The use of bloom boosters/additives

I've read a fair bit into this and seen some arguments on either side. As facts are often out dated or just not facts I thought I'd post here to get some general opinion.

As far as I've read most recent articles agree that high P through out flower is bad, after it has been rammed into feeds for what looked like years. http://www.royalqueenseeds.com/blog-why-you-should-not-use-grow-boosters-or-extra-nutrients-n94


Then it appeared a general shift in opinion took place where most articles or in the know growers reflected that ''all you need is base nutrient of appropriate npk''.

I then stumbled on this article http://www.grozine.com/2014/09/23/bloom-boosters/ and a few like it. He seems to consider the lower need for constant P but also talks about lowering base nuets when using bloom boosters at the appropriate bloom phases to compensate ppm jumps.

Theirs a clusterfuck of info out there on many different topics to do with all things growing. It is usualy extreme views that one thing is so wrong or another thing is so right. I was more interest in the second link as it seemed to be one of compromise. But, interested in other views from you guys. What experiences have you had with them. Did you see real improvement and never looked back, did you suffer lock outs, was it grower error of using too much or at the wrong time, did you every try low dosages only or is it out right bad practice to use boosters, etc.

Not to be disrespectful but I am mostly interested in the views from those who have ample experience of growing both with and with ought as you hopefully have the most applicable insight. But all views welcome.

You're gonna get the same back and forth arguments here. There are a ton of debated topics like this defoliation, flushing, 48 hrs dark before chop and on and on. The only way to know is to try it yourself. I used them for a few years, I don't anymore didn't see any difference except in my wallet. I will say I never did side by side with clones or any scientific studies, but am of the belief the more shit you dump into your plants the better the chance of fucking them up with excess and unneeded nutes. I grow with the K.I.S.S. method and don't try to reinvent the wheel.

This is one of those religious topics. The best thing to do is try it with/without. The biggest risk of the "booster" mentality is not being aware of the NPK *ratio* you are creating by adding a high-PK product to your ordinary fertilizer.

For example, one person might be feeding an NPK ratio 1-1-1 and say 1/4tsp/gal of a "booster" really helped. That might have given them a reasonable 1-1.5-1.5 ratio.

But, someone else might be using a boutique multi-bottle "lineup" which is already near 1-2-2. They read "oh, 1/4 tsp of Dirty Sanchez works wonders?" They add 1/2 tsp (thinking more is better) and now they're at a crispy 1-4-3 ratio.

Another risk is abruptly switching to a "bloom" nutrient, going too high (PK) too fast.

So, the first thing is to know your ratios. Blend things together to get the NPK ratio you want. Vary it to see what works best for your style. I use this spreadsheet. And, my ratios are in my signature.

ive had best luck with a good balanced NPK profile like the 9-3-6 offered by dynagro FP,Bloom boosters always seem to bring issues with them,anything extra the plant doesnt need is going to be a problem in the form of salt buildup and PH fluctuations.Stick with a balanced NPK ratio that promotes healthy plant growth and the buds will naturally follow.Unless your plant is PERFECTLY healthy on a balanced NPK profile,dont worry about additives.Get the plant healthy with no toxicities or deficiencies,then worry about experimentation if you like.

Resinhound said:

ive had best luck with a good balanced NPK profile like the 9-3-6 offered by dynagro FP,Bloom boosters always seem to bring issues with them,anything extra the plant doesnt need is going to be a problem in the form of salt buildup and PH fluctuations.Stick with a balanced NPK ratio that promotes healthy plant growth and the buds will naturally follow.Unless your plant is PERFECTLY healthy on a balanced NPK profile,dont worry about additives.Get the plant healthy with no toxicities or deficiencies,then worry about experimentation if you like.

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And there it is - The 3-1-2 ratio of nutrition that seems to work the best for canna.. Anything with a 3-1-2 ratio that you can use fractions of like a 1/4 of a 24-8-16 and add more if need be is far better then shit like H&G that makes a brick of your soil and cooking your plants - even at lowering dose's.....Minor bumps of P in the last 4 to 2 weeks may or may not be a benefit.....you know those over priced PK monsters - forget those.

I use FF beasty bloomz 0-50-30.

Once during week 4 of flower. Once during week 5.

Since I've been using it, I've always had great results.

I've also used the FF lineup, Open Sesame, Beastie blooms, & cha ching. They all seem to do their job well. I've recently switched to BluePlanet Elite. It comes with 2 flower additives... EarlyBloomer 1-3-3 & Liquid Blue 2-4-10. So far it seems like a great nutrient lineup but im yet to see these additives put to the test. Just applied the Early bloomer in the last feeding.

I currently use base nutrient http://www.dutch-headshop.com/extra_info/plagron-terra-bloom_en.pdf

I also have a range of plant life powder additives passed from a friend who does not grow now.

Bud start
carbo blast
ton o bud
The heavies (now called bud boom)
http://ghedirect.co.uk/nutrients-and-additives/?subcats=Y&features_hash=V203

None of this looks like good ratios. Or I was at least hoping to get away with 1/4 strength on the powders and half strength on the base neut. Next time I will get items form the same range that also have a optimal npk. I'd be happy to only use 3/4 strength bloom and just the carbo blast and possibly an overdrive type additive if the base npk was better.

That ton o bud+bud boom seem like over kill. Ton o bud is to be used when you first see flowers or are established. It does not say if it's just a once time use (for example bud start specifies a two time use on my container). If it is continues from then on out it will over lap with the heavies that are to be used in the last 3 weeks.

Flowki said:

None of this looks like good ratios..

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You don't need a lot of bottles. Some people use NPK ratio 1-1-1 all the way through. (I'm doing that right now with inexpensive MiracleGrow Tomato.). From what I've seen, fine tuning the NPK ratios adds a little improvement. It's nothing phenomenal if you've already learned to grow a plant at a particular ratio. (It's a diminishing return.).

That plagron doesn't sound like a bad ratio. (1-1-2) for a base. Add some fish emulsion to raise N in veg. Add some bat guano to raise P in flower.

You just don't need the cartoonish "lineups." Just some basic fertilizers. I like dry fertilizers because there's no point paying for water to be shipped and stocked on shelves. My Grow More Sea Grow costs about $1 (US) per plant, per grow.

Jack's Classic is similar (but doesn't have the organic sources of nutrient contained in Sea Grow. I try to lean toward organic, but not exclusively. I like the immediacy of synthetic.).

az2000 said:

You don't need a lot of bottles. Some people use NPK ratio 1-1-1 all the way through. (I'm doing that right now with inexpensive MiracleGrow Tomato.). From what I've seen, fine tuning the NPK ratios adds a little improvement. It's nothing phenomenal if you've already learned to grow a plant at a particular ratio. (It's a diminishing return.).

That plagron doesn't sound like a bad ratio. (1-1-2) for a base. Add some fish emulsion to raise N in veg. Add some bat guano to raise P in flower.

You just don't need the cartoonish "lineups." Just some basic fertilizers. I like dry fertilizers because there's no point paying for water to be shipped and stocked on shelves. My Grow More Sea Grow costs about $1 (US) per plant, per grow.

Jack's Classic is similar (but doesn't have the organic sources of nutrient contained in Sea Grow. I try to lean toward organic, but not exclusively. I like the immediacy of synthetic.).

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The plagron grow I also use and is 3-1-3 I believe so hopefully that's a good ratio too?. But yeah, I'd like to narrow things down to just base veg/bloom and only a few supplements like enzyme etc with a possible overdrive toward the end of flower. I do see the appeal in all these extra additives but to be frank I only care for the most beneficial (not that I know what they are as of yet). A 15% improvement for a huge head ache in counting extra ppm or ph drops etc etc from multiple extra additives is not worth it to me. A 10% improvement from adding only the most beneficial powder would be (if that is the case). Well, hence the reasoning for asking what other people have used and found beneficial or not.

I'm still trying to get around to using your spread sheet but I'm not too smart ;/. Is a ppm meter worth the investment?. If I can't get the npk right at-least stay in ppm range I guess.

KryptoBud said:

You're gonna get the same back and forth arguments here. There are a ton of debated topics like this defoliation, flushing, 48 hrs dark before chop and on and o

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You're missing the point of this thread...

Flowki said:

The plagron grow I also use and is 3-1-3 I believe so hopefully that's a good ratio too?.

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Yes, that sounds good. I don't go that high N in veg. But, lots of people do. You can mix it and the 1-1-2 to get something in between, say in transition to flower. You just enter the details from your two bottles into the spreadsheet, then play with amounts of each to see the NPK ratio.

Flowki said:

Is a ppm meter worth the investment?. If I can't get the npk right at-least stay in ppm range I guess.

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I think a PPM meter is extremely useful. Especially for measuring runoff ppms and detecting an impending salt-buildup condition (feeding too much and/or not enough runoff).

Sativied said:

You're missing the point of this thread...

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what is the point of the thread

KryptoBud said:

what is the point of the thread

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Exactly what you predicted, "get[ting] the same back and forth arguments here."

When someone starts another defoliation thread and another bloom booster/additives thread...

Sativied said:

Exactly what you predicted, "get[ting] the same back and forth arguments here."

When someone starts another defoliation thread and another bloom booster/additives thread...

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Flowki said:

I've read a fair bit into this and seen some arguments on either side. As facts are often out dated or just not facts I thought I'd post here to get some general opinion.

Not to be disrespectful but I am mostly interested in the views from those who have ample experience of growing both with and with ought as you hopefully have the most applicable insight. But all views welcome.

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I'm not following you. OP asked for opinion and insight on using/not using pk boosters. Isn' that what he got?

az2000 said:

Yes, that sounds good. I don't go that high N in veg. But, lots of people do. You can mix it and the 1-1-2 to get something in between, say in transition to flower. You just enter the details from your two bottles into the spreadsheet, then play with amounts of each to see the NPK ratio.

I think a PPM meter is extremely useful. Especially for measuring runoff ppms and detecting an impending salt-buildup condition (feeding too much and/or not enough runoff).

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Ok thnx for the help, why do you avoid high N in veg?.

az2000 said:

PPM

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I'm likely going to experiment with both.

4 plants I'll build upto using 3/4 strength bloom after transition.

The other 4 I'll use something along the lines of 1/4 to 1/2 base neut and 1/4 strength on the boosters during their phases. Assuming I can comprehend and use your spread sheet.

I'll admit the more I read on all this the more I understand that ''bloom enhancers'' will force you to drop the base neut so much that you are simply compensating for that base drop with the boosters. In other words smoke and screen by those producing this stuff, or so it seems.

The only thing I do find interesting is that some of the boosters have things like mag and carb in them and who knows what else. I assume base neuts don't cover that or they don't label it for what ever reason. For as much as that's worth.

If both feed routines have similar ppm and one set does 20% better I guess it's a no brainer. If they both sets do roughly the same give or take then it's clearly not worth the extra money and time of catering to the powder schedules.

No, you should be adding your booster to your base nutes.

Bloom booster should only be used twice for an entire grow. It's best recommended to do it right smack dab in the middle of flower. Week 5 and 6 of flower, you should be hitting your plants hard with nutes and gradually backing down as you go into week 7 and 8.

I use either dry koolbloom or grotek monster dry but in my own special diluted recipe. Day 1, week 2,3,4,5,6,7, flush on a 10 week and flush at 6 on a 9 week.

Greenthumbs21 said:

I use either dry koolbloom or grotek monster dry but in my own special diluted recipe. Day 1, week 2,3,4,5,6,7, flush on a 10 week and flush at 6 on a 9 week.

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Where do all these "flushing" fools come from?

Son, flushing is an old school hippie MYTH! That is still carried on by those who write books and magazine columns. The only ones who write books and don't say to "final flush" are those writers that actually have schooling in botany or horticulture!

Don't be fooled! Flushing does nothing to improve the taste or the burn. All that comes from a proper long dry and cure!

In reality, your only removing nutrition from your plant at one of it's most critical times! Do not attempt to come back and argue with "logic" as science trumps logic 100% of the time!