projectinfo
Well-Known Member
..
Strip LEDs in the garden of Paradise
- Thread starter Prawn Connery
- Start date
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
With any recirculating system you need to dump your reservoir at least every two weeks and start again with fresh nutrient, otherwise you end up with a nutrient imbalance with no idea what's in there - your EC/TDS meter will only tell you the total amount of dissolved salts, not which ones they are.
Also, a good base nutrient should stand on its own. That is, you should be able to get through an entire flowering period on base nutrients alone, only using additives to tweak your grow once you know your strain, or to supplement RO water, which has none of the natural Calcium or Magnesium usually found in limestone-based tap water.
If your base nutrient can't make it through an entire grow without showing up nutrient deficiencies, it's time to find another base nutrient.
You probably know where I'm going with this . . . By adding lots of different supplements and not starting afresh with new nutrient solution every couple of weeks - as well as continually topping up your res with tap water, which itself usually contains a fair amount of NaCl which can build up - you end up with a potentially toxic soup and nothing to buffer it (as you're in hydro).
If you are dumping your res on a regular basis, then it's obviously the supplements, as you've alluded to.
The good news is, they're not too bad. Change your res out, go easy on the nutes until they recover, and you should be fine.
Also, a good base nutrient should stand on its own. That is, you should be able to get through an entire flowering period on base nutrients alone, only using additives to tweak your grow once you know your strain, or to supplement RO water, which has none of the natural Calcium or Magnesium usually found in limestone-based tap water.
If your base nutrient can't make it through an entire grow without showing up nutrient deficiencies, it's time to find another base nutrient.
You probably know where I'm going with this . . . By adding lots of different supplements and not starting afresh with new nutrient solution every couple of weeks - as well as continually topping up your res with tap water, which itself usually contains a fair amount of NaCl which can build up - you end up with a potentially toxic soup and nothing to buffer it (as you're in hydro).
If you are dumping your res on a regular basis, then it's obviously the supplements, as you've alluded to.
The good news is, they're not too bad. Change your res out, go easy on the nutes until they recover, and you should be fine.
projectinfo
Well-Known Member
Great , thanks and I do change my entire res and mother res bucket every week. I scrub with chrorine solution and rinse everything. I even run clean water through my rw and pots before I refill the res. I'm about to in about 10 min I'm just waiting for that coffee to kick in haha
OK and I do get you. A/n isn't the way to go.
I have the full canna coco line and r/o filter and the cyco coco all on deck and ready for the next round
IL just reduce the base nutes down from 750 to 600 and ph to 5.8 let drift to 6.5 and adjust
Cut the calmag and epsom and pk
OK and I do get you. A/n isn't the way to go.
I have the full canna coco line and r/o filter and the cyco coco all on deck and ready for the next round
IL just reduce the base nutes down from 750 to 600 and ph to 5.8 let drift to 6.5 and adjust
Cut the calmag and epsom and pk
projectinfo
Well-Known Member
Went to 550ppm
ph 6 no adjusting100l tank
90ml a nitrogen
120ml b micros
Ultra lemon haze is a sativa so they don't like N as much I hear.
Is this right or should I alwase do equal parts with shitty base nutes?
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Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I'd be running 1:1. If I read the ingredients correctly, Part A has all the calcium, potash and other micros you need for flowering, so use as directed. I'd also run it at least half-strength until they recover - so about 200ml of each? I find some hazes feed more than indicas. It really depends on the strain.
OneHitDone
Well-Known Member
I would like to ask @Prawn Connery his opinion on something related to your nutrients.
It is my understanding the Urea has no place in a non-biologically active hydroponic system. If this is correct, why does Advances Nutrients load their lines full of it other than it potentially being a cheap ingredient?
projectinfo
Well-Known Member
Yeah thir very dark green. And OK IL run 1:1 like 100of each should bring me up around500-600 ppm.
During a low water period the ppm hit over 1200, this is where things went down hill. so I think 500-600 should be in range or at least low enough I hope
If I'm adding in the rest of the nutes should I just add the res in and dilute until it reaches ppm
Or redo the whole fuckin res again...
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Don't redo the whole res, just add the remaining Part A (30ml) so they're equal. 120ml of each shouldn't raise your PPM much over 600 - although I reckon you'd be fine with 800-900pm if you want to go a little higher once your plants look better. The combined NPK ratio of your nutes is 2.5-2.5-4.5 (or 5-5-9), so it's about right for a flowering nutrient - it doesn't have a high N to P ratio at all.
You could give it a very small PK boost at around 6-7 weeks of flower if you want. I wouldn't be using any Cal-Mag because (assuming the Jungle Juice ingredient list is correct) there should already be plenty in your base nutrient for recirculating hydro. You're more inclined to have Cal-Mag deficiencies in coco. Also, a slightly higher pH will make Calcium and Magnesium more available, and you're already running about pH6 - or at least, from what I understand, you're in the 5.8-6.3 range. I'd try to keep it a little lower in rockwool-based hydro, around 5.6-6.1.
You could give it a very small PK boost at around 6-7 weeks of flower if you want. I wouldn't be using any Cal-Mag because (assuming the Jungle Juice ingredient list is correct) there should already be plenty in your base nutrient for recirculating hydro. You're more inclined to have Cal-Mag deficiencies in coco. Also, a slightly higher pH will make Calcium and Magnesium more available, and you're already running about pH6 - or at least, from what I understand, you're in the 5.8-6.3 range. I'd try to keep it a little lower in rockwool-based hydro, around 5.6-6.1.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I don't profess to be an expert on these things, but the only real advantage I can see is cost. AN might argue that small amounts of urea could have two benefits in a recirculating rockwool system: one, lowering pH as it releases ammonium to counter the natural propensity for pH to rise in a recirculating system (possibly more pH stable), and two, being a slow-release source of nitrogen that allows slightly higher concentrations to be mixed initially without burning the plants, then releasing it later as nitrate levels fall in solution.
But really, I'm only hypothesising. Also, unless you are continually dosing your system with chlorine or reasonable levels of hydrogen peroxide, there's really no such thing as a completely sterile system, as bacteria are pretty much everywhere. I gave up on sterile systems almost as soon as I started growing in hydroponics (DWC), using organic-based nutrients for successive DWC and later coco RTW and flood and drain systems.
I will add one anecdote: a commercial friend of mine ran AN Jungle Juice for a long time because he was resistant to change and always followed the guy at the hydro shop who was - naturally - always trying to sell him something. Eventually I convinced him to ditch the Jungle Juice and other additives and try CX and Monster Bud based on my own regime. He couldn't believe the difference a good base nutrient made and has never looked back. Even when you mix organic-based nutrients straight with tap water, you still get the benefits of microbial activity because there's usually not enough residual chlorine in tap water to kill everything and the microbes will bounce back in your reservoir. I still like to let my water stand for 48 hours before I use it.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Week 5 Sensi Star.
Week 5 Acid in the foreground and rear, and Sensi Stars on the left and right.
The Acids are just starting to show signs of bleaching while the Sensi Stars, which are taller and closer to the LEDs, are fine. It shows how different strains handle the same light. These Sensi Stars both seem to be sativa phenos.
dannykay
Well-Known Member
Looking good mate, keep it up!
Out of curiosity, why the file name is week5bleach?
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I measured the power draw and it was 48.1v and 5.85a for each driver with both turned up full. So both my HLG-240H-48As are putting out 280w. Because a couple of the plants were starting to show bleaching, I wound the power down to 48v and 5a, or 240w each.
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
With the lights cranked up, some of the taller Acid tops were starting to show signs of light saturation, so I wound the drivers down from 280w to 240w each and raised the frames a bit.
This was the worst of it. The Sensi Stars are a few inches taller and showing no signs at all. Sativas can generally handle more light than indicas.
Moflow
Well-Known Member
All looking well in there!
Moflow
Well-Known Member
I'd have thought the acids would be a more stretchy than the Sensi Star.
Here's my pic of Sensi Star 2 a couple o weeks in flower to compare.
Mind you, my micro climate is totally different than yours which counts for a lot.
Looks like you push them to the limit on nutes
Here's my pic of Sensi Star 2 a couple o weeks in flower to compare.
Mind you, my micro climate is totally different than yours which counts for a lot.
Looks like you push them to the limit on nutes
Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
Yes, I thought the Acid would overall be more sativa than the Sensi Star. But there are a few SS phenos, including a sativa that grows big and takes up to 10 weeks to flower. I've grown a bit of Sensi Star out over the years, and this is the first time I've used femmed seeds, so it's possible there are different expressions in a femmed pack compared to the originals, or maybe I grabbed two sativa-leaning seeds by chance out of a 10-pack.
One thing is certain, the SS have outgrown the Acid all the way along. The SS were only vegged for just over two weeks compared to 3+ weeks for the Acid. A couple of Acids are growing faster than the other four and are rivaling the Sensi Star.
You can see them here: four Acid on the left, and two Acid/two Sensi Star on the right. This was taken a few days ago.
One thing is certain, the SS have outgrown the Acid all the way along. The SS were only vegged for just over two weeks compared to 3+ weeks for the Acid. A couple of Acids are growing faster than the other four and are rivaling the Sensi Star.
You can see them here: four Acid on the left, and two Acid/two Sensi Star on the right. This was taken a few days ago.
ANC
Well-Known Member
Have a look at geyser trays, they come in 2 x 4 and have a recessed drainage hole on one side so all the water can easily be collected without the pipes. They also cost less than $20 here.
P.S. most poeple do COBs and LEDS wrong by growing as if they are still under HPS.
We keep the plants small with at least two big toppings, and then a violent suppercropping before flower. It adds a few weeks, but we make up with a short flower strain. This provides a sea of small, very matureplants with a dense uniform canopy, all popcorn buds are removed before they even think of flowering.
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Prawn Connery
Well-Known Member
I haven't seen those here, but it wouldn't be a bad idea If I could find something deep enough to abate the risk of the odd leaf falling and blocking the drainage point if I didn't check on it for a few days. No risk of that with a pot-within-a-pot system.
Having said that, I've persisted with the double pots mainly because I used them for so long with vertical HPS growing, as it suited my style. But if I continue with horizontal LEDs, then a catch tray may become a feature. I had a similar flood and drain system with pots free-standing inside a shallow plastic crate that rested and drained into another 10-gallon crate/recirculating reservoir. It worked fine.
I tired to keep the plants small - honest! - but they grew a bit quicker than I thought they would. I must admit I was a bit skeptical of my LEDs at first, and didn't think they would be that powerful. But after going through the first two weeks of stretch on full driver power - 2x 280w - once decent buds started to form, I notice a bit of bleaching at the very tops of some of them (strain dependent), so had to turn down the drivers to 240w each. Then I noticed there was still some light saturation, so turned the drivers down again to about 200w each. After a couple of days of that, I noticed no new signs of bleaching, so have bumped the drivers up to 215w each - where hopefully they will stay for the rest of the grow.
It's not so much getting used to LED growing after HPS, but getting used to horizontal growing after vertical. With vertical growing, you want your pants to be tall and stretchy so that they fill in. I haven't grown horizontally for over 15 years.
Having said that, I've persisted with the double pots mainly because I used them for so long with vertical HPS growing, as it suited my style. But if I continue with horizontal LEDs, then a catch tray may become a feature. I had a similar flood and drain system with pots free-standing inside a shallow plastic crate that rested and drained into another 10-gallon crate/recirculating reservoir. It worked fine.
I tired to keep the plants small - honest! - but they grew a bit quicker than I thought they would. I must admit I was a bit skeptical of my LEDs at first, and didn't think they would be that powerful. But after going through the first two weeks of stretch on full driver power - 2x 280w - once decent buds started to form, I notice a bit of bleaching at the very tops of some of them (strain dependent), so had to turn down the drivers to 240w each. Then I noticed there was still some light saturation, so turned the drivers down again to about 200w each. After a couple of days of that, I noticed no new signs of bleaching, so have bumped the drivers up to 215w each - where hopefully they will stay for the rest of the grow.
It's not so much getting used to LED growing after HPS, but getting used to horizontal growing after vertical. With vertical growing, you want your pants to be tall and stretchy so that they fill in. I haven't grown horizontally for over 15 years.
