The Choice I Never Made...

"People who harbor strong convictions without evidence belong at the margins of our societies, not in our halls of power. The only thing we should respect in a person’s faith is his desire for a better life in this world; we need never have respected his certainty that one awaits him in the next."
— Sam Harris

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."
— Carl Sagan


"It would be possible to describe everything scientifically, but it would make no sense; it would be without meaning, as if you described a Beethoven symphony as a variation of wave pressure."
— Albert Einstein


"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the universe."
— Albert Einstein


"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts."
— Albert Einstein

I used to favor the likes of a Superman like figure, especially the scene of him out in space looking and listening in on the people of earth, but Gumby!!! ..lmao

I'm not judging though

Luger187 said:

for some reason, ive always envisioned god looking like gumby. i have no idea why lol
here he is with pegasus

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Brazko said:

I used to favor the likes of a Superman like figure, especially the scene of him out in space looking and listening in on the people of earth, but Gumby!!! ..lmao

I'm not judging though

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hahaha supermans a good one. i was never even a big fan of the gumby show or anything. i just always imagined god being a big purple gumby-like figure. hes not really any type of animal(usually god is portrayed as human for some reason), and he has an unusual shape

Luger187 said:

hahaha supermans a good one. i was never even a big fan of the gumby show or anything. i just always imagined god being a big purple gumby-like figure. hes not really any type of animal(usually god is portrayed as human for some reason), and he has an unusual shape

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Well that actually makes sense and I can understand how you could imagine that.

Actually that's a better piece of creative thought process than mine..

I was just shown the light-You never chose God chose for you
Both sides are arguing as God wants so it perfect.

Padawanbater2 said:

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails? In other words, why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

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Failure is an important part of progress. In addition, if we're referring to Jehovah here, The Old Testament is full of examples as to why he's far from perfect. Jealousy, Wrath, Vanity are but a few of his constantly recurring vices.

A perfect being has no need to progress. That question was mainly directed at beardo and his assumption that God is perfect.

Indeed, if perfection entails failure, we have lost the meaning of the word and have no way to distinguish between destiny and randomness. But I think Karri0n's point is that God, by his own admission, is not perfect. So Beardo must not pay attention to his own religious teachings, or else he worships someone other than Jehovah. Personally I think it's pretty clear that Beardo puts no thought into his comments beyond how much grief they can cause; a trait Im sure God appreciates.

Padawanbater2 said:

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails? In other words, why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

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Failure and success are both relitive-And without failure how would we define success if someone wasn't doing worse and better how would you gauge your achievements? And what to you looks like failure for someone else might feel like success- To us a skunk smells bad but he's doing his job and a skunk is every bit as perfect as a rose. God is perfect in that it's his way or the highway.

why dont we make religion only available to grown ups over the age of 18 at least then its there decision , you could show id to prove you are 18 and able to acept fictional beliefs.....................after all they say you should be 18 to drink alcohol wich disturbs your brain the same way religion does .

ThE sAtIvA hIgH said:

why dont we make religion only available to grown ups over the age of 18 at least then its there decision , you could show id to prove you are 18 and able to acept fictional beliefs.....................after all they say you should be 18 to drink alcohol wich disturbs your brain the same way religion does .

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A church I've been to didn't allow you if you were under 18 or did not have a parental consent form. I'm not sure who "we" is, but the reason you can't create a religion is because, as evidenced by the importance you place on "weed women n cars", any form of religion or spiritual practice that you came up with would be wholly detrimental to any of its followers.

Padawanbater2 said:

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails? In other words, why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

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I know this was directed at Beardo, but I wish to answer the question scientifically speaking without regards to a deity.

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails?

Evolution


why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

Failure does not exist, Just as Perfection does not exist, Just as Time does not exist..

They are relative concepts....

I see it's easy for you to name all that is imperfect....

Could you describe for me the existence of a Perfect Person and Why they are Perfect?

If one such exists........

And you better not say Jesus..

Brazko said:

I know this was directed at Beardo, but I wish to answer the question scientifically speaking without regards to a deity.

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails?

Evolution


why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

Failure does not exist, Just as Perfection does not exist, Just as Time does not exist..

They are relative concepts....

I see it's easy for you to name all that is imperfect....

Could you describe for me the existence of a Perfect Person and Why they are Perfect?

If one such exists........

And you better not say Jesus..

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Perfection was a concept introduced by beardo, and in the context of god. If anything, I think Pad was making the same point, perfection is relative and does not really exist. I saw him ask why the assumption of perfection was being made. I did not see him list "all that is imperfect". So you have taken his point purposely out of context and then subtly accused him of a negatively skewed view. How does him describing a perfect person expand on any points?

Heisenberg said:

Perfection was a concept introduced by beardo, and in the context of god. If anything, I think Pad was making the same point, perfection is relative and does not really exist. I saw him ask why the assumption of perfection was being made. I did not see him list "all that is imperfect". So you have taken his point purposely out of context and then subtly accused him of a negatively skewed view. How does him describing a perfect person expand on any points?

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No, I haven't skewed it Heis. I will go back and find it where he describes all the imperfectness of humans being born disfigured etc... 1 moment pls

How does him describing a perfect person expand on any points?

He didn't state it right then but that was/is his defense to Why/how does God then create these imperfect humans if he is perfect.

But my post was geared as I said to nothing in regards to a deity...

I've sifted through the most recent and was not able to find it, but if my memory holds correct he has made that statment repeatedly. I would ask you to simply ask him if he has used that defense analogy. I'm actually about to watch the fight right now so doing a research in regards to what I was implying him to think about as to some things he previously said wasn't on the intenirary for me to do now.

I will at a later time if he denies saying it or doesn't recall using those analogies to why does God create imperfect beings when someone mentions God being perfect. So my point was if he does understands the concept of perfection that shouldn't be a defense.

That also seemed the point Beardo was making as well in the context of perfect being the conflicting views works in a perfect system

beardo said:

I was just shown the light-You never chose God chose for you
Both sides are arguing as God wants so it perfect.

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but it was skewed into the question

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails? In other words, why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

Both were using the context of the Word relatively, but God/god always seem to cloud peoples understanding. I understood exactly what he was saying.

If he denies it and I cannot find the many quotes from the past he made towards them then my memory has simply failed me. I should then apologize for saying that he has said that before.

It's really no big deal. I'm not perfect

Brazko said:

I know this was directed at Beardo, but I wish to answer the question scientifically speaking without regards to a deity.

What kind of "perfect system" is one in which the vast majority of it's creation fails?

Evolution


why would a "perfect being" design a system to fail?

Failure does not exist, Just as Perfection does not exist, Just as Time does not exist..

They are relative concepts....

I see it's easy for you to name all that is imperfect....

Could you describe for me the existence of a Perfect Person and Why they are Perfect?

If one such exists........

And you better not say Jesus..

Click to expand...

This idea of relative concepts was what I was touching on earlier when I was talking about how God is real, and also on the metaphor about how a skunk is perfect and how God and heaven are real if you believe in them.
https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/449547-lets-debate-23.html

Ok, Zab got his ass whooped!!

beardo said:

This idea of relative concepts was what I was touching on earlier when I was talking about how God is real, and also on the metaphor about how a skunk is perfect and how God and heaven are real if you believe in them.
https://www.rollitup.org/spirituality-sexuality-philosophy/449547-lets-debate-23.html

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I followed your meaning exactly, understood it before and after you clarified it. But evertyime someone mentions God/god being perfect he uses the no elbows, 4 arms, etc.. of why does he create these imperfect beings.

My question to him primarily didn't involve inserting a deity as a means for me to defend but for him to describe who/what perfect person exists outside of those imperfect qualities. Who/What was to be the standard of a Perfect Person?

But the question was bound in his previous wordings, quotes, and the assumed knowledge as to what I was referring.

Heis statements appear true but they are irrelevant to what I was saying/speaking about as the question was directed at Pad..

You are doing a good job at debating already, I don't think they want none of you.

That lets debate thread lasted about as long as this fight did...

Heis, has given me some homework to do so I'll let you handle it....

Hopefully, I'll get to copy somebody's work instead

Here is one instance where a poster was using the relative context of the word and Pad obviously knows the difference in the subjectivity of the word "perfection" but chooses to ignore the poster using the word in the same manner and begins to explain the Subjectivity of the word.

He also uses examples of flawed/imperfections of Humans to enforce his meaning as to why the person who used the word "God/god" with "Perfection" in the sentence is wrong as they didn't understand the word "Perfection" but they used the word in the same sense of relatedness. The same thing he did with Beardo, while ignoring his true point and meaning while inserting his take of how the word should relate to God.

Padawanbater2 said:

That isn't the definition of 'perfect'. What you seem to be doing is taking words and ascribing your own personal definition to them, then calling it a day..

First, perfection is 100% subjective. "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder", similarly, perfection is as well.

What about our 'design' flaws? If humans were perfect, why would we have these?

-humans with glasses (eyes, clearly imperfect)
-hearing aids (ears, imperfect)
-pace makers (heart, imperfect)
-diseases
-baldness
-ego
-apendix
-midgets are perfect to you?

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In all effect, my point was that even with all the things he claim imperfect, there is nobody on Earth that would hold to the word "Perfect/Perfection" regardless of whatever trait they may seem to not be deficient of.

What was the "Perfect" neanderthal man?

If he understands the concept of "Perfect" then stop assigning the context of everyone elses concept to mean something else. They are speaking relatively. But wait I haven't got to the no elbows, 3 arms, etc... and maybe not tonite but Its a recurring defense he makes to people claiming God/god is perfect, as if they cannot conceive or understand Perfection in it's relative meaning...

edit: now don't get me wrong because I understand that there are some people that do literally think "God" is perfect and its the Devils doing as to why any or such imperfections took place. However, a person of intellect should be able to decipher the difference at the moment when speaking to that person in regards of the words meaning. There was nothing confusing to me that Beardo wasn't speaking in a relative sense..

A word shouldn't be so traumatic as to boggle and confuse your senses of understanding..

That's All