soil or coco and organic VS chem

ninjagrow69

New Member
I have been reading a little on Coco and am seriously considering trying it out. I have grown lots of good indoor bud years ago using just miracle grow in dirt...But older and wiser now ...I really dont care if its organic as long as its not harmful to smoke afterwards ...I know to flush to get rid of chem taste...I guess my question is this....do you prefer soil or coco...and organic or not...And why? Thanks in advance for your time to answer.
 

dannyboy602

Well-Known Member
I prefer organic. no salt based fertilizers for me. does it make my buds taste better? absolutely. I think for ppl who use the stuff as medicine its important.
 

tallstraw

Active Member
^that's arguable.
If you're getting back into it, and are able to handle deficiencies and problems. I'd say go organic and soil. If not, go coco, and chem ferts so you control every aspect of it.
 

Silky Shagsalot

Well-Known Member
i started out in dirt. i tried coco and liked it so much, i never went back to dirt. if you do choose coco, i'd suggest using a coco specific nute line. i've tried a few, and house and garden seem to be the best imo. never had any probs.
 

twostrokenut

Well-Known Member
maxsea.........not technically organic but no triple 16 will be.....just got some coco for hempy pots I'm still out on that one....other than hempy's hydro is not for me at all I prefer the dirt buffer and not losing my grow because the power went out.
 

blackforest

Well-Known Member
Tried something new this time. Wanted to support local CO and get a little something different. Although 1/2 my canvas is FFOF and going to run AN through harvest... :)

batch64.jpg
 

tallstraw

Active Member
Deficiencies and problems?
Yeah, it's a lot easier to start fresh in coco if a lockout happens, or deficient, because you can wipe everything out of it fast, and start the nutes over in a diff dose or etc. Soil isn't inert, so it has a varying level of npk per bag and batch. So you gotta know if it's a lockout, or deficiency, and etc. While being able to treat it, knowing not matter how much you flush, theres still gonna be stuff in it you have to acc for while using additives or not. But you already knew that, it's just backlash from the other thread it seems.
 
Coco will offer a much more aerated medium. Hands down better crops with Coco compared to any medium out there. As far as nutrients & supplements. You can find organic nutrients for hydroponic gardens but you have to be aware that pathogens are quite possible in organic solutions. My suggestion is to use Coco and a nutrient & supplement schedule but you HAVE to flush daily for 10 days if you want to flush it our well and taste the buds are clean as you can. Ive gotten excellent results doing this and my medical customers and myself have absolutely no complaints. Better results with coco but you have to be ready to commit to a strict flushing regiment. You will not regret it. I run a online hydro shop, come check me out and let me know how your doing.
 

Nullis

Moderator
Yeah, it's a lot easier to start fresh in coco if a lockout happens, or deficient, because you can wipe everything out of it fast, and start the nutes over in a diff dose or etc. Soil isn't inert, so it has a varying level of npk per bag and batch. So you gotta know if it's a lockout, or deficiency, and etc. While being able to treat it, knowing not matter how much you flush, theres still gonna be stuff in it you have to acc for while using additives or not. But you already knew that, it's just backlash from the other thread it seems.
:roll:

I would never flush my soil, not necessary. Lockout simply doesn't occur to any extent that would cause me to have to interfere with it. I certainly wouldn't flush if I noticed a deficiency... I would do something to actually correct it.

Coco coir isn't exactly inert, either, certainly not in the sense that rockwool and perlite are. The properties of coco coir can vary quite a bit depending on the source and treatment prior to sale. There are different grades of coir and it is often rinsed with a buffering solution (with calcium and magnesium to displace the sodium) and may also be composted for some period of time. These practices reduce the occurrence of calcium/magnesium lockout. Coir is naturally high in K and may also have decent phosphorous content. Therefore it is not totally devoid of nutrients, and it has a cation exchange capacity.

Cations are positively charged ions: including Na+, K+, Ca++, Mg++, etc. They are attracted to soil/humus/clay/coco/peat particles, which possess an opposing (negative) charge. This more or less prevents the cations from leaching out of the media, although they will still most likely be plant available. Calcium and magnesium are examples of divalent cations and as such are more strongly held than sodium (monovalent).

I include coco coir in my potting soil, which is a living soil that includes predator mites and other micro-arthropods as well as beneficial microbes. It is amended prior to planting in, with guano being the strongest thing used. The plants form symbiotic associations with various microbes (fungi such as mycorrhizae and trichoderma, and bacteria that fix nitrogen from the atmosphere) which help it acquire nutrients and resist pathogens, and the soil food web sustains itself and the plant as it would in nature. I provide humic\fulvic acids and sometimes blackstrap with the irrigation water, and AACT occasionally. Even if something else is needed, infrequently, it is usually not a major problem and doesn't require me to account for every little thing in the soil.

No lockout, no flushing, no pHing anything, no problems. Just sayin.
 

ninjagrow69

New Member
I thank you all for your input. I went and ought a bag of coca tonight and transplanted all of my clones into 16oz cups for a week or so. I will e starting a grow thread soon...tonight or tomorrow. This will be my first indoor crop in 10 years and my first coco grow ...as well as the first time I paid attention to the organic end of things ...I will pop back here and throw a link up...I REALLY hope you all will join me there as I will have many questions and would appreciate the input ....I hope to have a good grow...I have a proper grow room...10' X 7" X6.5" Tall...I will be using a 1000W HPS for flowering...the clones are in a separate tent under 20,000 Lumens of T5 6500 I have 19 NL#5 clones I got from a good friend ...Thanks again and hope to see you all there !
 

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
IMO, plants don't know the difference between a nitrogen atom that comes from an organic substance, such as bird suit, gauno, or fish shit, emulsion, or worm shit, castings, or if the nirltrogen were made in a factory as nitrogen, no matter it's source, is always going to have the same amount of electrons and protons floating around, and the plants can't tell the difference if its organic or a chemical, salt based nutrient..
same with pottasium and magnesium and any other chemical..
So, saying that, I can't understand how organic grows would taste any different than a chemical, salt based grow as all the atoms in both of.them are identical..
My $.02..
 

waterdawg

Well-Known Member
Ok I'm gonna get really slammed for this one lol. IMO organic grows are all sweet and cuddly like Panda bears and do probably taste different, better depends on the person smoking it I would think. Some people like liver, I on the other hand throw up if I put it in my mouth. lol. Are Organic grows better for you health, Hmmmm, quote a couple of scientific studies and I'll start to pay attention lol. I have a farm that is organic and why did I do this (it took a lot of work to do this BTW)? The stuff sells for more at the market! Do I think its better for the enviroment well I'm not sure as it cost more in fuel, labor, repairs to get the same yield which is a major contributor to more energy being consumed. Again Im not saying its not a good thing to use chemical nutes or a better thing to go all organic I just think its up to the person growing and consuming the product to make that decision. As far as pot growing I need to get as much as fast as I can to save on power bills and I cann't grow in the warm months indoors so I choose hydro and running a sterile res IMO makes it a bit easier to monitor stuff for a newb like myself lol. Slam away lol.
 

Nullis

Moderator
Organic agriculture isn't about simply switching from synthetic/chemical inputs to organic/natural ones. If it costs much more or seems to take a lot of work, IMO you're doing something wrong.

If you have a farm, for example, and perhaps livestock, you should definitely have a compost pile. Livestock wastes and compost should be your primary inputs. The health of the soil is of paramount importance and the healthier the soil is, the less work you'll have to do.

I can't say for certain how much hydro nutrients/supplements affect the taste of finished bud, but most do contain EDTA, while some have other synthetic chelates and others have other chemicals such as plant growth hormones. Chemicals like EDTA form complexes with certain minerals, increasing their availability and basically forcing uptake into the roots. EDTA has a particular affinity for heavy metals, and so may increase the uptake and accumulation of heavy metals in plant tissues. The fate of the EDTA itself inside the plant is unknown.
 
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