The "I don't starve my plants before harvest" thread

[rocknratm]

Declining environmental factors can also help a plant along into senescence, the act of retrieving stored compounds and shedding their leaves in fall.

Also, flushing is not obligatory for this to happen, as you can simply lower your feeding schedule, or start watering with plain water during ripening (without necessarily creating massive runoff aka "flushing") The plant will eventually stop taking up Nitrogen on it's own, it's got plenty of reserves in it's leaves you want to start using up. If you time it right, you should have no yield or quality robbing deficiencies.

Another discussion point could be chelated highly soluble synthetic nutrients that aren't organically synthesized, having large amounts of these molecules in the water solution compared to natural micro-ecosystems in the rhizosphere could significantly affect taste.

But really, it's all in the cure.

fuck... where do I start? I think I posted in page one havent read most of this and have 100 million things to say!

Afta, this is at you. I would like to think ur statement is correct about flushing removing chlorophyl earlier rather than during cure. I doubt that either flushing or curing could ALONE get rid of all chlorophyl, but a combonation of each (or instead of flushing just cutting back on nutes towards the end) would have the desired effect. Just hypothesizing.
Do you have any scientific data or any factual claim made by a respected source?
Again sorry if u posted it already, havent read the whole thread

 

[rocknratm]

Declining environmental factors can also help a plant along into senescence, the act of retrieving stored compounds and shedding their leaves in fall.

Also, flushing is not obligatory for this to happen, as you can simply lower your feeding schedule, or start watering with plain water during ripening (without necessarily creating massive runoff aka "flushing") The plant will eventually stop taking up Nitrogen on it's own, it's got plenty of reserves in it's leaves you want to start using up. If you time it right, you should have no yield or quality robbing deficiencies.

Another discussion point could be chelated highly soluble synthetic nutrients that aren't organically synthesized, having large amounts of these molecules in the water solution compared to natural micro-ecosystems in the rhizosphere could significantly affect taste.

But really, it's all in the cure.

I would say alot of people, me included, use "flushing" in the sense of using only water (ph'd no nutes) for the last 1-2 weeks, with the basic minimum runoff each time.

 

[rocknratm]

Im am fucking sick of these arguments. There are legit reasons a flush would be necessary, and excess (usually alot of it) can cause chemically tasting weed. I just got the grow bible by cervantes to go along with my one by green (both great).
"how to tell when fertilizer will affect taste:
1. leaf tips and fringes are burnt
2. leaves are brittle at harvest
3. buds crackle when burning
4. buds smell like chemicals
5. buds taste like fertilizer"
On page 76 it says "ten to fourteen days before harvest, flush the garden with distilled water or water treated with reverse osmosis"

Im not saying it is always needed, but certainly sometimes is.
Tell me Cervantes is wrong people. Cmon

I havent read fact about chlorophyl getting lushed out tho... ill look doubt ill find anything. Ive been in these books with a tiny comb.

 

[Harrekin]

I havent read fact about chlorophyl getting lushed out tho... ill look doubt ill find anything. Ive been in these books with a tiny comb.

Again I replied to your Cervantes comment already, he copies other peoples info into his book and makes no effort to hide it...therefore if his source is incorrect his book will be incorrect. Just cos someone collects information from multiple sources and puts it in a book doesn't make them an expert anyways tho.

Again I'll say it for the millionth time, flushing rids the plant of nothing, it merely translocates (mobile) chemical elements from the leaves to the flowers to ensure the seeds survive. For example yellowing leaves means N is being translocated from the leaves (sink) to the flowers (drain).

And fertiliser isn't "used up"...the only things a plant "gives off" are O2, C02 and a small quantity of water vapour. N (for example) being an element, not a compound, cannot be divided smaller than N, it's merely moved from one place to another when flushing happens...therefore if anything you are encouraging chemical elements INTO the buds FROM the leaves by flushing.

What makes plants burn badly, taste harsh, burn your throat, etc is a magical substance called C6 H12 O6 which is not broken down if you dry too quickly.

Chlorophyll doesn't taste all that bad, it has a slight minty taste, not the "chemical" taste some describe so its not the chlorophyll.

 

[cues]

God this is getting boring. We should call RIU the 'Flushing Argument' site.

 

[SirLancelot]

I've been googleing and googleing leaching/flushing for improved taste with no luck. Every time I run across some plant that has been tested they say that MANY factors including nutrients wether organic or synthetic have a play in the outcome of taste. but I can't find ANYWHERE about flushing soil to rinse out the chemicals inside a plant... Prolly because that doesn't happen and doesn't even seem probable. We all agree that salt builds up in the soil as the info below stats. AGREED. But the idea of dumping heaping amounts of water into your soil to "rinse" the chemicals out of buds is just rediculous, Please someone provide some credible information on why this theory is still believed! Im just wanting to make sure I didn't miss something somewhere.

[h=2]Definition of Leaching[/h]

• Leaching refers to the process by which chemicals, nutrients and other soluble matter in soil are dissolved by excess water and washed away.
  
  

[h=2]Leaching and Soil[/h]

• Leaching of soil occurs naturally and is part of the process of soil formation. When soil becomes saturated with rainwater, water travels downward, into groundwater or into springs and eventually rivers, lakes and streams. In the process, substances such as iron, aluminum, calcium and organic matter are carried deep into the soil or washed away altogether.
  
  

[h=2]Leaching Potted Plants[/h]

• Leaching is a beneficial technique for washing excess salts and fertilizers from the soil of potted plants. When you apply fertilizer repeatedly to potted plants, salts from the fertilizer build up in the soil and can burn plant roots. You can sometimes see a ring of salt on the outside of clay pots or around the top of the soil. The College of Agriculture & Life Sciences at the University of Arizona recommends leaching potted plants every four to six months to prevent salts from accumulating. To leach a potted plant, pour approximately twice the amount of water as the pot can hold on the top of the soil and let it drain completely.
  
  

[h=2]Nitrogen and Water Pollution[/h]

• Leaching becomes a problem when pesticides and fertilizers from the soil are leached into water supplies. The leaching of nitrogen is of particular concern. Nitrogen, an important plant nutrient, occurs naturally in soil as a result of decomposing plant and animal matter and as a result of soil amendments such as animal manure and nitrogen fertilizers. During times of heavy rainfall, nitrogen is converted into nitrate, a mobile form of nitrogen which moves easily with the flow of water. When nitrate is leached into groundwater and streams, it becomes potentially harmful to pregnant animals and their young. When it enters private wells and water supplies, nitrate poses a threat to humans---especially babies less than 1 year of age. According to the University of Missouri Extension, nitrate poisoning in infants causes internal suffocation or "blue baby syndrome."
  
  

[h=2]Organic Farming and Leaching[/h]

• Organic farming methods can be helpful in reducing the amount of pesticides and nitrogen leached into water supplies. The USDA National Institute of Food and Agriculture reports that, in a study by Washington State University, nitrogen leaching was four to five times greater in trees fertilized using synthetic fertilizers than those fertilized using organic methods. Some ways you can reduce harmful soil leaching are by increasing the organic content of your soil, using natural slow-release fertilizers, and avoiding the use of pesticides whenever possible.
  
  

Read more: What Is the Meaning of Leaching? | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/about_6570144_meaning-leaching_.html#ixzz1hD5D5HbE

I don't know how credible Ehow.com is (lol) but I imagine it's not too far off. If someone has a better link to info please, by all means share. ​

 

[k0ijn]

I would say alot of people, me included, use "flushing" in the sense of using only water (ph'd no nutes) for the last 1-2 weeks, with the basic minimum runoff each time.

That is exactly what I said to Gastanker, that he has a different view of flushing than many people on this forum do.
I'm not saying I believe in the pre-harvest flushing method (what most people on this forum think the word 'flushing' means).

Leaching is useful as an error correcting measure and a good way to clear a salt buildup, in both soil and hydro.

 

[k0ijn]

@SirLancelot:

The information you provided about leaching seems to be credible.

• 
  

  • The College of Agriculture & Life Sciences at the University of Arizona recommends leaching potted plants every four to six months to prevent salts from accumulating.

  ​

  
  
  ​

4-6 months might be a tight variable, I know some people who grow in soil who leach their pots (in their windows) ever other month.
But they might just be over reaching trying not to harm their plants.

 

[SirLancelot]

right, I read that about every 4months or so. and completely agree with it being an error correcting measure. I don't leach just because I figure My plants are only in pots like 3-4mo max and after that the soil isn't re-used so I can't imagine too much salt build up plus I keep the mindset of under feeding is better than overfeeding. BUt even with this information it doesn't make sense how flushing in the last weeks (pre-harvest flushing) would make any sense. Ok yea it cleans the salts out of soil that can cause problems with roots but other than that it's just rinsing soil.

 

[Joedank]

@lance- the leaching of the soil is Supposed to make the plant use the salts stored in the vacuole of the cell it was not until recently studies have been published claiming the vacuole can hold other things like carbs and complexes of aminos...
Thus disputing the "vacuole full of salt thorium "

 

[Samwell Seed Well]

@lance- the leaching of the soil is Supposed to make the plant use the salts stored in the vacuole of the cell it was not until recently studies have been published claiming the vacuole can hold other things like carbs and complexes of aminos...
Thus disputing the "vacuole full of salt thorium "

so does this research suggest that leaching or flushing does have an effect on a harvested plant

 

[Harrekin]

so does this research suggest that leaching or flushing does have an effect on a harvested plant

It means it doesn't have an effect.

 

[Brick Top]

right, I read that about every 4months or so. and completely agree with it being an error correcting measure. I don't leach just because I figure My plants are only in pots like 3-4mo max and after that the soil isn't re-used so I can't imagine too much salt build up plus I keep the mindset of under feeding is better than overfeeding.

Your not overfeeding statement and not leaching or flushing at some point mid-growth due to the short period of time your plants are growing made me think of something worth mentioning even though it is not about pre-harvest flushing.

Many growers will feed their plants heavily while they are in vegetative growth. If they do not flush before going into flower they are at a higher risk of their plants developing "the claw.' Even though they switch to flowering nutrients and their plants are then receiving less nitrogen in each feeding, there is a good chance there is a nitrogen buildup in the soil. When that is combined with the lesser amount then being given the result can be nitrogen toxicity which destroys the plants vascular system, which is permanent damage, resulting in 'the claw.'

 

[SirLancelot]

@ Brick Top good call brother! I think I've seen this when A buddy made his own soil mix they had claws for like the longest time into flower...

 

[Brick Top]

@ Brick Top good call brother! I think I've seen this when A buddy made his own soil mix they had claws for like the longest time into flower...

'The Claw' will usually show up shortly after plants go into flower, like in a week to three weeks. It is the combined flowering nutes and the built up vegging nutes in soil, the nitrogen in each actually, that does it. Right when the plant is switching to needing less it instead receives an increase over what it was getting in veg. The buildup won't last all that long. Between what is taken in by the plants and leached out when watered it normally won't last all that long unless there was a tremendous buildup, like if someone overfed bad enough to burn their plants a few times in veg and didn't flush the soil, but by then the vascular damage is done and if it is more than minor there is no coming back from it. Minor damage won't repair itself but the plant can still do well even with it. But if there is major damage, then you have trouble, right here in River City.

 

[Harrekin]

I just smoked an unflushed bud that's partially dry and no bad taste, it's burning perfect and white ash... Any of the flushers care to explain? Just curious why mine don't need flushing but so many others claim to NEED it.

 

[wbd]

I just smoked an unflushed bud that's partially dry and no bad taste, it's burning perfect and white ash... Any of the flushers care to explain? Just curious why mine don't need flushing but so many others claim to NEED it.

Well hell, no need to cure it either I guess! Since it's already so yummy...

 

[rocknratm]

I just smoked an unflushed bud that's partially dry and no bad taste, it's burning perfect and white ash... Any of the flushers care to explain? Just curious why mine don't need flushing but so many others claim to NEED it.

your one experience proves it, no question, there could be no difference between your results and anyone elses.....
uh, not.

 

[KushDog]

I just smoked an unflushed bud that's partially dry and no bad taste, it's burning perfect and white ash... Any of the flushers care to explain? Just curious why mine don't need flushing but so many others claim to NEED it.

well if it worked for you, everyone should not flush, you proved us flushers wrong

 

[bigv1976]

I just smoked an unflushed bud that's partially dry and no bad taste, it's burning perfect and white ash... Any of the flushers care to explain? Just curious why mine don't need flushing but so many others claim to NEED it.

I think you are full of shit. No partially dried bud is gonna burn good regardless of if it is flushed or not. Spread some more bullshit because the thousands of posts on here that are full of bullshit arent enough.