The Democratic Divide

T

ThickStemz

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
as a contractor, i would not work for someone who has declared multiple bankruptcies. that check will not be good.
Click to expand...
Let's talk about those bankruptcies.

The first one was on a primary company of his that he was in control of. He can be blamed for that.

The second was a hotel he had recently purchased. He bought it with the intent to put it into bankruptcy.

The thrird and fourth were both his Atlantic City casino. The fact that the gaming industry has been suffering, combined with these were just businesses with his name on it for publicity purposes would excuse him from blame. They were simply companies where he was a figure head, and didn't even get a salary for being the CEO.

None of his bankruptcies were the chapter 13 kind, only chapter 11. They were laws designed to restructure the debt payments.

So that's really no criticism of Trump at all considering how many companies he runs that have not firlef bankruptcy. You took.
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
So I think this election cycle has highlighted something important on the democratic side I'd like to discuss; the clear divide between Hillary Clinton's campaign and Bernie Sanders Campaign, with a primary focus on policy positions and issues and how each camp's supporters have behaved throughout.

I think Sanders represents traditionally progressive positions; universal healthcare, universal college, campaign finance reform & much stronger regulation of the financial industry while Clinton represents more moderate positions; Individual mandate, not universal, single payer healthcare, doesn't support universal college, doesn't support reinstating Glass-Steagall, etc. Judging by the primary election results, this assessment would seem to be somewhat accurate since Clinton dominated the south and most of the eastern seaboard while Sanders made substantial gains in the midwest and northwest with a possibility of reeling in the west coast on June 7.


To Clinton supporters, do you believe Sanders positions are too far left? Are they unrealistic and you believe he wouldn't be able to get anything done? Why would you side with the more moderate democrat over the more progressive democrat? Don't you align more with progressive ideals?
Click to expand...
One wonders where Clinton would be, if not for Sanders pulling her..wait for it..to the left:shock:
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
Great original post, @Padawanbater2 !

My position is that from all I've seen of what Mrs Clinton says and has supported throughout her long political career, that she simply isn't a progressive/traditional democrat/liberal in any meaningful way, and never has been.

Since I feel like I have an extremely liberal perspective by comparison to the current political climate, I'm going with the leading candidate who most closely matches my outlook- but really, much more than that; Bernie Sanders says he's going to take on the big banks, reinstate Glass-Steagall, raise taxes on the wealthy and restrict the power of corporations to bribe our government to do their bidding in so many ways.

All of this is much overdue. If it isn't done, we'll get more of this current economic malaise, where the country has a nasty strain, sucking the life out of it right thru the new aristocratic class. Or worse; depression and war, like we've seen before- well, our grandparents did.

Gates isn't a lot different from Cornelius Vanderbilt was. The Koch smokers aren't much different from Rockefeller. They were- and their families remain- America's aristocratic class, helped along by a tax structure that allows them to keep their money and pay less tax than those earning mere wages. This is quite simply robbery of our nation's future by stealing the engine of wealth and putting it in the hands of trust fund babies... who grow up to recognize that they enjoy a life without work yet with ultimate privilege.

Our Founding Father's forebears sailed under canvas on wooden boats across an ocean as daunting to them as interplanetary travel is to us today TO GET AWAY FROM ARISTOCRACY AND BUILD A NATION OF EQUALS.

NO ONE should get a free ride on taxes. Capital gains SHOULD BE higher than tax on wages, so it stays at work, helping build our country. Instead, it slops around chasing one financial chimera after another... creating artificial financial instability and economic crashes over and again.

So why am I talking about dead people and sailboats? Because history will repeat itself every chance it gets. We as a nation have been here before and we need only ask members of the Greatest Generation- quick! Before they're all gone!- about the trials of the Crash of '29 and the Great Depression and what the shared prosperity and widely distributed massive economic growth of the egalitarian 50s and 60s meant to them.

Even the minimum wage argument fails to address the real travesty of corporate CEOs who bomb at their jobs, yet not only get sent packing with millions in retirement money- but are actually hired again?

Why is it okay that a trust fund baby can fail high school but get into Harvard anyway, wreck his Ferrari but not have to get a job, be a useless lout his whole life- and STILL end up better off than the hard working son or daughter of a middle class family who pays his bills, his dues, his car payment and yet gets kicked out of the same company 3 months before his retirement account is vested? What the fuck is fair about that? Why are we whining about who deserves minimum wage in the face of THAT?

So I'm a Bernie Sandernista. Because history will have its say, and it speaks right when everyone is most deaf to it.

I've been ahead of my time for a long time now.
Click to expand...
Bravo..Standing Ovation:clap:

A little story:

Back in 2001, I decided to no longer have a home phone using my cell as primary.

My manager at the time made this statement:

'So when you are at home you're working and when you're working you're at home?'

His quip was meant to belittle me.

I've been a true visionary all my life and told him same..that one day no one will be using land lines it will become a thing of the past.

About six months later I was reading a tech mag and sure enough, there was an article about exactly what I was doing.

I gave him that article.

Don't ever be deterred by someone and their lame comments.

For we are 'the crazy ones', Tty:

 
Last edited:
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
One wonders where Clinton would be, if not for Sanders pulling her..wait for it..to the left:shock:
Click to expand...
But it's just lip service. There's no obligation for her to live up to any of it once she enters office. Those who paid her off get access and the rest of us get the shaft.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
schuylaar said:
Bravo..Standing Ovation:clap:

A little story:

Back in 2001, I decided to no longer have a home phone using my cell as primary.

My manager at the time made this statement:

'So when you are at home you're working and when you're working you're at home?'

His quip was meant to belittle me.

I've been a true visionary all my life and told him same..that one day no one will be using land lines it will become a thing of the past.

About six months later I was reading a tech mag and sure enough, there was an article about exactly what I was doing.

I gave him that article.

Don't ever be deterred by someone and their lame comments.

For we are 'the crazy ones', Tty:

Click to expand...
I'm crazy enough to think that we don't need the Demublicans or the Republicrats to tell us we need another of their choices.

The vote is OURS, to do with as we see fit. The @ChesusRices of the world will fawn at their facades of respectability and choices, but what's happened instead has been a complete hollowing out of our political system in favor of 'he who has the gold'.

Therefore, I suggest we vote for someone WE feel is the best one for the job, and not just at the top but all the way down the ticket, everywhere.

Otherwise we'll get more of the same system that's been parasitising our nation and our future.

He'll say, 'but Chump!' I say at least I voted for the one I want. Everyone else can, too.

Nowhere in the constitution does it say we're required to vote democrat or republican. Anywhere...
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
ThickStemz said:
Let's talk about those bankruptcies.

The first one was on a primary company of his that he was in control of. He can be blamed for that.

The second was a hotel he had recently purchased. He bought it with the intent to put it into bankruptcy.

The thrird and fourth were both his Atlantic City casino. The fact that the gaming industry has been suffering, combined with these were just businesses with his name on it for publicity purposes would excuse him from blame. They were simply companies where he was a figure head, and didn't even get a salary for being the CEO.

None of his bankruptcies were the chapter 13 kind, only chapter 11. They were laws designed to restructure the debt payments.

So that's really no criticism of Trump at all considering how many companies he runs that have not firlef bankruptcy. You took.
Click to expand...
and in all 4 cases, i don't get a check unless i chase it through the court system. even then, i might not be far enough up in line to get paid.

why would you trust a man whose idea of good business is not to pay you?

i guess you'll figure these things out if you ever stop taking gigs making subway sandwiches, or cold calling to set appointments at a timeshare cal center.
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
I'm crazy enough to think that we don't need the Demublicans or the Republicrats to tell us we need another of their choices.

The vote is OURS, to do with as we see fit. The @ChesusRices of the world will fawn at their facades of respectability and choices, but what's happened instead has been a complete hollowing out of our political system in favor of 'he who has the gold'.

Therefore, I suggest we vote for someone WE feel is the best one for the job, and not just at the top but all the way down the ticket, everywhere.

Otherwise we'll get more of the same system that's been parasitising our nation and our future.

He'll say, 'but Chump!' I say at least I voted for the one I want. Everyone else can, too.

Nowhere in the constitution does it say we're required to vote democrat or republican. Anywhere...
Click to expand...
Sanders chose to run as a democrat.
Why?
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
But it's just lip service. There's no obligation for her to live up to any of it once she enters office. Those who paid her off get access and the rest of us get the shaft.
Click to expand...
Precisely.

Any of these revisions to her original platform are prefaced with 'try'.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
and in all 4 cases, i don't get a check unless i chase it through the court system. even then, i might not be far enough up in line to get paid.

why would you trust a man whose idea of good business is not to pay you?

i guess you'll figure these things out if you ever stop taking gigs making subway sandwiches, or cold calling to set appointments at a timeshare cal center.
Click to expand...
Quick question; what's your policy on customers who pay cash up front?
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
Quick question; what's your policy on customers who pay cash up front?
Click to expand...
no such policy exists.

most of my work is subcontracted through a major replacement window company. they handle all the contracts for financing and payment. most jobs are financed and i just need to collect a signature once work is complete. some are cash upon completion.

when i do my own gigs, i put together a detailed estimate down to the penny. i buy all materials up front and provide all labor with no up front cost tot he customer. payment is only collected once work is completed to customer satisfaction.

i never ask for cash up front. shady contractors of the past have given that practice too bad of a rep.
 
T

ThickStemz

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
and in all 4 cases, i don't get a check unless i chase it through the court system. even then, i might not be far enough up in line to get paid.

why would you trust a man whose idea of good business is not to pay you?

i guess you'll figure these things out if you ever stop taking gigs making subway sandwiches, or cold calling to set appointments at a timeshare cal center.
Click to expand...
Sure you would. You obviously don't know a Damn thing about the different types of bankruptcy laws.

You might have to wait. But as you're a small potato, and the company files for very large debts, you're likely to get paid on schedule for washing the Windows.
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
ThickStemz said:
Sure you would. You obviously don't know a Damn thing about the different types of bankruptcy laws.

You might have to wait. But as you're a small potato, and the company files for very large debts, you're likely to get paid on schedule for washing the Windows.
Click to expand...
why are you trying to pretend you are a lawyer or have any idea how contractors get paid?

you dropped out of law school to do heroin and steal from your parents, and you have never worked as an independent contractor ever.
 
T

ThickStemz

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
why are you trying to pretend you are a lawyer or have any idea how contractors get paid?

you dropped out of law school to do heroin and steal from your parents, and you have never worked as an independent contractor ever.
Click to expand...
Wtf... I've never been to law school.

But I do have some experience with the different bankruptcy laws, because my college degree was in business, finance.

Chapter 13 is we're broke, shutting down, sell our shit and pay our debts.

Chapter 11 is we've gotten into a tight spot and need some help, but we're still profitable over our operating expenses.

Chapter 11 keeps the business open and running and paying its employees. It also pays its small debts. It typically is a result of some major debt. The court can then do any number of things. But the business stays open and satisfies its obligations. It's essentially a renegotiation of the debt. Perhaps the lendor can become part owner.

Trumps casino filed chapter 11 most recently because of an 80 million dollar payment due on bonds. It didnt have the 80 mill liying around. Trump also wasn't even the majority share holder. He owned something like 20 to 30 percent and his name was on the building for its recognition. He didn't control that business.
 
Rob Roy

Rob Roy

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
But it's just lip service. There's no obligation for her to live up to any of it once she enters office. Those who paid her off get access and the rest of us get the shaft.
Click to expand...

Do you really think if Bernie gets into office, he's going to put any kind of a dent in the military industrial system, foreign intervention and occupation, Pentagon budget, etc. ?

That's a serious question.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top