What Nutrients?

Im currently planning a grow and ive been researching everything possible that will help me on my way to beautiful plants!
However the only thing i havent been able to find is in depth knowledge about is what are the best nutrients to use and what cycles to use them in throught the different stages of plant growth. So;

1# what is the best brand of nutrients out there? (must be available in the UK)

2# What type of nutrients should i use throughout the diff stages of plant growth

3# What nutrient ratio's should i use during the 3 stages of plant growth?(Seedling/vegetative/flowering)

Ideally if anyone could give me a rough starters nutrient list or any links to one that would be great.
Cheers guys

use the canna range good results .
easy to use specially foe beginners.
canna vega for veg or the canna coco veg & bloom all in 1 a-b solution.
canna flores for flower or again just stick to the cana coco veg & bloom all in 1 a-b solution.
and theres like canna start for young plants an seedlings.
canna pk 13-14 an canna bio boost also good for flowering.
and they can all be found at hydro stores,
hydro stores on ebay but makes sure if using ebay get sent to different address an try using someone elses account.
hope this helped.

MR M3RKLEZz said:

use the canna range good results .
easy to use specially foe beginners.
canna vega for veg or the canna coco veg & bloom all in 1 a-b solution.
canna flores for flower or again just stick to the cana coco veg & bloom all in 1 a-b solution.
and theres like canna start for young plants an seedlings.
canna pk 13-14 an canna bio boost also good for flowering.
and they can all be found at hydro stores,
hydro stores on ebay but makes sure if using ebay get sent to different address an try using someone elses account.
hope this helped.

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Both good replies man, really helpful.

Brick top when you say first feeding , second feeding etc do you mean first watering, second watering, so add nutrients right frm the start and then everytime you water(up until flushing) or do you water when needed but only add nutrients say one in every 3 times you water the plant?

Also what strain and seeds seller do u guys recommned for the noob grower. bear in mind the end result must be a powerful one! (im looking for some thing quite strong with a reasonable/good yield. i did consider big bud but it seems you have to trade quality with quantity for that strain.)
nice one

McNulty said:

Im currently planning a grow and ive been researching everything possible that will help me on my way to beautiful plants!
However the only thing i havent been able to find is in depth knowledge about is what are the best nutrients to use and what cycles to use them in throught the different stages of plant growth. So;

1# what is the best brand of nutrients out there? (must be available in the UK)

2# What type of nutrients should i use throughout the diff stages of plant growth

3# What nutrient ratio's should i use during the 3 stages of plant growth?(Seedling/vegetative/flowering)

Ideally if anyone could give me a rough starters nutrient list or any links to one that would be great.
Cheers guys

Click to expand...

1# Canna

2# Use the feed chart as guidance if your just beggining. you will ALMOST ALWAYS want to use LESS than what the chart calls for. Everyone develops there own feed schedule. What works for one person may not be good for others. Most importantly, will you be using soil or hydro or coco or soilless mix? Depending on your method you will develop a working feeding formula, in other words the frequency of plain watering vs. feeding the plants etc. When growing in soil it will retain nutrients for prolonged periods of time, and will not respond immediately to feeding vs. hydro that will respond almost instantly and needs to be given a steady supply of nutrients because there is nothing to "hold" in hte nutrients. Some people believe in the 'feast and famine' theory, others lightly fertilize each time water is delivered to the plant. I find personally LESS IS ALMOST ALWAYS MORE, which you will find in experience, and to use the MINIMUM amount of base nutrients (npk+micros) as possible, and give a good flush at the end with clearex and you will get the most finished highest quality fruits.


3# If you want to know ratios i'd have to know your strain and method and container size, temps and humidity, co2 yes/no? etc.. but i can give you some general ideas:

You will need the following Canna nutrients products:
(they make 3 different versions for the veg A+B & flower A+B, soil/coco/hyrdo i beileve)
1. Veg A+B
2. Flower A+B
3. Rhizotonic
4. Cannazym
5. PK 13/14
6. Canna Boost

Will you be using a R/O machine? What is your water like? Depending on water conditions i would possibly reccomend getting a calmag supplement like Magical or Calmax or whatever. Canna is formulated for soft water but if your ppms are extremely low you will need to supplement the calcium and magnesium that is absent. On the flip side, if your ppms are extremely high and you are in a hardwater area i would reccomend getting a bottle of Clearex or even House & Garden drip clean to keep salts under control. One last thing, the Canna Boost is EXPENSIVE $100US/L but is GOOOOOD shit. It makes the plants ooze resin. its like pure sugar cane in the finest form the plants almost respond instantly to it. Good stuff.

Anyway,

Seedling
10mL/gallon Rhizotonic
How much Veg A+B you use TOTALLY depends on what system you are using.

Veg
5mL/gallon Rhizotonic
Again, depends -?- veg A+B
40mL/gallon cannazym

Flower
5mL/gallon Rhizo
Again, depends -?- FLOWER A+B
40mL/gallon cannazym
10mL/gallon cannaboost

There are different opinions on when and how much to use the PK 13/14. Be careful it is VERY powerful. Use once or twice when the buds begin to foxtail around the stem and are just beggining to seem like one large nug as oppose to a bunch of little small ones, just after growth stagnates and full flowering has begun. Lower your base ppms and DO NOT use larger doses or for more than a week. I forget exactly the dosage but i would say 2/3 strength of the reccomended dosage on the feeding chart would be MORE Than sufficient.

I have 2 last bits of advice. Alot of friends have recently switched to House and Garden Roots Excelurator as opposed to the Rhizotonic. I am wary because i donot know what exactly is in the rhizotonic and if they include any of the other things you need with the rhizotonic. Like humic and fulvic acids, any of the micro nutes etc. Dunno? I do know the Roots Excelurator produces SIGNIFICANTLY bigger rootballs than the Rhizo, but i still wonder ill lose any other important nutrients by switching? Something to look into if you have the time? Last bit of advice. If you are growing an strain advertised as an "8 week" finisher, let it go a full 9 weeks and begin flushing with clearex at the beggining or middle of week 8 giving it ATLEAST 10-14 days flush. You want your fruits to mature and fully finish. I used to think nuting them up full strength till the end would give me the ultimate big ass nugs. What ended up happening was i would burn my plants, and they would never finish and get that nice ripe look and flavor. By tapering the nutrient input slowly towards the end, and finally giving a thorough flush it really lets the plants fully finish get hard and resin covered and colorful and stinky and tasty and all the good shit. Good luck! Hope this helped a little. Post back with more info and we can maybe get into specifics.

I don't think many growers prefer it but I have good results with miracle grow products. Use the miracle grow gardening soil and it has some nutes in it. I usually add some at a few weeks. I always use the MG bloom booster during flowering.

Got#'sbutstillsmokeroache said:

I don't think many growers prefer it but I have good results with miracle grow products. Use the miracle grow gardening soil and it has some nutes in it. I usually add some at a few weeks. I always use the MG bloom booster during flowering.

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Puurrple that is some sound advice there, really really helpful.
i am unsure of the ppm in the water here but i will find out. I am right at the planning stage of this so it will bea few weeks before i start, im just trying to get everything sorted in my head so there are no issues that i am unsure of.
It will be in soil to start with and if it goes well then ill hopefully be able to get a decent hydro system cos they give better quality/yields.
Do you have any recommendations of what strain to try for noobs?
Once again thanks for the advice purple and subscribe to my thread as i have a feeling i will need your advice again when the time is right, but for now, WATCH THIS SPACE .

McNulty said:

Both good replies man, really helpful.

Brick top when you say first feeding , second feeding etc do you mean first watering, second watering, so add nutrients right frm the start and then everytime you water(up until flushing) or do you water when needed but only add nutrients say one in every 3 times you water the plant?

Also what strain and seeds seller do u guys recommned for the noob grower. bear in mind the end result must be a powerful one! (im looking for some thing quite strong with a reasonable/good yield. i did consider big bud but it seems you have to trade quality with quantity for that strain.)
nice one

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When I say first feeding I mean first feeding, not first watering … though restating that of course does not explain anything.
　
Seeds contain roughly three to five weeks of nutrients, depending on the strain, for a seedling to survive on so if possible someone should research the strain they are growing and find out what the earliest nutrient feeding time period from breaking the surface of the soil should be. Feeding earlier will burn and likely kill your babies and feeding late will leave them to starve for food for a while and that can cause anything from minor to major problems depending on how bad it gets.
　
Once the young plants/seedlings are ready to be fed nutrients for the first time that is what I referred to as the first feeding where I use a third strength mixture for vegging fertilizer/nutes and then the following/second feeding I increase it to a half strength and after that I go full throttle with each feeding right up until it is time to flush before harvest.

Your next question about seller and strain is half-easy to answer and the other half is almost impossible for me to answer.
　
When it comes to sellers, or seedbanks, Attitude Seeds is very good. They have a wide selection and for the most part their pricing is reasonable and their service is very reliable. Hemp Depot is another quality seedbank. Hemcy is another, though it does not seem to be very well known. The Single Seed Center is another seedbank you can rely on. Legends and PeakSeedsBC are also quality seedbanks.
　
When it comes to a strain that is something that each person really has to describe their likes and dislikes in detail if they really want a good accurate reply as to what to grow.

Normally people say I want potent killer dank herb and they also normally toss in that they want a yield that would overflow a dump truck.
　
But what do you really like? Do you like the clear soaring creative activity producing cerebral head high of a sativa the most or do you prefer to have your tail end glued to a couch and your mind numbed by a major body-stone indica that will give you a case of the munchies that will cause you to eat an entire cow and then follow that up with a half dozen burrito supremes and about two gallons of Pepsi or Coke or something? Maybe you want a cross of something that gives you a bit of one and a bit of the other?
　
The next question to ask yourself is what can you afford? You may want the best but can you afford something like the $800.00-plus price of say Doggies Nuts beans or is something like the $40.82 price for Greenhouse Seeds Train Wreck more in line with your budget?
　
We all want the very best of everything. Heck, I’d like to drill Keira Knightly and the Olsen twins, preferably all at the same time. Yes I do like to swing for the fence. But what I do is what everyone does and that is find the best I can and then make the most of it.
　
Something you might want to do is go to http://en.seedfinder.eu/ and the click on strain database. Then click on cup winner. Then look through the list and see what excites you. Then check out the seedbanks I mentioned above and see if they handle the product(s) that most appealed to you and see if they will fit into your budget.
　
If you have a modest budget one hint may be to look for past cup winners and those that placed second or third and then search for them at the various different seedbanks. Being that they are older now and some did not take top honors they are no longer the flavor of the month so their prices can be very reasonable.
　
Don’t fall for the misperception that the latest winners or latest releases have to be better than anything and everything older that won a cup or placed second or third.

Cup winners and ones that placed second and third are like Academy Award winners. It is not like this years Academy Award winner for best picture will be better than "Gone With the Wind" or "Casablanca" just because it won this years award. It only means it was considered to be the best of what was released this year.

Cup winners and placers are the same. There is no guarantee that they are any better, or even as good, as any previous years winner or those that placed. It only means of those that were entered in the present year’s competition they were chosen as the best.

You can find some real values for quality herb by looking for older strains that were very highly regarded in the past. It is not like their genetics have degraded just because they are not a new release.
　
Something else to keep in mind is if and when someone replies saying pick White Widow, pick Blueberry or some famous name strain ask them which breeder’s strain they are talking about. There are so very many knockoffs out there sold under the same name that just giving a name of a strain is almost useless to someone asking what is good.

There are something like 24 or 25 strains of White Widow alone, as of the last time I counted, and that does not include the original White Widow that was renamed Black Widow. So if someone says White Widow, or whatever, find out which breeder’s white Widow, or whatever strain name they suggest, that they are talking about because you may pick a different breeders strain/knockoff that is totally different than what they grew and you may end up very dissatisfied.
　
So decide what you like the most when it comes to high/stone and then consider your budget constraints, if there are any, and then research some and ask more questions and with a little luck you will make a wise purchase.
　
Sorry if that was not as helpful as you may have wished for, as in me just saying buy strain ‘X’ made by breeder ‘Z’ from ‘So and So Seedbank’ but far to many people rely on the likes and dislikes and tastes and opinions of others to decide for them what they themselves should grow and that is a big mistake for one to make.

Got#'sbutstillsmokeroache said:

I don't think many growers prefer it but I have good results with miracle grow products. Use the miracle grow gardening soil and it has some nutes in it. I usually add some at a few weeks. I always use the MG bloom booster during flowering.

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In the past I have used MG Bloom Booster and it does work. But like any chemical fertilizer it is much easier to burn your plants than with an organic or mostly organic fertilizer.
　
Consider this. The NPK of MG Bloom Booster is 15 – 30 – 15. Fox Farms Big Bloom is 0.01 – 0.3 – 0.7 and Fox Farms Tiger Bloom is 2 – 8 – 4. Now some may read that as say that Fox Farms stuff is weak and the MG is a much better way to go but with a 15 – 30 – 15 mix you do not need to be off much to burn the heck out of your plants so while it will work there is more of an inherent risk taken.
　
Also chemical fertilizers require more thorough flushing than organic and or mostly organic fertilizers do if you want the best tasting herb possible so that is something else to consider. It may be minor to some but it still should be factored into any decision about what ferts to use.

McNulty said:

Puurrple that is some sound advice there, really really helpful.
i am unsure of the ppm in the water here but i will find out. I am right at the planning stage of this so it will bea few weeks before i start, im just trying to get everything sorted in my head so there are no issues that i am unsure of.
It will be in soil to start with and if it goes well then ill hopefully be able to get a decent hydro system cos they give better quality/yields.
Do you have any recommendations of what strain to try for noobs?
Once again thanks for the advice purple and subscribe to my thread as i have a feeling i will need your advice again when the time is right, but for now, WATCH THIS SPACE .

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OK if your doing soil than i can really help you out because that is my expertise. Do yourself a big favor ok. GET FOX FARM OCEAN FOREST if it is available. Great stuff loaded with all the nutes you need to get you through the first few weeks. Let me know what soil you decide on, just make sure its no MG or time released shit because it is just hell, trust me. Get the Canna nutes and FF soil (if possible) and we'll make you up a feeding chart tailored to your plants.

Now, you asked for my reccomendations on strains. What are your goals? What is most important to you, yield, quality, time, etc? Me personally, i prefer growing short flowering indicas because the 12-14 week wait on true sativas is just mind-numbing slow and painful. I like rock hard nugs covered in crystals that finish completely in less than 9 weeks. That being said, i would check hempdepot.ca, they have a large selection and are VERY reliable and honest. Check the TGA genetics, alot of people i know are working with them now and experimenting. Querkle is pretty nice shit... has people going gaga around here. Purple Urkle x Space Queen (which is Romulan x c99). Pretty mean cross, nice purples, SLOW veg. Goto attitude seed bank. Anything from Serious, TGA, DNA, Sensi, Nirvana, Paradise or Greenhouse and you should do well. Jack Herer is my FAVORITE.. just buy Jack, Querkle, White berry, and a Super Silver Haze from Greenhouse and you will have the best genetics from the four corners of the earth. Holler

Once again lads thank you for the fountain of knowledge. i cant be arsed to right a full response now as its late but tommro il give the 100% low down on what soil (perlite?),lighting, what type of effect etc just thought a quick message of gratitude was needed. cheers guys!!!!

Brand is a toss-up.

Seedling - I just give it distilled water until it gets to be about two weeks old.

Veg. cycle - For my first grow I went with a 20-20-20 in a cycle. I used 6" pots so I watered every other day. So the cycle went: Mon. - 1/2 power feed Wed. - Full-power feed Fri. - 1/2 power feed Sun. - flush with distilled water. Tuesday starts the cycle over

Flower cycle - I used a 10-30-20. I pushed them a little harder then usual during the first few weeks and then settled into the same cycle I used for the veg. feed. The last week or two I only water with distilled water.

Hope this helps!

brick top said:

you are bound to get any number of differing opinions on what nutrients/fertilizers are best so do not be surprised if you do not receive a definitive answer.
　
myself i like fox farms products. I use grow big during veg and both tiger bloom and big bloom during flower. I also use one drop of superthrive per watering/feeding. Some people claim that superthrive is pure crap and some swear by it so again there will likely be differing opinions about it but it does work for me. Towards the end of flowering after i flush my soil i then finish using only blackstrap molasses.
　
some people swear that lucas formula nutrients are better or at least a better value, and they may be right and they may be wrong.
　
your question about what to use at different stages of growth is simple. You use fertilizers/nutrients for vegging during vegging and flowering fertilizers/nutrients during flowering. When you go to whatever website you purchase them from of whatever store you purchase them from each will say on the container what stage of growth they are made for. If you want to learn more before even looking use google and type in fox farms and lucas formula advanced nutrients and the names of any other products that people suggest and read and learn.
　
the ratio question will be answered when you read the container of whatever products you look at and then whatever you purchase. About the only thing that will not likely be mentioned is for the first feeding or two, somewhere between three to five weeks into the seedling stage depending on the strain. You will want to start with roughly a third strength mixture for the first feeding and then the next feeding to go a half strength mixture and after that follow the instructions on each container.

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i'm seeing that you are pretty knowledgable so maybe you can assist me. I have no hydro shops around me and want to go hydro but have no nutes can you suggest what i can use? I want to use the miracle gro since it is instantly avalable but do you think i will be doing more harm than good and if so can you assist?

BLACKMESSIAH7 said:

i'm seeing that you are pretty knowledgable so maybe you can assist me. I have no hydro shops around me and want to go hydro but have no nutes can you suggest what i can use? I want to use the miracle gro since it is instantly avalable but do you think i will be doing more harm than good and if so can you assist?

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I have never been a hydro/aero grower so I avoid answering questions about hydro/aero growing. I believe those answers best come from those with a good bit of actual hands on experience.
　
The best I can offer you is to suggest that you Google hydro stores and read about the different nutes they offer for hydro growing and then Google the manufacturer of the products and see what they have to say. Then combine that with what experienced hydro/aero growers tell you and then pick a site with the best pricing and a good reputation for reliability and customer service for whatever you decide is the best value for your dollar and then place your order.
　
I am sorry if that was not as helpful as you may have wished for but rather than offer an opinion or guess and cause you problems I would prefer to leave it to those who know what works the best.
　
Good luck.

brick top said:

i have never been a hydro/aero grower so i avoid answering questions about hydro/aero growing. I believe those answers best come from those with a good bit of actual hands on experience.
　
the best i can offer you is to suggest that you google hydro stores and read about the different nutes they offer for hydro growing and then google the manufacturer of the products and see what they have to say. Then combine that with what experienced hydro/aero growers tell you and then pick a site with the best pricing and a good reputation for reliability and customer service for whatever you decide is the best value for your dollar and then place your order.
　
i am sorry if that was not as helpful as you may have wished for but rather than offer an opinion or guess and cause you problems i would prefer to leave it to those who know what works the best.
　
good luck.

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bricktop. Good looking my brother. Its actually refreshing to see a genuine real person who can admit to their knowledge and lack thereof and still offer advice. You just answering the question was assistance enough. Peace and big buds.

BLACKMESSIAH7 said:

bricktop. Good looking my brother. Its actually refreshing to see a genuine real person who can admit to their knowledge and lack thereof and still offer advice. You just answering the question was assistance enough. Peace and big buds.

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Back again guys sorry for the lack of discussion.
Right its a 15 plant op and im trying to find out the best size pots to use? we want large, mutant like plants with colossal amounts if buds that will need support with bamboo canes. im thinking 3m long 2 m wide and 3m high.
doing it jorges cervantes sytle with a wooden frame box and mylar walls. Any suggestions on how to make this box airtight would be great as he does not go into this issue on his frist DVD.
As for strain... its gonna have to blueberry cheese. im gonna get cuttings soon.

McNulty said:

Back again guys sorry for the lack of discussion.
Right its a 15 plant op and im trying to find out the best size pots to use? we want large, mutant like plants with colossal amounts if buds that will need support with bamboo canes. im thinking 3m long 2 m wide and 3m high.
doing it jorges cervantes sytle with a wooden frame box and mylar walls. Any suggestions on how to make this box airtight would be great as he does not go into this issue on his frist DVD.
As for strain... its gonna have to blueberry cheese. im gonna get cuttings soon.

Click to expand...

I have gathered that the bigger the plant pot the larger the plant will grow, so im thinking massive plant pots and just raise the light when the plants reach a distance that will begin to harm them (that way the plants are as close the the light as poss.
lighting: flourescent during the seed stage move up the High denisty sodium lights for the rest of growth , horizontally placed with sealed extraction system drawing air through? the lights.
Another idea is that during veg/ flower stage instead of doing away with the flourecents after seedling, we are going to have them on the bottom of the plants so that the lower regions are always getting good light ( even tho it is only flourecent but light is better than no light) what do you think?
Im thinking of using rockawool cubes for seeding then just plant it into unfertilized soil mixed with perlite (50/50) when reading for veg stage.
Any advice welcome, i hope this gives you a good idea of this set-up to be and once again, cheers lads!

McNulty said:

I have gathered that the bigger the plant pot the larger the plant will grow, so im thinking massive plant pots and just raise the light when the plants reach a distance that will begin to harm them (that way the plants are as close the the light as poss.
lighting: flourescent during the seed stage move up the High denisty sodium lights for the rest of growth , horizontally placed with sealed extraction system drawing air through? the lights.
Another idea is that during veg/ flower stage instead of doing away with the flourecents after seedling, we are going to have them on the bottom of the plants so that the lower regions are always getting good light ( even tho it is only flourecent but light is better than no light) what do you think?
Im thinking of using rockawool cubes for seeding then just plant it into unfertilized soil mixed with perlite (50/50) when reading for veg stage.
Any advice welcome, i hope this gives you a good idea of this set-up to be and once again, cheers lads!

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sorry just read through that post : * when READY for veg stage*
Dam... im smoking some of the blues frm the same cuttings now thats why i type retarded. laters

The "best" nutrients don't have a brand. They are organic and they are free.

Originally Posted by McNulty
Back again guys sorry for the lack of discussion.
Right its a 15 plant op and im trying to find out the best size pots to use? we want large, mutant like plants with colossal amounts if buds that will need support with bamboo canes. im thinking 3m long 2 m wide and 3m high.
doing it jorges cervantes sytle with a wooden frame box and mylar walls. Any suggestions on how to make this box airtight would be great as he does not go into this issue on his frist DVD.
As for strain... its gonna have to blueberry cheese. im gonna get cuttings soon.



Having read over this posti made a few days ago i have just realised another fault. : when i say im thinking 3 m x 2m x 3m i was reffering to the structure of the grow room not the size of the plants!!!
Dam this blues is good.