indiana

[see4]

That's rhetorical, no need to answer, we already know you are.
Typical liberal loser, when you lose the discussion , go straight to the race card,you wore the race card out.You need to get a new Shtick.
Let me get this straight, so your solution to solving discrimination is to discriminate?
fucking genius

Hmm, interneting is lost on you dumb dumb.

Your circular logic is profound.

I will repeat it again for the 20th+ time.

You are free to do whatever you like out in public or in the privacy of your own private property. You can jump up and down and cry about gays and blacks all you want. I don't give a shit what you do. BUT as soon as you discriminate against them and create a distraction in their life you are violating their civil rights and inalienable rights. That is against the law.

Because you are a racist bigot, you clearly will never understand that.

 

[Padawanbater2]

you clearly will never understand that.

The issue seems to be he believes property rights trump civil rights, and that anyone should be allowed to do anything on their property they want because they own it. This ignores the majority of businesses as they're normally trying to sell something to the public. Then he seems to believe the civil rights acts are all invalid and even though it has been established that discrimination is illegal, he believes religious people still have the right to discriminate..

I'd love to see him try to argue this in front of the Supreme Court..

 

[abandonconflict]

militant gay

Gangsta

 

[max420thc]

Nobody has the right to discriminate against people based on their religion. I'm afraid you and Rob both have the argument backwards. I'm confident the law in Indiana will be overturned by the Supreme Court as it's very clearly unconstitutional, and here's something specifically for you to look forward to, the SC is also going to vote on federal gay marriage this next month, and if that passes, which is likely will, how do you think Pence and the dummies who rallied behind this in Indiana are going to look then?

Does your mom let you stay up till midnight while you're on spring break?

I wish I could dumb this conversation down far enough for it to get stupid enough for you to understand,
it seems no matter how hard I try to make it as basic and understandable for you bigots(against religion)
Again ,you would force a jewish deli owner to serve ham sandwich's.
this law protects the jewish deli owner from militant ham sandwich freaks,
that's all it does, if you homos want to get married go ahead.
Just don't ask the church that does not believe in it to marry you in their church,
Don't ask the Christian bakery to bake you a cake , don't ask the Christian photographer to take your wedding pictures.
homos like you liberals are sexual degenerate's.
You want to force people who do not believe in nor like your life style choices to accept them as normal and moral, sorry about your luck

 

[see4]

The issue seems to be he believes property rights trump civil rights, and that anyone should be allowed to do anything on their property they want because they own it. This ignores the majority of businesses as they're normally trying to sell something to the public. Then he seems to believe the civil rights acts are all invalid and even though it has been established that discrimination is illegal, he believes religious people still have the right to discriminate..

I'd love to see him try to argue this in front of the Supreme Court..

You are spot on.

He couldn't argue his way out of a wet paper bag.

 

[see4]

I wish I could dumb this conversation down far enough for it to get stupid enough for you to understand,
it seems no matter how hard I try to make it as basic and understandable for you bigots(against religion)
Again ,you would force a jewish deli owner to serve ham sandwich's.
this law protects the jewish deli owner from militant ham sandwich freaks,
that's all it does, if you homos want to get married go ahead.
Just don't ask the church that does not believe in it to marry you in their church,
Don't ask the Christian bakery to bake you a cake , don't ask the Christian photographer to take your wedding pictures.
homos like you liberals are sexual degenerate's.
You want to force people who do not believe in nor like your life style choices to accept them as normal and moral, sorry about your luck

You have the right to be a racist bigot all you want. But you do not have the right to be a racist bigot if it infringes on people's civil rights. Period.

If you can't stomach that, I suggest you renounce your US citizenship, nobody wants your kind here.

 

[Padawanbater2]

you would force a jewish deli owner to serve ham sandwich's.

Wrong, because not selling pork based on religion is not a discriminatory policy. If the Jewish sandwich shop owner excluded the sale of pork to someone based on race, color, religion, sex or country of origin, then I would be against it because it would be a discriminatory policy

this law protects the jewish deli owner from militant ham sandwich freaks

No it's not. The law is designed to legally allow religious people to discriminate against LGBT people because their religion opposes homosexuality under the guise of religious freedom. Three top officials of the anti-gay lobby were standing behind Pence in the photo when he signed the bill; Micah Clark (believes homosexuality is a treatable disorder), Curt Smith (equates homosexuality to beastiality and adultery) and Eric Miller (distributed a fear flyer falsely claiming that pastors could be jailed for preaching against homosexuality after same sex marriage passed)

Just don't ask the church that does not believe in it to marry you in their church,
Don't ask the Christian bakery to bake you a cake , don't ask the Christian photographer to take your wedding pictures.

... don't ask the Christian theme park owner if you can ride the rides, don't ask the Christian NBA stadium owner if you can watch basketball games in person, don't ask the Christian restaurant owner to serve homosexuals, don't ask the Christian school teacher to teach the gay kids..

You really wanna go down that road and attempt to justify it with "But I's a good wholesome Christian boy"?

You know how shitty that makes religion look?

You want to force people who do not believe in nor like your life style choices to accept them as normal and moral, sorry about your luck

Yep, you're absolutely right, I want to force people who do not believe in equal civil rights to accept them as normal and moral, and this April your ass will be handed to you by the highest court in the land. I don't predict this law in Indiana to stay for long, do you remember what happened to Prop 8 here in California? The fact is your side is losing, our side is winning and you will eventually be forced to accept, at least the legal aspect of the law, just like you did when black people earned their civil rights.

My advice to you would simply be to get used to it

 

[max420thc]

You have the right to be a racist bigot all you want. But you do not have the right to be a racist bigot if it infringes on people's civil rights. Period.

If you can't stomach that, I suggest you renounce your US citizenship, nobody wants your kind here.

What do you know about rights? liberals think its a right to have health care, they think its a right to have high speed internet and phones,
how would someone refusing to take photos at your gay wedding violate your civil rights>?
how would someone refusing to make a gay wedding cake for you violate your civil rights?
How would a jewish deli owner refusing to serve ham sandwich's violate your civil rights?

 

[max420thc]

Wrong, because not selling pork based on religion is not a discriminatory policy. If the Jewish sandwich shop owner excluded the sale of pork to someone based on race, color, religion, sex or country of origin, then I would be against it because it would be a discriminatory policy

No it's not. The law is designed to legally allow religious people to discriminate against LGBT people because their religion opposes homosexuality under the guise of religious freedom. Three top officials of the anti-gay lobby were standing behind Pence in the photo when he signed the bill; Micah Clark (believes homosexuality is a treatable disorder), Curt Smith (equates homosexuality to beastiality and adultery) and Eric Miller (distributed a fear flyer falsely claiming that pastors could be jailed for preaching against homosexuality after same sex marriage passed)

... don't ask the Christian theme park owner if you can ride the rides, don't ask the Christian NBA stadium owner if you can watch basketball games in person, don't ask the Christian restaurant owner to serve homosexuals, don't ask the Christian school teacher to teach the gay kids..

You really wanna go down that road and attempt to justify it with "But I's a good wholesome Christian boy"?

You know how shitty that makes religion look?

Yep, you're absolutely right, I want to force people who do not believe in equal civil rights to accept them as normal and moral, and this April your ass will be handed to you by the highest court in the land. I don't predict this law in Indiana to stay for long, do you remember what happened to Prop 8 here in California? The fact is your side is losing, our side is winning and you will eventually be forced to accept, at least the legal aspect of the law, just like you did when black people earned their civil rights.

My advice to you would simply be to get used to it

How is the NBA owner going to know you are gay?hows the restaurant owner going to know you are gay?Unless of course you are waving a ten ft gay pride flag,
in that case he has every right to tell you to get the fuck out as he is in the business of playing basket ball or serving food and he don't want that sick ass degenerate shit in HIS establishment.
what if someone wanted to marry a dog or other animal?what about their so called civil rights?
we can take this to a whole new level based on your flawed logic.
After all the person loves the dog and the dog loves them back, who are we to judge.
And if you refuse to make them a cake or take pictures at the wedding then you are a bigot and judgmental , also violating their civil rights,
you keep talking about black people who have no control over their skin color just as none of us do.What's so funny is MOST black people I know of are not in favor of gay marriage,
Matter of fact black people in California voted against gay marriage , it failed a public referendum in California but one of your homo militant activist judges threw out the vote and passed the law all by themselves,
You liberals seem to hate democracy, when elections do not go your way

 

[Padawanbater2]

how would someone refusing to take photos at your gay wedding violate your civil rights>?

Someone refusing to take photos at my gay wedding would violate my civil rights because, according to the civil rights act of 1964, denying goods/services based on race, color, religion, sex or nation of origin is discrimination, which is illegal under federal law. You might be saying "but sexual orientation isn't", and you'd be right, technically speaking. Then we'd get into the "is homosexuality a choice?" question.. I'd argue it isn't, you'd probably argue it is.. so we'd move onto me asking "so what if it's a choice?" and you probably reply with some other justification derived from your favorite personal religious text, I'd tell you that's not proof or evidence, you'd argue otherwise.. and we'd end up back here where we are now.. Either way, denying the sale of goods/services based on opposition to sexual identity or sexual orientation is discrimination, no different from racial discrimination. Sexual identity and sexual orientation is not a choice, just like skin color or heritage, it is discriminatory practice to base exclusionary actions on something a person cannot consciously change.

how would someone refusing to make a gay wedding cake for you violate your civil rights?

Because if you own/operate a business, you can't legally discriminate based on homosexuality or sexual identity

How would a jewish deli owner refusing to serve ham sandwich's violate your civil rights?

It wouldn't because that's a good example of a valid religious exemption that doesn't violate anyone's civil rights

 

[max420thc]

To add to his point about getting a ham sandwich in a Jewish deli... How exactly does not serving ham discriminating against anyone? If the deli said "yeah, we'll serve ham, but only to straight people" then yeah, that would be the same kind of discrimination. That's why Jewish deli owners do have the option of what to serve, same thing applies to the Christian bookstore.

@ max420thc, see the difference? You don't serve ham because of religion, aOK, nobody gets discriminated against, religious freedom is upheld, you don't serve people because they're gay, wrong because the gay persons civil rights are being violated, civil rights trump religious rights, so the religious person is in the wrong

The jewish deli owner does not serve ham sandwichs because pork is against their religion.
the Christian baker does not make gay wedding cakes because its against their religion,
The first amendment trumps your civil rights argument.
The reason for this law,(another one of them being signed today in Arkansas)Is when your gay activists don't get their way then its time to get a lawyer and sue,

 

[max420thc]

Someone refusing to take photos at my gay wedding would violate my civil rights because, according to the civil rights act of 1964, denying goods/services based on race, color, religion, sex or nation of origin is discrimination, which is illegal under federal law. You might be saying "but sexual orientation isn't", and you'd be right, technically speaking. Then we'd get into the "is homosexuality a choice?" question.. I'd argue it isn't, you'd probably argue it is.. so we'd move onto me asking "so what if it's a choice?" and you probably reply with some other justification derived from your favorite personal religious text, I'd tell you that's not proof or evidence, you'd argue otherwise.. and we'd end up back here where we are now.. Either way, denying the sale of goods/services based on opposition to sexual identity or sexual orientation is discrimination, no different from racial discrimination. Sexual identity and sexual orientation is not a choice, just like skin color or heritage, it is discriminatory practice to base exclusionary actions on something a person cannot consciously change.

Because if you own/operate a business, you can't legally discriminate based on homosexuality or sexual identity

It wouldn't because that's a good example of a valid religious exemption that doesn't violate anyone's civil rights

Read the first amendment :congress shall make NO LAW regarding the establishment of religion or the free excersise thereof.Do you understand what that means?

 

[Padawanbater2]

How is the NBA owner going to know you are gay?hows the restaurant owner going to know you are gay?Unless of course you are waving a ten ft gay pride flag

Are you advocating homosexual men/women should break the law and enter into "straight only" establishments regardless of what the law says?

in that case he has every right to tell you to get the fuck out

Except, legally, he doesn't..

as he is in the business of playing basket ball or serving food and he don't want that sick ass degenerate shit in HIS establishment.

Unfortunately for him he's opened a public business which, as established by federal law, can't legally discriminate against people based on race, color, religion, sex or national origin (and by proxy, sexual orientation and sexual identity)

what if someone wanted to marry a dog or other animal?what about their so called civil rights?

Animals cannot consent to marriage. (at this point, I feel like this is a RR sock account planted for the sole purpose of getting me to admit "SEEE!!! CONSENT!@ YOU SAID IT YOURSELF!!!"... I think it'd be hilarious if that actually happened..

Either way, animals can't consent to marriage, automatic defeat right there..

RR chimes in "people don't consent to ______ so ______!"

Which will hopefully be discussed in another thread..

we can take this to a whole new level based on your flawed logic.
After all the person loves the dog and the dog loves them back, who are we to judge.

Con-sent..

And if you refuse to make them a cake or take pictures at the wedding then you are a bigot and judgmental , also violating their civil rights

Depends what the law says on that one, sport..

What's so funny is MOST black people I know of are not in favor of gay marriage,
Matter of fact black people in California voted against gay marriage , it failed a public referendum in California but one of your homo militant activist judges threw out the vote and passed the law all by themselves,
You liberals seem to hate democracy, when elections do not go your way

Yep, you're right, ironically, the majority of black people seem to be against gay marriage/equal rights for gay people. I'd personally attribute that to the deep seated religious aspect of african american culture, southern baptists and what not.. Oddly enough, the more north you go in America, historically speaking, the less racist you get.. coincidence? Perhaps.. but I'd argue the majority of black people oppose gay rights because the majority of black people are... religious..

Interesting..

 

[Grandpapy]

uh,its not refusing them service based on that, It has to do with THEIR religious rights that you want to infringe on,
Oh I get it, you want to solve discrimination by,,,DISCRIMINATING ,,,fucking just dumb as rock soup.
your so smart you tell me what the civil rights movement was about in the 60s? seeing as you know so much about the constitution and all,,all the equal protection and all that,
You are actually to stupid to know what the equal protection amendment is even about so you must excuse me of I take any response you have with a grain of salt,

errr...all men being equal, you know, under God.
But mainly for "your" type of attitude towards your fellow man.

Wont serve Gays but no problem with Atheists.

 

[TheHermit]

I wonder what type of cake would be served at a man-dog wedding. Ice cream cake or perhaps something alpo based?

 

[londonfog]

Do you even know what private property is? Im sure your communist ass thinks its public domain,
Go to a jewish deli and order a ham sandwich see how far you get,Go to a Christian book store and order a manual on gay sex,
Better yet go to Iran and shout at the top of your lungs,,im a HOMO, lets see what happens,

When you decide to open a business that is open to the public it is no longer private. If you wish to not serve to the public you should open your business as a private club.
Your example of a Jewish deli owner is rather dumb. He is not refusing me service, he is just not serving something that I want. Same with a Christian book store. You Iran rubbish does not even fit in a conversation about something happening in the states.

 

[max420thc]

errr...all men being equal, you know, under God.
But mainly for "your" type of attitude towards your fellow man.

Wont serve Gays but no problem with Atheists.

Last time I checked at the local jewish deli they do not ask you what your religion is they will serve anyone, They however do not serve ham sandwich's because it is against their religion.
Im sure they would not appreciate it if you wore your ass less chaps into their store wearing a g string,No matter how much you argue that is your freedom of expression or free speech,

 

[max420thc]

When you decide to open a business that is open to the public it is no longer private. If you wish to not serve to the public you should open your business as a private club.
Your example of a Jewish deli owner is rather dumb. He is not refusing me service, he is just not serving something that I want. Same with a Christian book store. You Iran rubbish does not even fit in a conversation about something happening in the states.

yea,,so how did that hobby lobby law suit go for you?
Why not, isn't the jewish deli open to the public? isn't the Christian book store open to the public?
You like to talk about intolerant Christians are, well if you go to iran and proclaim im a fag,,chances are you will not live very long

 

[Grandpapy]

Last time I checked at the local jewish deli they do not ask you what your religion is they will serve anyone, They however do not serve ham sandwich's because it is against their religion.
Im sure they would not appreciate it if you wore your ass less chaps into their store wearing a g string,No matter how much you argue that is your freedom of expression or free speech,

I agree, I wouldn't want anyones bare ass out in a deli, we have laws for that.

 

[Padawanbater2]

The jewish deli owner does not serve ham sandwichs because pork is against their religion.

Valid religious justification because it doesn't single out or deny goods/services to any person or group based on race, color, religion, sex or national origin (& by proxy sexual identity/orientation). Not discrimination

the Christian baker does not make gay wedding cakes because its against their religion

Invalid religious justification because it does single out or deny goods/services to a specific person or group based on race, color, religion, sex or national origin (& by proxy sexual identity/orientation). Is discrimination

The first amendment trumps your civil rights argument.

The first amendment doesn't guarantee the right to discriminate against people. The freedom of religion is not obstructed by accepting civil rights in accordance with federal law, especially when considering the exclusion clause, that is I have the freedom of religion just as much as I have the freedom from religion. Meaning your religious beliefs are all fine and dandy inside your church or house, but forcing me to take part in something I don't believe in, and better yet making me pay for it via taxes and local and/or federal government is neither conservative nor republican. It's theocratic.

The reason for this law Is when your gay activists don't get their way then its time to get a lawyer and sue,

Watch how well that turns out..

Also, weren't you just harping about how the bill isn't about discrimination of homosexuals?

this law protects the jewish deli owner from militant ham sandwich freaks,

that's all it does, if you homos want to get married go ahead.

???

Read the first amendment :congress shall make NO LAW regarding the establishment of religion or the free excersise thereof.Do you understand what that means?

... Do you?