the general area you live in, when the shit comes down I'll head for your neighborhood and reek havoc, Be super fun to watch those expensive stereo components go up in smoke. Now is that what you wanted to hear? Class Warrior indeed! If it werent for class warriors you'd be paying homage to Queen Elizabeth. Since you happen to be in the rich category, i'm sure you're shakin in your boots, thinking we might show up at any time, well not yet my friend, the proletariate aren't pissed off enough yet, so you'll probably live out your life without attack, but it's coming. As the rich continue to make more poor people and increase their wealth, the odds go up that there will be insurection.. We'll probably not live that long, but my grandkids will probably see it!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Well, after you kill all of the rich "assholes," and considering the rich "assholes" pay the majority of the taxes, what will you do when you get the inevitable letter from the federal government that says: "Dear Mister Med, we regret to inform you that because of the demise of the rich "assholes," we no longer have the revenue stream that enabled us to pay Social Security benefits. Therefore, consider this to be your last check."

Vi
 

battosai

Well-Known Member
thats a damn good article vi. i wonder how easily it would be to confirm those numbers. probably not too hard, i'm assuming tho that ron paul did his homework.

every now and then i see a shocking article about the way we allow our country to operate. im surprised that it has little to no effect on anyone. people just strut it off with that 'what can i do' or 'yep they're assholes' attitude. we need to do something.

so when i get back tonight i may start a thread just for what we can DO about problems...if i remember, or if someone doesnt do it in the mean time. gotta run
 

ViRedd

New Member
Thanks battosai ... glad you saw merit in the article. I'll say this ... after being an independent contractor, and not having my taxes automatically taken out of a paycheck for 31 years, I have a totally different take on the evils of the income tax. Without the withholding tax, the income tax fraud would collapse almost overnight ... and they know it.

Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
Thanks battosai ... glad you saw merit in the article. I'll say this ... after being an independent contractor, and not having my taxes automatically taken out of a paycheck for 31 years, I have a totally different take on the evils of the income tax. Without the withholding tax, the income tax fraud would collapse almost overnight ... and they know it.

Vi
You're always asking me to do the homework, let me ask you: Eliminate the federal withholding tax and replace it with what? Do the math and tell me either A. what percentage of a sales tax we'd have to have (I'd guess 50% or higher) or B. what kind of excise tax or other form of taxation we'd have to have to keep this machine rolling! Or do you just want to dump all the social programs and only pay for basic services, and put 100,000,000 million people on the streets!
 

ViRedd

New Member
Med ...

A sales tax IS an excise tax. And, I really don't care how high it would be. Even 50% would be OK. At that rate, the American public would see the enormity of the situation and demand change. Our present tax system is dishonest at best because it hides the actual amount from public view. Hell, make it a 50% federal sales tax and watch the march on Washington begin. You can bet we would no longer have bridges to nowhere, or half of a state named Byrd.
Vi
 

medicineman

New Member
Med ...

A sales tax IS an excise tax. And, I really don't care how high it would be. Even 50% would be OK. At that rate, the American public would see the enormity of the situation and demand change. Our present tax system is dishonest at best because it hides the actual amount from public view. Hell, make it a 50% federal sales tax and watch the march on Washington begin. You can bet we would no longer have bridges to nowhere, or half of a state named Byrd.
Vi
Or corporate welfare, or a war, or a warchest for the generals, new toys like the newest stealth fighter-bomber, a billion dollar toy, Star wars etc. 50% eh. your as full of crap as the Christmas goose, it would never work, I said to give me a workable plan with replacement figures, you don't have one. the only plan we know will work, a progressive Income tax. Get rid of the FED, I'm all for that!
 

Nimbliez

Well-Known Member
On the issue of taxes... Vi is correct, and besides, it has been proven that the income tax laws are fraudulent and a sham in this country. Anyone with an ounce of intelegence can look it up and discover that the 16th ammendment was NEVER properly ratified and that Senator Knox who announced it's passing was lying to the congress and american people. Our federal government is way too big. Did you all happen to know... that filling out a W4 to be employed is in essence your blindly signing away your 5th ammendment rights??? Hmmm, perhaps you should look into this. As for the government protecting ME. I don't expect anyone to protect me.... that is MY job. My federal government's job is to protect my country. The trickle down effect is that I'm protected. But my personal protection starts and ends with ME. I want to know who is getting rich from all of my 2 cents worth.
 

ViRedd

New Member
Nimblize ...

I'm afraid that we are talking to a concrete wall here. Class envy is such a powerful negative emotion that folks like Med will never admit reality. I can tell that you've done your homework on the tax issue by the comments you've made above. It was the "Med" mindset that got the 16th Amendment passed in the first place. It was the love-child of the socialists back in 1913. Here's the ironic part ... Med has recently discovered the Federal Reserve, fiat money fraud, but still supports the progressive income tax. Go figure! *lol*

Vi
 

Nimbliez

Well-Known Member
'Tis a sad world we live in Vi, keep up the good fight, i've been on track with you from the start.
 

7xstall

Well-Known Member
Med, if there was no ripping apart of our income by the gvnmnt wolves, this generous country could replace all the fed programs with private ones that would do a much better job.
 
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