Inequality and the USA: A nation in denial?

[Nutes and Nugs]

People do not show up to work to fulfill their fantasy of the American dream..

People show up to work because they have to work to survive. They have to work to provide for their families.

"The American Dream is a national ethos of the United States, a set of ideals in which freedom includes the opportunity for prosperity and success, and an upward social mobility achieved through hard work. In the definition of the American Dream by James Truslow Adams in 1931, "life should be better and richer and fuller for everyone, with opportunity for each according to ability or achievement" regardless of social class or circumstances of birth."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Dream

We, the working class, gets 6%.. 6 fucking percent.. since 1980. Know what the upper class gets? 94%..

I'm in that working class. I believe the American dream, as outlined by wikipedia, is complete bullshit. It wasn't when it was thought up, working class Americans post WW2 experienced the American dream. But it's an unsustainable system of growth. Americans consume 4 times more than the world can provide, and have since the 1970's. How can we continue to consume more than the world provides and expect it to last forever? We can't. It was never meant to be sustainable, and that part of the American dream was never taught to people. We are the fallout of the failure of that system. My generation (our generation) is the first generation in America since before the Great Depression to be financially and economically worse off than the previous one. Previous generations of people don't understand that, they can't comprehend that, what it means or how it actually affects our lives because they themselves never went through it. They've never experienced it.. It will get better, but we're facing the blunt of the opposition because we're the first to go through it. It's expected..

6% simply doesn't do it for me.. I'm sorry to "nag".. sorry to "complain".. about equal fucking rights and equal compensation.. When the Supreme Court passes cases along that fuck the working man over, systematically, purposefully, and we end up where we are today at a fucking measly 6%... you can bet your ass the working man is going to say something about it.

If it was even 50%-50%, I'd accept it (even though it still isn't accurate), but the greedy fucks at the top have to pinch every single fucking penny. 6% is bullshit over the course of 35 years. We're simply tired of taking it.

Good God, where do I begin?
People work for a better lifestyle.

You just can't sit back and be rewarded for fucking off all day.

What 6% are you talking about?
The 6% that wants to watch tv all day and collect a government paycheck?

 

[reasonevangelist]

You're right, that's exactly what it is, and its an intentional tactic to control the discussion and keep it from challenging the carefully constructed set of lies put in place by Faux News, Flush Limbaugh and the Koch brothers. It's almost as bad as trying to talk about spirituality to a Southern Baptist; either you use their language of fundamentalist Christian dogma or no conversation happens at all.

The answer is to say your piece anyway. Don't let their onion be the only one. Make yours heard, and let those who listen and think decide for themselves.

For many years now, that's how i thought and lived, and i still agree with that approach, in principle... but it's just so exhausting... and at some point, i have to wonder if my time could be spent more wisely, or at least more pleasantly. This is where "hope for humanity" comes in, in that i have to sort of manufacture some of it for myself, so that i can almost believe that "enough" has been done in this regard, that enough others will and have already started to figure these things out for themselves, and that maybe someone else can take over the evangelizing soon. I love to see people do it better than i can, and i've seen it become less rare, over time... and i like to think i at least marginally contributed to that, along the way.

 

[ttystikk]

that's a good point, but bill gates type wealth is not what most people think of as the american dream.

Except that getting stupid rich with the help of Wall Street IS the new road to wealth; 'built to flip' has replaced 'built to last' in startup circles- our nation's young up n comers are actually looking forward to their chance to feed themselves to the beast, as if eating our young is sustainable.

Worse, the recent Princeton study on the political situation in America made it utterly clear that we are not iterating as a democracy any more than Putin's Russia does- in fact, LESS!

Please don't tell me you're an apologist for this, @UncleBuck?

 

[UncleBuck]

xavier does an annual american dream poll. they find that:

• Currently, the four most prominent definitions of the American Dream are "a good life for my family,""financial security,” "opportunity," and "freedom."

all still alive and well in america.

 

[reasonevangelist]

Good God, where do I begin?
People work for a better lifestyle.

You just can't sit back and be rewarded for fucking off all day.

What 6% are you talking about?
The 6% that wants to watch tv all day and collect a government paycheck?

That's a nice demonstration of exactly the type of "absolutism" that was just mentioned.

 

[UncleBuck]

Good God, where do I begin?
People work for a better lifestyle.

You just can't sit back and be rewarded for fucking off all day.

What 6% are you talking about?
The 6% that wants to watch tv all day and collect a government paycheck?

you're not very bright.

 

[UncleBuck]

Except that getting stupid fish with the help of Wall Street IS the new road to wealth; 'built to flip' has replaced 'built to last' in startup circles- our nation's young up n comers are actually looking forward to their chance to feed themselves to the beast, as if eating our young is sustainable.

Worse, the recent Princeton study on the political situation in America made it utterly clear that we are not iterating as a democracy any more than Putin's Russia does- in fact, LESS!

Please don't tell me you're an apologist for this, @UncleBuck?

the "financial security" that many americans list as the backbone of the american dream often goes through wall street. half of americans have a 401k that they will depend on for financial security once they stop working.

are you referring to the princeton study that shows that public opinion has negligible effect on how our reps vote? please advise.

 

[Nutes and Nugs]

you're not very bright.

Why do you deny the holocaust?

 

[Padawanbater2]

how is that not possible anymore?

admittedly, it is tougher to achieve, but nowhere near impossible.

what is your "dream"?

I would put it at "just barely achievable for the smallest minority in America", which is nowhere near what the original "American Dream" hoped to achieve.

The American Dream was that because it was accessible to EVERYONE, regardless of income, race, religion, creed, gender or sexual orientation. I'm not so sure the same effect would have taken place if, when they came up with it, it read "The American Dream; reach for the stars, so long as you're rich and white"... Come on, man, stop bullshiting with semantics..

The "American Dream" was meant for everyone when it was established. Today, the "American Dream" is predominantly achieved by affluent people with stable financial backgrounds. Sure, you can reach it if you're poor, but not many do. Sure, you can reach it if you're middle class, but not many do.. You are definitely, inarguable more likely to reach the "American Dream" if you're already financially established when you try.

That's not what the "American Dream" is!

It's meant for ANYONE, of ANY background, of ANY race, etc. to reach it. Come here, work hard, it's yours! That sentiment is complete bullshit today, even for born, white, male citizens, like me.

I could work harder than anyone (and have) and still be passed over for a promotion. Our workforce is 70% goods/services, it's not product based, it's service based. This means the majority of the jobs simply do not have positions of growth to go to. 70% of the jobs we offer in this country are dead end.

"Come here, get a dead end job that pays barely enough to survive in a rented room apartment!"

That's the new "American Dream"...

 

[UncleBuck]

I would put it at "just barely achievable for the smallest minority in America", which is nowhere near what the original "American Dream" hoped to achieve.

The American Dream was that because it was accessible to EVERYONE, regardless of income, race, religion, creed, gender or sexual orientation. I'm not so sure the same effect would have taken place if, when they came up with it, it read "The American Dream; reach for the stars, so long as you're rich and white"... Come on, man, stop bullshiting with semantics..

The "American Dream" was meant for everyone when it was established. Today, the "American Dream" is predominantly achieved by affluent people with stable financial backgrounds. Sure, you can reach it if you're poor, but not many do. Sure, you can reach it if you're middle class, but not many do.. You are definitely, inarguable more likely to reach the "American Dream" if you're already financially established when you try.

That's not what the "American Dream" is!

It's meant for ANYONE, of ANY background, of ANY race, etc. to reach it. Come here, work hard, it's yours! That sentiment is complete bullshit today, even for born, white, male citizens, like me.

I could work harder than anyone (and have) and still be passed over for a promotion. Our workforce is 70% goods/services, it's not product based, it's service based. This means the majority of the jobs simply do not have positions of growth to go to. 70% of the jobs we offer in this country are dead end.

"Come here, get a dead end job that pays barely enough to survive in a rented room apartment!"

That's the new "American Dream"...

you never told me what your american dream was, but i'm pretty sure you're not gonna get it in LA.

 

[ttystikk]

xavier does an annual american dream poll. they find that:

• Currently, the four most prominent definitions of the American Dream are "a good life for my family,""financial security,” "opportunity," and "freedom."

all still alive and well in america.

WELL, let's take those in order, shall we?

-a good life for my family: amid declining real wages, an economy that looks like a banana republic's, college tuition and other associated costs spiraling out of reach of a stagnant income?

-financial security: at the same time as real wages have fallen, we've shifted the tax burden from wealth and industry to the former middle class- who broke under the strain. THEN, we gutted Social Security and a myriad of other social safety net programs and did away with pensions. Nice!

-opportunity: sure, if you can save enough to get your foot in the door. At every turn, the deck is stacked AGAINST small business and entrepreneurship, especially at the startup/sole proprietorship level. So why does a larger proportion of new American businesses fail than in other industrialised countries? Because Corporate Power doesn't like competition and wields the power of purchased legislation to control it (read; 'minimize') as much as possible.

-freedom. HAH! YOU GONNA TRY TO DEFEND THAT ON THIS WEBSITE, YOU IDIOT?!

 

[ttystikk]

the "financial security" that many americans list as the backbone of the american dream often goes through wall street. half of americans have a 401k that they will depend on for financial security once they stop working.

are you referring to the princeton study that shows that public opinion has negligible effect on how our reps vote? please advise.

That 401k is not accessible to most working Americans, who have a NEGATIVE SAVINGS RATE BECAUSE THEY CAN'T MAKE ENDS MEET.

I AM a startup entrepreneur. I HAVE eaten ramen noodles to save for my project. I DO bust my fucking ass to get ahead.

Therefore I have first hand knowledge of just how fucked our country is, if We the People don't take control of it back from the megacorps and their ownership class.

 

[ttystikk]

I would put it at "just barely achievable for the smallest minority in America", which is nowhere near what the original "American Dream" hoped to achieve.

The American Dream was that because it was accessible to EVERYONE, regardless of income, race, religion, creed, gender or sexual orientation. I'm not so sure the same effect would have taken place if, when they came up with it, it read "The American Dream; reach for the stars, so long as you're rich and white"... Come on, man, stop bullshiting with semantics..

The "American Dream" was meant for everyone when it was established. Today, the "American Dream" is predominantly achieved by affluent people with stable financial backgrounds. Sure, you can reach it if you're poor, but not many do. Sure, you can reach it if you're middle class, but not many do.. You are definitely, inarguable more likely to reach the "American Dream" if you're already financially established when you try.

That's not what the "American Dream" is!

It's meant for ANYONE, of ANY background, of ANY race, etc. to reach it. Come here, work hard, it's yours! That sentiment is complete bullshit today, even for born, white, male citizens, like me.

I could work harder than anyone (and have) and still be passed over for a promotion. Our workforce is 70% goods/services, it's not product based, it's service based. This means the majority of the jobs simply do not have positions of growth to go to. 70% of the jobs we offer in this country are dead end.

"Come here, get a dead end job that pays barely enough to survive in a rented room apartment!"

That's the new "American Dream"...

And We the People could change this with the stroke of a pen, by requiring that service jobs pay well.

 

[Nutes and Nugs]

I would put it at "just barely achievable for the smallest minority in America", which is nowhere near what the original "American Dream" hoped to achieve.

The American Dream was that because it was accessible to EVERYONE, regardless of income, race, religion, creed, gender or sexual orientation. I'm not so sure the same effect would have taken place if, when they came up with it, it read "The American Dream; reach for the stars, so long as you're rich and white"... Come on, man, stop bullshiting with semantics..

The "American Dream" was meant for everyone when it was established. Today, the "American Dream" is predominantly achieved by affluent people with stable financial backgrounds. Sure, you can reach it if you're poor, but not many do. Sure, you can reach it if you're middle class, but not many do.. You are definitely, inarguable more likely to reach the "American Dream" if you're already financially established when you try.

That's not what the "American Dream" is!

It's meant for ANYONE, of ANY background, of ANY race, etc. to reach it. Come here, work hard, it's yours! That sentiment is complete bullshit today, even for born, white, male citizens, like me.

I could work harder than anyone (and have) and still be passed over for a promotion. Our workforce is 70% goods/services, it's not product based, it's service based. This means the majority of the jobs simply do not have positions of growth to go to. 70% of the jobs we offer in this country are dead end.

"Come here, get a dead end job that pays barely enough to survive in a rented room apartment!"

That's the new "American Dream"...

This all depends on your attitude.
You are a failure Pada and you will never live the American dream
by sitting back and wanting money handed to you on a silver platter.
Doesnt matter what background or race.
Get off your ass and DO something.

Many people that were born poor as fuck still became millionaires.

Watch Shark Tank someday and start using your brain.

 

[Padawanbater2]

you never told me what your american dream was, but i'm pretty sure you're not gonna get it in LA.

My American Dream is to live in a society that is congruent with the the opportunity for prosperity and success, and an upward social mobility achieved through hard work. "Life should be better and richer and fuller for everyone, with opportunity for each according to ability or achievement" regardless of social class or circumstances of birth."

Right now, wealth controls politics, and politics controls America. This isn't a secret. To continue the farce that it is is simply disingenuous. We all have youtube, we all have cameras at this point..

 

[Nutes and Nugs]

My American Dream is to live in a society that is congruent with the the opportunity for prosperity and success, and an upward social mobility achieved through hard work. "Life should be better and richer and fuller for everyone, with opportunity for each according to ability or achievement" regardless of social class or circumstances of birth."

Right now, wealth controls politics, and politics controls America. This isn't a secret. To continue the farce that it is is simply disingenuous. We all have youtube, we all have cameras at this point..

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
With the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

It's so noisy at the fair
But all your friends are there
And the candy floss you had
And your mother and your dad.

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
With the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

There's a girl just down the aisle,
Oh, to turn and see her smile.
You can hear the words she wrote
As you read the hidden note.

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
With the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

Now you're underneath the stairs
And you're givin' back some glares
To the people who you met
And it's your first cigarette.

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
With the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

Now you say you're leavin' home
'Cause you want to be alone.
Ain't it funny how you feel
When you're findin' out it's real?

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
With the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

Oh, to live on Sugar Mountain
with the barkers and the colored balloons,
You can't be twenty on Sugar Mountain
Though you're thinking that
you're leaving there too soon,
You're leaving there too soon.

 

[ttystikk]

This all depends on your attitude.
You are a failure Pada and you will never live the American dream
by sitting back and wanting money handed to you on a silver platter.
Doesnt matter what background or race.
Get off your ass and DO something.

Many people that were born poor as fuck still became millionaires.

Watch Shark Tank someday and start using your brain.

The perfect canned right wing response, utterly devoid of anything that could be seized upon as fact and therefore challenged.

Call the ripped off 'failures'. Call the working poor 'lazy'. 'Many people get rich'- but at a much smaller rate than any other industrialised country. Why does someone have to have a Shark Tank personality to have a shot at the good life? It's this kind of thinking that leads directly to fascism. No surprise, then, that I believe we live in a fascist society.

You've been suckered in by GREED. Start thinking about the consequences of all that shit coming out of your mouth- that someone else put there.

At least come up with an original slogan.

 

[Padawanbater2]

The perfect canned right wing response, utterly devoid of anything that could be seized upon as fact and therefore challenged.

Call the ripped off 'failures'. Call the working poor 'lazy'. 'Many people get rich'- but at a much smaller rate than any other industrialised country. Why does someone have to have a Shark Tank personality to have a shot at the good life?

You've been suckered in by GREED. Start thinking about the consequences of all that shit coming out of your mouth- that someone else put there.

At least come up with an original slogan.

He doesn't care about the working class or the struggle the majority of working Americans go through on a daily basis because of the policies he is more than likely partly responsible for enacting. He's one of those "black/white" fella's I eluded to earlier.. No point in reasoning with the unreasonable, right?

Check my sig for further confirmation..

Excellent reply, TT

 

[Nutes and Nugs]

The perfect canned right wing response, utterly devoid of anything that could be seized upon as fact and therefore challenged.

Call the ripped off 'failures'. Call the working poor 'lazy'. 'Many people get rich'- but at a much smaller rate than any other industrialised country. Why does someone have to have a Shark Tank personality to have a shot at the good life?

You've been suckered in by GREED. Start thinking about the consequences of all that shit coming out of your mouth- that someone else put there.

At least come up with an original slogan.

 

[Nutes and Nugs]

He doesn't care about the working class or the struggle the majority of working Americans go through on a daily basis because of the policies he is more than likely partly responsible for enacting. He's one of those "black/white" fella's I eluded to earlier.. No point in reasoning with the unreasonable, right?

Check my sig for further confirmation..

Excellent reply, TT

What are you smoking?
I want some too.