USA - Probably the most ****ed up country on earth

You are confused between country and govt. WE the People, are not. WE run our Country and WE are the govt.

See, why don't you just read about it and not guess? You are speaking about Parliaments. In Parliament, the entire "govt" is kicked out and re-formed on a whim. The People are not involved. The Constitution can be changed and the People are not involved.

WE don't do that. So say what you will, it is you that are confused. And Aus, will be next to form a Federal Republic.

That is why we sound similar. Self Rule talk.

I can't really understand what you're talking about Doer. wtf are you saying? Make sense... you speak English, yes yes? seriously. PROPER LITERACY PLEASE!!

tokeprep said:

I think whistle blowers must be prepared to go to jail when they choose not to use official channels to voice their grievances. How else can we expect any state secrets to be protected? If you say that any government employee or contractor who has concerns about a program is justified in leaking vast quantities of information about it, nothing is going to be a secret, and that's dangerous for all of us.

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Why is it dangerous? The world isn't really a dangerous place is it? Not In the country that I live in at least. I mean? I feel perfectly safe to walk outside and stroll around the country. As long as I don't walk under a truck or bus OBVIOUSLY.
what is this DANGER you speak of?

Snowden apparently did try to use official channels but he was told to ignore the "problem". Didn't you know?

Of course, it doesn't make sense to you. Even when I explain it in baby doll language it still won't help you.

Its hilarious yet sad at the same time how (mainly Americans and Australians) get so confused between "country" and "government".

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Hey hang on there champ no need to bring aussies into it. The worst thing we've done is give you leyton Hewitt COME ON!! !!!!

Highlowazupkush said:

Why is it dangerous? The world isn't really a dangerous place is it? Not In the country that I live in at least. I mean? I feel perfectly safe to walk outside and stroll around the country. As long as I don't walk under a truck or bus OBVIOUSLY.
what is this DANGER you speak of?

Snowden apparently did try to use official channels but he was told to ignore the "problem". Didn't you know?

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When you had a bunch of Nazi running around brutalizing women and young boys was that dangerous seeming?

How about when the Red Bear rolled in? Brutalized the young boys and women. No danger there? Chechnya? Jihad immigration? Danger?

If we push our head up our ass far enough we can see no danger.

Are you talking about the world wars, doer? shit, wasn't that like, 100 years ago or something? aren't most people from that time dead now? wtf you on about boy? Make some sense for crying out loud

*BUDS said:

Hey hang on there champ no need to bring aussies into it. The worst thing we've done is give you leyton Hewitt COME ON!!

!!!!

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yea ok, but come on, they say the same thing in Australia (or at least I have heard them say it on tv there when I lived there) "un-Australian". I don't know if people still say it or not, but when they did, they used it in the same way. that way basically being at the wrong time!

for example "its un-Australian not to eat meat on Australia day". That's a pretty bad example, but technically that is also pretty dumb from where I'm standing! What if you're sick and can't eat meat for a whole month? Are you suddenly Un-Australian? I don't think so.

sorry if i missed it on a previous page, i am too lazy to read it all
mr 5% polish guy who always has so much to say, did you work out which countries you like yet ?

Highlowazupkush said:

Its hilarious yet sad at the same time how (mainly Americans and Australians) get so confused between "country" and "government".

When the topic of discussion is of a countries government, and criticisms are made, usually those two groups of people always think that the criticisms against the government reflect attitude and opinion towards country and the people of that country. In other words, I lol very often when I see or hear people say that a certain something is "anti American".

"Oh, that bitch is anti American because of her attitude when talking about American government issues! She's clearly spreading propaganda". "She's clearly racist because she is reporting on news that puts American government in a bad light".

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I'm not suffering from any such confusion. When I said "anti-American" I didn't mean anything about the people, I meant the government. All of the shows criticisms are about the American government, so I'm not sure how you could have thought I meant anything else.

I never said she was racist or that she disliked Americans. I said she was pathologically opposed to the United States government (so long as that's the viewpoint typed into the teleprompter).

Oh yes! Lets all look at the Crimes committed by American government in a POSITIVE way! as not to be so "ANTI AMERICAN" because if we are TOO Anti American, it will not be fair now, will it?
Or perhaps in order to balance things out and make things fair, lets also point the finger at the Opposing side, Because of course if American government commits crimes, then the opposing side must also because like, Duh, that's just fact, No body is better than the yanks! like der! Greatest country in the WOOORLD mate.

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You can construct a damning indictment of the United States without resorting to hyperbole, distortion, and silliness. That's not the purpose of this Russian government program, though. Obviously the purpose is to say fuck you.

If people are fair, logical, and reasonable in their criticisms, arguments, and claims, I'm not going to call them anti-American. If they're consistently spouting bullshit and pathologically opposed to the American government, yeah, they may be anti-American.

Disseminating factual information and asking questions is one thing; spinning your own warped and inaccurate narrative is entirely another.

Another idiot cannon fodder that thinks there is an end to conflict.

If we push our head up our ass far enough we can see no danger.

tokeprep said:

I'm not suffering from any such confusion. When I said "anti-American" I didn't mean anything about the people, I meant the government. All of the shows criticisms are about the American government, so I'm not sure how you could have thought I meant anything else.

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You are suffering from terminal confusion if you think this. There is no govt here. It is self rule. It is a sissy view, imo, to blame the US govt. It is us.

Highlowazupkush said:

Why is it dangerous? The world isn't really a dangerous place is it? Not In the country that I live in at least. I mean? I feel perfectly safe to walk outside and stroll around the country. As long as I don't walk under a truck or bus OBVIOUSLY.
what is this DANGER you speak of?

Snowden apparently did try to use official channels but he was told to ignore the "problem". Didn't you know?

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If the United States were building a nuclear weapon that is illegal under a treaty, a whistle blower wouldn't need to leak the plans for the bomb to the public to blow the lid on what was going on. Perhaps this one exposure was not particularly dangerous, because I think people generally assumed that the government was already collecting all of this information somehow (a few years ago people were claiming that the NSA was intercepting domestic communications internationally to avoid constitutional limitations); nonetheless, what about other people with access to more significant things? If they're justified in leaking top secret information to the public, it's a never ending sea, and the danger potential is huge.

Terrorism? Instability in countries? Wars? Nuclear proliferation? Technological espionage? I can envision all kinds of danger from the wanton leaking of classified information by individuals who cannot be punished.

Doer said:

You are suffering from terminal confusion if you think this. There is no govt here. It is self rule. It is a sissy view, imo, to blame the US govt. It is us.

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Except there is a government, and it is not perfectly or truly representative of the people. Congressional elections have relatively low turnout of eligible voters, so our government is actually elected by a fraction of the people. Because of political games and gerrymandering, congressional districts have been carved up into bizarre patterns in order to keep certain people in office. Billions of dollars, countless man hours, and volumes of psychological research are deployed every election cycle to mislead, confuse, and distract people from facts, truth, and reality. The result is not a government built from the enlightened consideration of all the citizens of the United States, who are thus accountable for the actions of that government, which is what your idealistic vision of democracy presumes.

I think people generally recognize that populations are apathetic and subject to manipulation. I certainly don't think the Russian government is representative of the Russian people; Putin has kept himself in power by jailing his opponents, using state resources for his campaign efforts, and rebuilding the authoritarian structure of the Soviet state. The fact that they've permitted Putin to behave in that manner should not be construed as approval for his actions

Formally, I'll agree that apathy is approval, because choosing not to act suggests indifference. Substantively, apathy is not approval, because people tend to think they have excellent reasons for being indifferent. For example, I know people who don't vote because they say they don't understand the issues at all. In some cases, I'm very happy these people aren't voting, because I know they would be sheep. Regardless, you cannot say they approve of something they never pretended to understand in the first place.

Balzac89 said:

Teddy boy is a draft dodging pussy

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yup! pretty much a real American . . . a parasite . . . not all amercians act like the stereotypical American(quickest action to happy/easy button)

Doer said:

You are confused between country and govt. WE the People, are not. WE run our Country and WE are the govt. Self Rule talk.

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We the corporations?

skunkd0c said:

sorry if i missed it on a previous page, i am too lazy to read it all
mr 5% polish guy who always has so much to say, did you work out which countries you like yet ?

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Of course I know which countries I like, but I wont tell about all the places iv been to because that would be too much info.

tokeprep said:

I'm not suffering from any such confusion. When I said "anti-American" I didn't mean anything about the people, I meant the government. All of the shows criticisms are about the American government, so I'm not sure how you could have thought I meant anything else.

I never said she was racist or that she disliked Americans. I said she was pathologically opposed to the United States government (so long as that's the viewpoint typed into the teleprompter).



You can construct a damning indictment of the United States without resorting to hyperbole, distortion, and silliness. That's not the purpose of this Russian government program, though. Obviously the purpose is to say fuck you.

If people are fair, logical, and reasonable in their criticisms, arguments, and claims, I'm not going to call them anti-American. If they're consistently spouting bullshit and pathologically opposed to the American government, yeah, they may be anti-American.

Disseminating factual information and asking questions is one thing; spinning your own warped and inaccurate narrative is entirely another.

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They report news, then they add their own opinions. The news is not for impressionable children, its for grown ups who're able to distinguish between opinion and the story that has actually been reported. She is allowed to use as much hyperbole as she wants, because hyperbole doesn't change facts.

tokeprep said:

If the United States were building a nuclear weapon that is illegal under a treaty, a whistle blower wouldn't need to leak the plans for the bomb to the public to blow the lid on what was going on. Perhaps this one exposure was not particularly dangerous, because I think people generally assumed that the government was already collecting all of this information somehow (a few years ago people were claiming that the NSA was intercepting domestic communications internationally to avoid constitutional limitations); nonetheless, what about other people with access to more significant things? If they're justified in leaking top secret information to the public, it's a never ending sea, and the danger potential is huge.

Terrorism? Instability in countries? Wars? Nuclear proliferation? Technological espionage? I can envision all kinds of danger from the wanton leaking of classified information by individuals who cannot be punished.

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You're full of shit, because, do you know why? How does that old saying go "If you're not doing anything wrong, then you've got nothing to hide". Right?

It's not like the government should be overly worried about their personal privacy, they need to be more worried about doing their job correctly and to allow a large degree of transparency. Of course there will always be secrets, but unless you're doing something VERY bad, then you will most likely not worry too much if the secret is exposed. Terrorism? Instability? what fucking secret do you think will make people want to turn into terrorists? because the way that I see it, the fucking government shouldn't be fucking doing any thing that is so wrong that people will want to blow them the fuck up, get that into your head you overly patriotic yank, jeez, how brainwashed are you?

But go ahead, tell us all what YOU think is something that is ok by your standards for any government to keep secret from the people, which, if found out by the people, would cause people to be so angry that they will want to blow the government up.

tokeprep said:

Terrorism? Instability in countries? Wars? Nuclear proliferation? Technological espionage? I can envision all kinds of danger from the wanton leaking of classified information by individuals who cannot be punished.

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And we see that now with the executive branch regardless of party. Some leaks are okay, some are treason, it really does depend on who is doing the leaking...

Highlowazupkush said:

They report news, then they add their own opinions. The news is not for impressionable children, its for grown ups who're able to distinguish between opinion and the story that has actually been reported

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Do you really believe that? As you don't seem to able to put into practice distinguishing between fact and opinion...

echelon1k1 said:

you don't seem to able to put into practice distinguishing between fact and opinion...

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Oh yea? quote me. Where have I shown that I clearly cannot distinguish between fact and opinion.

Highlowazupkush said:

Of course I know which countries I like, but I wont tell about all the places iv been to because that would be too much info.

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it would be nice to hear something positive from you for a change
all the doom and gloom is very repetitive