Well, that didn't take long

dukeofbaja said:

I bet he still blames it on 'gotcha journalism' and the 'lamestream media'.

Again, everyone. I do not think Rand Paul is a racist. Don't say that I do, please.

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Would you like for someone on air to ask you 84 different ways why you are against private ownership rights? He'd kill the patriot act. He'd make it next to impossible to get warrants to search your property unless there was a mountain of evidence against you.

The government is not the solution to everything...they are the problem. They exploit, lie, cheat, steal and then steal more. Giving them more control, more power, more authority...it to everyone's detriment...always. This is historically true...globally.

One thing I think is weird and anti-Libertarian about Rand Paul is while he doesn't want to tell businesses they can't discriminate, he has no problem saying he would do everything in his power to PROHIBIT abortion.

Dragline said:

One thing I think is weird and anti-Libertarian about Rand Paul is while he doesn't want to tell businesses they can't discriminate, he has no problem saying he would do everything in his power to PROHIBIT abortion.

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the libertarian defense of anti-abortion laws comes from the perspective that an unborn child is a human being and no other human being has the right to take its life away, just as no human has the right to take away an adult's life. i'm not agreeing with this, but it does fit logically within libertarianism if you believe a fetus is a human.

desertrat said:

the libertarian defense of anti-abortion laws comes from the perspective that an unborn child is a human being and no other human being has the right to take its life away, just as no human has the right to take away an adult's life. i'm not agreeing with this, but it does fit logically within libertarianism if you believe a fetus is a human.

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Thats the Republican stance on Abortion. This is the Libertarian stance taken directly from the Libertarian party website.

1.4 Abortion

Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.

Dragline said:

Thats the Republican stance on Abortion. This is the Libertarian stance taken directly from the Libertarian party website.

1.4 Abortion

Recognizing that abortion is a sensitive issue and that people can hold good-faith views on all sides, we believe that government should be kept out of the matter, leaving the question to each person for their conscientious consideration.

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point taken. but there's a difference between the libertarian party and what is libertarian philosophy. if you hold libertarian political beliefs and believe a fetus is human then it is completely consistent to believe the government is exercising appropriate power by limiting abortion. the libertarian party position is a practical political choice that dodges the question in order to include the largest number of like-minded individuals on the core libertarian issues. if ninety percent of americans opposed abortion, i'd bet a harvest (my highest stakes ) that the libertarian platform would include the protection of unborn fetuses.

dukeofbaja said:

Rand Paul's position could be summarized as follows: I don't support racism or segregation, but I don't oppose the mechanisms that allow it.

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QFT
exactamundo.
i'd +rep if i could, but you don't have a star thing under your name.
weird.

desertrat said:

point taken. but there's a difference between the libertarian party and what is libertarian philosophy. if you hold libertarian political beliefs and believe a fetus is human then it is completely consistent to believe the government is exercising appropriate power by limiting abortion. the libertarian party position is a practical political choice that dodges the question in order to include the largest number of like-minded individuals on the core libertarian issues. if ninety percent of americans opposed abortion, i'd bet a harvest (my highest stakes ) that the libertarian platform would include the protection of unborn fetuses.

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But 90% of Americans don't oppose a womans right to choose. So Rand Paul saying as a politician he would do everything he can to prohibit abortion is not sticking with the Libertarian belief. It's sticking with his Republican belief. So as far as the original intent of this thread is concerned he could have easily just voiced an agreement with the civil rights act and businesses not practicing discrimination and being as that is a perfectly acceptable Republican stance the issue would have been dropped. Instead he starts talking about the government not having the right to be involved in anything and which that talk ends as soon as a womans right to choose is the issue. Picking and choosing where principles apply. Rand Paul is gonna make a great politician.

doctors that perform abortions are small businessmen....don't they have rights?

Dragline said:

But 90% of Americans don't oppose a woman's right to choose. So Rand Paul saying as a politician he would do everything he can to prohibit abortion is not sticking with the Libertarian belief. It's sticking with his Republican belief. So as far as the original intent of this thread is concerned he could have easily just voiced an agreement with the civil rights act and businesses not practicing discrimination and being as that is a perfectly acceptable Republican stance the issue would have been dropped. Instead he starts talking about the government not having the right to be involved in anything and which that talk ends as soon as a woman's right to choose is the issue. Picking and choosing where principles apply. Rand Paul is gonna make a great politician.

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so you want to slap him down for stating his opinion as honestly as he could? i tend to believe that political honesty is an oxymoron, but you seem to be going to great lengths to vilify his stated position. do you really want him to lie just to satisfy your own narrow view of the world? have we so polarized our politics that all views expressed by a candidate must adhere strictly to the party line?

y'all are searching so desperately for some hypocrisy in these statements that you aren't noticing the hypocrisy of your own. the only real link between abortion and civil rights is that government has managed to stick its nose into both issues, asserting federal supremacy over what should be a relatively simple matter for state regulation. paul's stance on both seems consistent with the ideals of individual liberty and personal responsibility. that the federal government should have any say in the operation of a private business and that it should sanction the death of one person at the hands of another are both against libertarian principles. you may twist the issue by claiming that a fetus is not a person or that society has some imaginary right to the services of the individual, but those opinions are not universally held. there is no basis for them in a strict interpretation of the constitution, they are merely the fantasies of the liberal establishment.

Damn! Did duke get banned too?