Super soil recipe for 8 cu. Ft of soil

MistaRasta said:

What else do ya add?

Fish bone meal? Alfalfa?

I find adding alfalfa does more harm than good

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I don't add any alfalfa or FBM to my mixes. I prefer to bubble alfalfa in water if I really feel like I need it. If you really need a jolt, try an alfalfa seed sst. The only thing different in my mix is I have more rock dust. I haven't experimented with less, but some people say they haven't noticed any difference. I also like to add 15% EWC and 15% thermal compost for the 'compost' portion. I'm also a fan of the smaller pumice rather than large lava rock. Again, many people use the lava rock with no problems.

hth,

P-

ShLUbY said:

well i couldn't find any information about your process of "activating" the char. everyone use "activate" and "charge" interchangingly. however i'm sure everyone that is making char and showing the results is doing it in the same fashion, with a sealed vessel in a fire. everything i found on biochar that was charged showed positive results over the control. i seriously doubt that my char mix is not going to do harm, but i guess we will see cause i already mixed the containers, one with char and one without. i'll be showing the growth when i get some plants in them in a month or so, fingers crossed!

and yes the pumice and lava rock do the same thing, but i'd like to see just for myself with the char.

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I think what you may have seen is people using pre activated char that was made specifically for the agriculture industry. My local hydro shop sells a cu ft of bio char for 40$

..The blow me price

I mean, come on dude. If You really think you can just go buy a bag of charcoal dump it in alfalfa and put it in your soil you're crazy. There's more to it, it's not that simple..But please proceed because all the help I've tried to give you obviously shows no bearing..

Good luck

Pattahabi said:

I don't add any alfalfa or FBM to my mixes. I prefer to bubble alfalfa in water if I really feel like I need it. If you really need a jolt, try an alfalfa seed sst. The only thing different in my mix is I have more rock dust. I haven't experimented with less, but some people say they haven't noticed any difference. I also like to add 15% EWC and 15% thermal compost for the 'compost' portion. I'm also a fan of the smaller pumice rather than large lava rock. Again, many people use the lava rock with no problems.

hth,

P-

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I noticed the trend of incorporating fish bone meal into soils as a guano alternative. I like the basic mix the most. It gives me the best growth rates without having to deal with any lock outs or anything like that.

I was using alfalfa but I noticed my plants didnt like it. Too much nitrogen I guess

MistaRasta said:

I think what you may have seen is people using pre activated char that was made specifically for the agriculture industry. My local hydro shop sells a cu ft of bio char for 40$

..The blow me price

I mean, come on dude. If You really think you can just go buy a bag of charcoal dump it in alfalfa and put it in your soil you're crazy. There's more to it, it's not that simple..But please proceed because all the help I've tried to give you obviously shows no bearing..

Good luck

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well it's too late, the mix was made and is sitting for 4 weeks. and btw, you didn't show me any help at all, my friend; i'm not trying to be rude but in no way did you help lol. and yes i agree, i'm not paying 40$ for cuft. of biochar.

i see plenty of comparison grows while googling that no one mentions anything about "activating" their char, and if they do, they're referring to charging. I'm not trying to say that the way i'm doing it is correct, but it's the way it happened. live and learn.

lots of the things i read, the people are making the char in an o2 free environment and nothing more just like the cowboy charcoal is made. if "activating" were such a huge deal, i feel like there would be a lot more references to it, and the difference between activating and charging.

even still, if the CEC of the biochar i made is low, then it's obviously just not going to help, but can't see how it would hurt the situation either. besides, 30% of my mix is pumice, which has better CEC than scoria. glad i mixed the exact same mix, one with char and one without... these will be AACT and water only. i will see the difference for sure, or maybe there will be none at all!

next biochar i make i'll be adding to compost to charge it. and maybe i'll do one with the cowboy, and one with charcoal i make from fire of my own to see the diff.

ShLUbY said:

well it's too late, the mix was made and is sitting for 4 weeks. and btw, you didn't show me any help at all, my friend; i'm not trying to be rude but in no way did you help lol. and yes i agree, i'm not paying 40$ for cuft. of biochar.

i see plenty of comparison grows while googling that no one mentions anything about "activating" their char, and if they do, they're referring to charging. I'm not trying to say that the way i'm doing it is correct, but it's the way it happened. live and learn.

lots of the things i read, the people are making the char in an o2 free environment and nothing more just like the cowboy charcoal is made. if "activating" were such a huge deal, i feel like there would be a lot more references to it, and the difference between activating and charging.

even still, if the CEC of the biochar i made is low, then it's obviously just not going to help, but can't see how it would hurt the situation either. besides, 30% of my mix is pumice, which has better CEC than scoria. glad i mixed the exact same mix, one with char and one without... these will be AACT and water only. i will see the difference for sure, or maybe there will be none at all!

next biochar i make i'll be adding to compost to charge it. and maybe i'll do one with the cowboy, and one with charcoal i make from fire of my own to see the diff.

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It's common sense dude, go read a book. Or at least past the 3rd page on Google. I tried helping you by telling you what you're doing wrong, you choose not to listen.

I'll put it plain and simple for you one more time. I don't need sources because what I'm telling you is 10th grade science..

When the coal is burned it releases its carbon, you suffocate the coal just as its about to burn up, doing this, you trap its carbon(a.k.a activating it) Now you have charcoal with a 1000:1 carbon/nitrogen ratio. This is why we put it in a nitrogen source to charge. Because anything with a high carbon rating pulls nitrogen, The coal will steal all the N from your soil if not charged BECAUSE it was activated..

Get it now?

You're skipping the most important part. You might as well be charging rocks and putting them in your soil..

Last post to you for sure
Good luck

MistaRasta said:

It's common sense dude, go read a book. Or at least past the 3rd page on Google. I tried helping you by telling you what you're doing wrong, you choose not to listen.

I'll put it plain and simple for you one more time. I don't need sources because what I'm telling you is 10th grade science..

When the coal is burned it releases its carbon, you suffocate the coal just as its about to burn up, doing this, you trap its carbon(a.k.a activating it) Now you have charcoal with a 1000:1 carbon/nitrogen ratio. This is why we put it in a nitrogen source to charge. Because anything with a high carbon rating pulls nitrogen, The coal will steal all the N from your soil if not charged BECAUSE it was activated..

Get it now?

You're skipping the most important part. You might as well be charging rocks and putting them in your soil..

Last post to you for sure
Good luck

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well i still don't understand how my hardwood whole charcoal doesn't have it's carbon trapped. shit, the plant traps the carbon, that's what the freakin charcoal was made from. lets take a lesson here mr. 10th grade science. what products are made when you COMBUST wood? CO2(g) and H2O(g)... right? ok, so when the reaction (combustion) stops, what ran out, the carbon that was burning or the O2? the carbon was used. so when it is extinguished, there MUST be carbon left. so what i don't get is why you are telling me my char is not "activated" by "trapping carbon". how can I NOT have CARBON trapped in my WHOLE CHARCOAL, which was made from a TREE that takes in CARBON from gas form and uses it to GROW the shit the CHAR was made from?

from this link-
"Biochar is not the same as activated carbon, which is a compound used for purifying liquids and gases due to its high absorption capacity. Biochar would need to go through an activation step, which is too expensive for land application purposes. Because of the widely varying feedstocks and processing practices utilized, it is important to understand that all biochar will not be alike. "

https://pubs.ext.vt.edu/442/442-311/442-311_pdf.pdf

ShLUbY said:

well i still don't understand how my hardwood whole charcoal doesn't have it's carbon trapped. shit, the plant traps the carbon, that's what the freakin charcoal was made from. lets take a lesson here mr. 10th grade science. what products are made when you COMBUST wood? CO2(g) and H2O(g)... right? ok, so when the reaction (combustion) stops, what ran out, the carbon that was burning or the O2? the carbon was used. so when it is extinguished, there MUST be carbon left. so what i don't get is why you are telling me my char is not "activated" by "trapping carbon". how can I NOT have CARBON trapped in my WHOLE CHARCOAL, which was made from a TREE that takes in CARBON from gas form and uses it to GROW the shit the CHAR was made from?

from this link-
"Biochar is not the same as activated carbon, which is a compound used for purifying liquids and gases due to its high absorption capacity. Biochar would need to go through an activation step, which is too expensive for land application purposes. Because of the widely varying feedstocks and processing practices utilized, it is important to understand that all biochar will not be alike. "

https://pubs.ext.vt.edu/442/442-311/442-311_pdf.pdf

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I now understand, youre thinking you can just bury something with a lot of carbon and expect it to be released by the rhizosphere..This would take FOREVER as the coal would essentially have to be broken down completely for the carbon to be released. Even so, you're not getting nearly enough carbon to make it worth it

Here's the easiest quickest source I can give you. Go to production and educate your self

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biochar

MistaRasta said:

I now understand, youre thinking you can just bury something with a lot of carbon and expect it to be released by the rhizosphere..This would take FOREVER as the coal would essentially have to be broken down completely for the carbon to be released. Even so, you're not getting nearly enough carbon to make it worth it

Here's the easiest quickest source I can give you. Go to production and educate your self

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biochar

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LMAO wikipedia? wiki = not the most reliable source; it's just a pile of information and never has been allowed to be used in my academic citations yet. but it's the best you can do, makes sense to me actually. and even still just to humor you, not that i didn't skim through it the first time i saw the link when you slammed me, i read through it and it mentions nothing about what you're saying about "activated carbon" for agriculture. STILL, "activated" carbon is a product which you don't even have or know the technology to make, according to what i've read so far. it's used for purification, not agriculture.

Why are you talking about RELEASING CARBON by the rhizosphere? "released by the rhizosphere" doesn't even make literal sense, because what does the root zone have to do with releasing carbon from biochar? there is no release of carbon in the soil. carbon chunks can exist in soils for thousands of years before eroding. i think you have your processes of weathering and erosion confused.

not to mention, you then refer to the biochar as "coal" which is not the same product; coal = fossil fuel formed over thousands of years of heat and/or pressure, biochar = product made from incomplete combustion, usually pyrolysis which is how my char was made, of an ORGANIC mass, which organic is defined as containing carbon molecules. why do you think fossil fuels are so important (and still there)? there is no releasing of carbon in the soil. they're storage forms of energy, TRAPPED (not being released) until we MINE the shit and BURN (combustion releases carbon in CO2 gas form) it.

let's do a recap here....

MistaRasta said:

I know exactly how bio char works.. You on the other hand, don't...

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.

clearly you have proved with your words that you do not understand biochar. nor do you know the correct information that defines the types of char there are.

MistaRasta said:

do some more research before you go try your unorthodox method please. It's people like you who don't do enough research, fuck up something simple and then blame it all on "Organics".

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do you use this approach to all new users to organics? it's very effective. you should be a teacher. you did not do the research (except on wikipedia) and had NO information to give out. Yet, you slammed me anyway.

MistaRasta said:

I don't have sources as I haven't researched bio char in a few years. And don't really give two shits about it

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you have proven this for sure. no sources, or info. to SHARE. thought we were sharing here, not slamming people.

MistaRasta said:

Basically what makes it "bio" char is the fact that you light it up, let it burn almost all the way up and suffocate it right before leaving a nice porous product.. Doing this you're releasing the carbon which in turn makes everything work. It's not going to charge if it's not activated..

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this right here, sums up your misunderstanding of the process of making biochar. the porosity of the char occurs whether or not your burn it and suffocate it, or use pyrolysis in a sealed chamber. pyro, latin for heat; lysis, latin for loosen or breakdown (of cells in the wood in this case). and i love your "bio" emphasis. bio is latin, referring to life when used in words; char is english word to blacken... so "bio" "char" is blackened life! what makes it "biochar" is that fact that it was living and was blackened. "releasing carbon" is what you DONT want to happen. you WANT the carbon. that what makes the stuff work, right?

MistaRasta said:

because all the help I've tried to give you obviously shows no bearing..

Good luck

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yeah you were no help to me other than motivating me to find the difference between biochar and activated carbon! which i will say, yes there is a difference, you were right about THAT. but you were incorrect about using "activated carbon" for agricultural purposes AND you DO NOT ACHIEVE activated carbon from a fire pit.

however some good came out of this, because now EVERYONE can know the difference between biochar and activated carbon, and that the word "charge" should only be used when referring to biochar, and "activate" should only be used with reference to activated carbon, which has no bearing in agricultural purposes because it costs too much to make. i promise, no grow store is selling "activated carbon" because of how expensive the process is to make, according the sources (real sources) i've read claim . they're selling biochar which has been "activated" or more correctly "charged" and are misusing the term "activate".

MistaRasta said:

I noticed the trend of incorporating fish bone meal into soils as a guano alternative. I like the basic mix the most. It gives me the best growth rates without having to deal with any lock outs or anything like that.

I was using alfalfa but I noticed my plants didnt like it. Too much nitrogen I guess

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don't really see the relation for FBM and guano, one is VERY water soluble and short term, and the other is the opposite.
I use the bejesus out of alfalfa meal, and fresh alfalfa in my compost pile, I use it if I can't source enough grass clippings.
Alfalfa really isn't that high in nitrogen, especially considering it's release rate.
Oh, and by the way, the best charge for biochar is urine.

ShLUbY said:

go buy a bag of cowboy charcoal. measure out how much biochar you would like in your soil and put the charcoal in a sheet and smash it up with a hammer. take the char and add it to a 5 gal bucket, add RO or non chlorinated water and fill so the level of liquid is more than the char. add alfalfa meal, fishbone meal, kelp meal, fish hydrolysate whatever source of nitrogen you like and bubble with air stones for 2 weeks. then add EWC and BSM and make a compost tea essentially with the char in there. after 24-48 more hours your char is charged and ready to use.

Edit: you can also just put the biochar pieces in with your compost pile, and by the time the compost is ready the biochar should be charged.

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What exactly iw cowboy chArcoal? Is this something you can buy @ Home Depot for example?

i dont know what big box store will have it, but i get mine at meijer here in MI. any kind of all natural hardwood charcoal that is still in its original form is good to go. you should be able to locate some

So can I use the lava rock they sell at Canadian Tire? I know it will be large pieces but they can be broken with a hammer to make them smaller.