Understanding and Calculating Nutrient PPM

JHake · Jun 18, 2020

Always good to give this thread another read.
I have a question regarding NPK ratios and labeling.

GH FLora Bloom is 0-5-4 with P2O5 and K2O.
0-2,15-3,3 is the with elemental P and K.

Do you think of this nutrient as:
0-5-4 = 0-1,25-1 ratio
or
0-2-3 = 0-1-1,5 ratio
?

2com · Jul 20, 2020

@Renfro
Hey,

When it comes to the elemental ppm ratios, the ratios of the elements in the nutrient profile to one another, where is this information coming from? For example N:K, or Ca:Mg, or K:Ca, etc.
In the spreadsheet, you put a few ratio calculation boxes in the results page. Where do these come from? And how many of them are there (like is there one for say N:Mg as well), which ones antagonize/interact with others and what recommended ratios are. I could see medium making a difference.
There's one in the sheet for Ca : P, which I don't think I've heard of before.

Thanks.

And could you share your profile? I'm curious. You use GH flora, right? I don't remember if you posted your elemental profile.

Edit: Added something.

Renfro · Jul 20, 2020

You can add as many ratio calcs to the spreadsheet as you want.

Renfro · Jul 20, 2020

2com · Jul 20, 2020

Renfro said:
View attachment 4630530

You can add as many ratio calcs to the spreadsheet as you want.

I know, I meant to say which ratios are even "a thing" (a known relationship that must be kept in some balance/ratio). It's the ratio of elemental ppms I'm looking for. Eg: Common suggested ratios of Ca:Mg ratios of 2:1 or 3:1, or your suggestions/examples (in the annotations) from the sheet of say "1.5:1" for Ca

.

Looking at some other charts similar to the second one now too.

Phat J · Jul 20, 2020

Something like this might be what you are looking for?http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm

StackPath

mad_jet · Jul 21, 2020

Thanks Renfro!!! Super helpful post. Cleared up a few things for sure.

2com · Jul 23, 2020

2com said:
I know, I meant to say which ratios are even "a thing" (a known relationship that must be kept in some balance/ratio). It's the ratio of elemental ppms I'm looking for. Eg: Common suggested ratios of Ca:Mg ratios of 2:1 or 3:1, or your suggestions/examples (in the annotations) from the sheet of say "1.5:1" for Ca.

Looking at some other charts similar to the second one now too.

That stupid smiley is supposed to be "Ca to P" ratio.

Phat J said:
Something like this might be what you are looking for?http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/fourtwenty/articles/profiles.htm

StackPath

I know about it. Not sure if you mean use the profiles there and reduce to ratios, or just sharing that site.
Not really what I'm looking for, but thank you.

Kassiopeija · Jul 27, 2020

CloudHidden said:
Been recently looking into Si. It seems like the Amour Si (Potassium Silicate) I've been using is basically doing me no good - coco/perlite DTW. It's my understanding that it takes at lease weeks for microbes to break down Potassium Silicate to become plant available. That's not happening in my case.

I found Power Si, which they try and make sound all mysterious, but it just monosilicic acid @George2324. Problem is, like so many nute companies, they are charging a fortune for their special sauce - $250 per liter. So fuck that. Am currently looking for another source for monosilicic acid. If anyone knows of one please let me know!

George2324 said:
As I explained above monosilic acid is just sio2 dissolved in water.

Silicium Dioxide is basically sand, and not very water-soluble, and it further cannot be uptaken by plants roots. Only a very minor fraction of SiO2 is converted to SiOH4... I wonder how/if the SiO2 from various products is even plant available in a hydro scenario?

TintEastwood · Jul 27, 2020

Kassiopeija said:
Silicium Dioxide is basically sand, and not very water-soluble, and it further cannot be uptaken by plants roots. Only a very minor fraction of SiO2 is converted to SiOH4... I wonder how/if the SiO2 from various products is even plant available in a hydro scenario?

Interesting....

Silica Additive Quality | Manic Botanix

Silica additive quality in hydroponics. The quality of a silica additive – cost versus Si concentration – is determined by the percentage of PAS in any given SI product.

medteknutrients.com.au

I use Armor Si.

Mixing silica....tricky.

Silica In Hydroponics | Manic Botanix

Silica and Hydroponics For myself, I do not see silica as a beneficial additive but, more so, as a must (an essential element) in any balanced/optimized nutrient regime. Silica (Si) is the second most…

medteknutrients.com.au

Kassiopeija · Jul 27, 2020

TintEastwood said:
Interesting....

Silica Additive Quality | Manic Botanix

Silica additive quality in hydroponics. The quality of a silica additive – cost versus Si concentration – is determined by the percentage of PAS in any given SI product.

medteknutrients.com.au

I use Armor Si.

Mixing silica....tricky.

Silica In Hydroponics | Manic Botanix

Silica and Hydroponics For myself, I do not see silica as a beneficial additive but, more so, as a must (an essential element) in any balanced/optimized nutrient regime. Silica (Si) is the second most…

medteknutrients.com.au

thanks, if you can run this through google translate

Monokieselsäure

www.lichtblick-frankfurt.de

edit:
to add to the link, they make an example with rice (oryza sativa) there - which is a plant that *essentially* needs Si (in waterculture), and it can metabolize Si to a much greater extend than Cannabis can. Cannabis is actually at the very low end of Si-metabolizing and I actually wonder if certain products do make sense (in soil)...

Renfro · Jul 27, 2020

2com said:
1mL = 1g

Water. 1mL of water = 1 gram = 1 cubic centimeter.

This is why we use SG numbers...

Renfro · Sep 23, 2020

Just tossing the latest version up here, the schedule feature hasn't had any work done on it but more products were added. I need to work on that schedule feature but I have been busy and just haven't been motivated to mess with it.

Cabrone · Nov 3, 2020

@Renfro, I'm wondering what calcium nitrate you used for the chart. If using the calculator "tool" with jacks cal-nit @ 15% nitrogen and 18% calcium, I get different numbers? I love this calculator, and just want to know if I'm doing something wrong or did I find a glitch? Thank you for all your efforts with this. This is way easier for me to use than hydro buddy.

Renfro · Nov 4, 2020

Cabrone said:
@Renfro, I'm wondering what calcium nitrate you used for the chart. If using the calculator "tool" with jacks cal-nit @ 15% nitrogen and 18% calcium, I get different numbers? I love this calculator, and just want to know if I'm doing something wrong or did I find a glitch? Thank you for all your efforts with this. This is way easier for me to use than hydro buddy.

If I remember correctly we discussed this earlier in the thread and came to the conclusion that different calcium nitrates had different proportions. It is easy to add a new product and input the values for your cal nitrate.

Hollatchaboy · Nov 4, 2020

Renfro said:
Just for reference here are the PPM values for GH products that I use. This compares the elemental PPM to the observed EC PPM @ 0.5 conversion when adding 1mL to 1 Gallon.

View attachment 4388536

Hey Renfro, do you use gh products exclusively? Or do you switch it up?

Cabrone · Nov 4, 2020

Makes perfect sense, different product. Thats what I thought, just making sure I didn't do something wrong.

Hollatchaboy · Nov 4, 2020

f series said:
I don't grow hydro, but all renfro info is worthy

Isn't that the truth! Lol... the guys a genius!

Renfro · Nov 4, 2020

Hollatchaboy said:
Hey Renfro, do you use gh products exclusively?

Pretty much yes. I am giving the Chem-Gro 4-20-39 stuff a try since it's super cheap and I can just drive to the manufacturer and pick some up. No shipping and dry nutes really saves a ton of money. Of course it's only a savings if the yields and quality don't drop off so we shall see. I really hope I like it because damn it's cheap, doing the math it comes to $1.13 to mix up 100 gallons with a little extra epsom salt for coco (2 grams 4-20-39, 2 grams cal nitrate and 2 grams epsom per gallon).

Hollatchaboy · Nov 5, 2020

rustyshaclkferd said:
No, i got confused definitely talking to myself

Renfro said:
Pretty much yes. I am giving the Chem-Gro 4-20-39 stuff a try since it's super cheap and I can just drive to the manufacturer and pick some up. No shipping and dry nutes really saves a ton of money. Of course it's only a savings if the yields and quality don't drop off so we shall see. I really hope I like it because damn it's cheap, doing the math it comes to $1.13 to mix up 100 gallons with a little extra epsom salt for coco (2 grams 4-20-39, 2 grams cal nitrate and 2 grams epsom per gallon).

Do you use the Lucas formula then?

Understanding and Calculating Nutrient PPM

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