Al B. FAQt
- Thread starter Al B. Fuct
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Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Did.
Aside from your stretch prob, everything looks really nice.
The plants will certainly stretch a bit more. They take 4 weeks in 12/12 to finally quit growing vegetatively and fully switch on flowering. The amount of veg growth will also be affected by the amount of veg time they were given before being chucked in to flower. Obviously, more veg time, the more veg growth you'll get before they fully taper off veg growth in wk4.
Vegging with fluoros can be responsible for the long internodal spacing. High temps can exacerbate stretch as well. Don't know where your temps are running, I see your cooltube, hopefully it's not too much over 26C. Not seeing a lot of heat stress in leaves, can't be too bad.
You might have kept tying them down longer, but by now your screen would have been more than filled anyway.
We may know what's caused the stretch but how should you cope with it now, as it's impossible to turn back the clock? The only thing I can think of is to nip off the growing tips. This robs you of the largest colas which form on each branch, but will put an immediate halt to the plants getting any bigger. The plant will divert its efforts to bulking up the remaining buds. You have a lot of light for the space you have, so I expect you'll get some nice dense buds, regardless.
If you can find the necessary vertical space, SoG may be worth a go. SoG ops need vertical clearance suiting plants which usually come up to about 40" max. With a cooltube, your lamp-leaf clearance can be 12-18" depending on the size of the HPS you're using.
You've got your conditions darn close to right, shows in the nice looking leaves. I have high hopes for your next crop with a few minor process alterations.
ding ding dingwell shit al that might be why i failed at your method...i was using the 1 inchers....very hard to get them just right ...they were either super dry or soaked...even with the corner watering....i wonder if that's why i failed?
ladeez & gennamun, we have a winrar!
Yes, I'm very confident that you're right- the 25mm cubes were the problem.
Get some 40mm, plastic wrapped cubes and try again.
Pay close attention to watering. 40mm cubes weigh 5g dry, 20-25g when properly just damp, not saturated. I bet things come good in a hurry if you do that, in concert with good temp control (28-30C) in your clonebox.
If I can reliably get 100% strikes in 7-10 days with certain conditions, you should get the same with the same.
You DO have to accurately duplicate my process & conditions, though. Seemingly minor changes can have significant effects.
I have used it in the past, but the effects didn't seem to justify the outrageous cost of the stuff. I know it doesn't hurt anything, anyway. It's been so long since I've used it that I could not quote a dosage rate.
Superthrive is a 'magic sauce' (additive with unknown/unidentified contents) but one with at least some reasonable science owing at least to their acknowledgment of the vitamin B content in the stuff. There's some reputable botanical science that shows vit B can be helpful. I suspect that other brands of vitamin B additives would do the same thing.
grandpabear3
New Member
ding ding ding
ladeez & gennamun, we have a winrar!
Yes, I'm very confident that you're right- the 25mm cubes were the problem.
Get some 40mm, plastic wrapped cubes and try again.
Brutal, ....just brutal. but honest. thank you, maybe i'll give it a go.
i guess the size was more than a preference. sorry for the confusion. and thanks for the help.. any advice on being overrun with houseflies?
ladeez & gennamun, we have a winrar!
Yes, I'm very confident that you're right- the 25mm cubes were the problem.
Get some 40mm, plastic wrapped cubes and try again.
Brutal, ....just brutal. but honest. thank you, maybe i'll give it a go.
i guess the size was more than a preference. sorry for the confusion. and thanks for the help.. any advice on being overrun with houseflies?
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Brutal? Nah, just enthusiastic that you found the source of the difficulty.
The size is indeed a preference- a preference for a size that is easy to handle, holds enough water to permit 1x/24h watering if needed and yields deadly reliable results. I've tried 100mm cubes, 25mm cubes, unwrapped cubes, RW floc packed in seedling trays, blah, blah, blah... and the 40mm wrapped cube won the race.
jeez, not really, other than checking all the flyscreens and seeing to it that the neighbours start burying their dead instead of just leaving them lying about .
Trey57
Well-Known Member
I had the same bug problem in my OP...seeing to it that the neighbours start burying their dead instead of just leaving them lying about .
I sent my girl over to the neighbors to tell them to bury those damn bodies...
I guess she fell in love with him or something cause she hasn't came back yet...
She won't answer her phone anymore either...
Fucking whore...
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Did the fly problem stop when she left? Might be on to something.
grandpabear3
New Member
the dangers of a forum that promotes smoking and typing....lolI had the same bug problem in my OP...
I sent my girl over to the neighbors to tell them to bury those damn bodies...
I guess she fell in love with him or something cause she hasn't came back yet...
She won't answer her phone anymore either...
Fucking whore...
just playin with ya
Trey57
Well-Known Member
LOL... good one AL..Did the fly problem stop when she left? Might be on to something.
Yeah, the flies did leave come to think of it....
Plus I can smell my plants all through the house now....
Damn... all this time she was a walking/talking carbon filter and I let her go...
I said it before and I'll say it again...
fucking whore...
ZEN MASTER
Well-Known Member
hey al, what's going on? look here i'm wanting to switch from soil to hydro.i started outside and did real well(until i got jacked), the next time around i decided to do the inside thing. it's been ok but, i've gotten tired of all of the problems that come with soil(seen and unseen).There are two systems that i am interested in that i can build on my own. The first is the aeroponic type set-up with the six inch pvc pipes, i'm thinking four units 6.5ft long each with its own rez(8-10 gal)for proper nuts for each stage, eight spaces for net cups on each unit.
The second would be the type that uses a 18 gal plastic tote with the holes cut in the lid. Basically it would be the same set-up; four units each with their own rez(8-10 gal), but maybe with 12-15 holes in the lid.
like i said this is my intro to hydro so i'm not sure what are the pro's and con's of each of these kinds of units. so if you could give me your opinion on what i should start with it would be greatly appreciated, and graciously accepted.
also please take into account that this is being built and applied as per your instructions on havesting every two weeks.
THANK YOU IN ADVANCE,
-ZEN-
Shit i almost forgot what is your recomendation for the amount of nutes(ppm) for each of the four stages?
The second would be the type that uses a 18 gal plastic tote with the holes cut in the lid. Basically it would be the same set-up; four units each with their own rez(8-10 gal), but maybe with 12-15 holes in the lid.
like i said this is my intro to hydro so i'm not sure what are the pro's and con's of each of these kinds of units. so if you could give me your opinion on what i should start with it would be greatly appreciated, and graciously accepted.
also please take into account that this is being built and applied as per your instructions on havesting every two weeks.
THANK YOU IN ADVANCE,
-ZEN-
Shit i almost forgot what is your recomendation for the amount of nutes(ppm) for each of the four stages?
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
Neither one. Aeroponics is not a method I'd suggest for a new hydro grower.
New hydro growers will have the greatest chance for success with flood systems with plants in pots of absorbent media. Even long experienced growers will appreciate the ability to pick up plants and move them around for maintenance or to put slowies in better light positions.
1400 from go to whoa.
ZEN MASTER
Well-Known Member
thanks dude. since your word is pretty much law around here, i'm printing out plans for a flood an drain table as i'm typing.but look here i know now that there are not any pro's for me, but what could go wrong because they seem like pretty easy set-up to maintain.
P.S.once the tables are built, do you have or know where i could go to actually learn how to use it? as far as what type of medium is best, what size pump, how often should i flood and drain, should i flood and drain only while lights are on,off, just ballpark stuff because i see you use that techniques(thanks for the tips on the nutes i thought i was going to be getting back a christmas list of instructions,LOL)
P.P.S.
YOU ARE THE FUCTING MAN,DUDE!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for the time. Hopefully this will do for a while.
PEACE!!!
P.S.once the tables are built, do you have or know where i could go to actually learn how to use it? as far as what type of medium is best, what size pump, how often should i flood and drain, should i flood and drain only while lights are on,off, just ballpark stuff because i see you use that techniques(thanks for the tips on the nutes i thought i was going to be getting back a christmas list of instructions,LOL)
P.P.S.
YOU ARE THE FUCTING MAN,DUDE!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for the time. Hopefully this will do for a while.
PEACE!!!
Lobo69
Active Member
Hey Al,
I have a few questions on your cloning method.
How is the ventilation in your box setup? I know you keep the temps up with a heating mat. Do you ventilate the box? Intake? Exhaust?
What's your thermostat connected to(intake, exhaust)? What is the temp/humidity inside your clone box?
Thanks in advance, you da man...
Oh yeah...
Is perlite a good substitute for the fytocell in this setup? I was reading a previous post in which I believe you said you used straight rockwool floc in your pots, but now you use the fyto-floc mix. Why did you switch to fyto-floc...
Okay 1 more.
I was wondering how low the temp flowing through the cooltubes can be...I am planning on either bringing air from outside in the winter or exhausting it ...say -15 degrees celcius intake. wll the air being exhausted produce steam(would look a bit shady). What could i do to prevent this...
Lobo
I have a few questions on your cloning method.
How is the ventilation in your box setup? I know you keep the temps up with a heating mat. Do you ventilate the box? Intake? Exhaust?
What's your thermostat connected to(intake, exhaust)? What is the temp/humidity inside your clone box?
Thanks in advance, you da man...
Oh yeah...
Is perlite a good substitute for the fytocell in this setup? I was reading a previous post in which I believe you said you used straight rockwool floc in your pots, but now you use the fyto-floc mix. Why did you switch to fyto-floc...
Okay 1 more.
I was wondering how low the temp flowing through the cooltubes can be...I am planning on either bringing air from outside in the winter or exhausting it ...say -15 degrees celcius intake. wll the air being exhausted produce steam(would look a bit shady). What could i do to prevent this...
Lobo
Al B. Fuct
once had a dog named
eeeek.
Please, no. While I appreciate very much that you value my input, I absolutely cringe when folks say stuff like this. I absolutely do fuck it up and OFTEN. 'Thanks Al' will do. Watering systems get no easier to set up and operate than floods. Impossible to clog. All that can go wrong is a pump or timer failure. If you keep a spare pump handy (and they're not expensive), you're well covered.
well, yeah... probably right here.
Depends on how you care to work in the op. Pots stuffed with media which holds a bit of water like rockwool floc and Fytocell are good for stoned slackers (like me) who may not want to look in on the op every day. If a pump or timer fails, there's enough water stored in the media to carry the plants through for a day (and a bit more with rockwool) until you have a chance to correct the problem. However, highly absorbent media does not allow you to flood frequently without drowning roots. 1x/day is enough for RW, 3x/day for Fytocell.
Media like clay pellets don't hold as much water. The large airspaces between pellets allows you to flood more often, starting with about 5x per lights-on. Since the nutes in the tank are being constantly aerated with an air pump/bubble curtain, freshly oxygenated nutes can be run through the rootmasses more frequently than in highly absorbent media, increasing vigor and growth. Simply flooding and draining also draws more air into the media as when the flood level falls, air replaces water in the medium. It's almost impossible to overwater in pellets. With large, mature plants, you could conceivably flood 1x/hour for 5mins per flood.
However, pellets are hard to dispose of and while theoretically reusable, are a total bitch to clean fully free of old root matter from the last crop. If you don't fully clean & sterilise pellets before re-use, root diseases can be passed form crop to crop.
Clones in RW cubes must be nested in the pellets so the cube is about 1/2" above the flood level. The cube itself must not be allowed to be saturated. Plants in RW cubes just introduced to pellets should have the pellets around the cube (NOT the cube itself) hand-watered from the top for a week or so until the roots have knit down into the damp pellets.
Just about any centrifugal aquarium type water pump will do from the smallest 400L/hr pump (I get those for $11 ea, shop around) on up. Cheaper pumps don't last as long as more exxy ones which move a lot more water, but you really don't need a pump that moves oceans. All your pump needs to do is flood the tray to the overflow tube level within a few (3-5) minutes, then shut off.
A big pump (I now use 2000L/hr pumps) IS nice for when you're draining the tank, if you have installed a valving system like this depicted, to make draining easy. A bigger pump drains the tank faster. Just switch the valves to the drain position (close #1, open #2) and go get a coffee. When you're done with that coffee, the tank will be empty and ready to be cleaned & refilled with fresh sauce. Be sure to switch the valves back to the operating position or your new tank of sauce is going down the gurgler when the timer next runs.
Yep, no need to flood during lights-off. The plants transpire very little water in darkness as photosynthesis has halted. The amount of water contained in the rootmass will be sufficient until 'morning.' The last watering should happen no later than an hour before lights-off.
Well, the heat mat actually is only responsible for keeping the RW cubes warm.
The air is kept warm by waste heat from the fluoro ballasts.
Not seen in this pic, and for winter use only, I do have a very small (120mm), cheapo desk fan in the box now, mounted above the fluoros and pointed upward. This evens out the air temp within the clonebox so the warm air at the top of the box is mixed with cooler air from below, around the clones. Air temp is set by the thermostat (can't be seen in this pic, it's mounted down low, at plant level), which switches the 100mm exhaust fan (seen in upper left on back wall of clonebox) on when the temp reaches 30C. When the temp has come down to ~28C, it switches off until the temps come up to 30C again.
Humidity in the box isn't as critical as temp. The RH in this clonebox varies but the temp is bang-on 30C +/-1C at all times.
The thermostat I use is sold in Australia at Jaycar Electronics stores. You can order it online and they ship worldwide.
The maker of the tstat is 'Computime' (model 098A) if you care to try to find it locally. the main reason I love this tstat so much is that it can directly switch 240V AC mains devices, either for cooling or heating. I'm sure there's an equivalent in Nth America or the UK if you can't get this particular one. Common HVAC tstats often can't switch line voltage, rather are designed for 24-36V control voltages found in central heating systems. Make sure whatever tstat you select is capable of switching devices at your local line voltage.
The size of the clonebox isn't terribly critical. My clonebox is fashioned from an old plywood shipping container which is roughly 800mm tall x 600mm deep x 1m wide, should you care to know. There is no intake fan, just a passive intake down low on the back wall, covered with flyscreen. I cover this intake in winter (bit o' packing tape) and allow intake air to come in around the poorly fitting front cover of the box.
Yep, perlite will work pretty well. It can escape the pot drain holes, so a 25-50mm layer of floc, tightly packed in the bottom of each pot, keeps the perlite (or Fytocell) in the pot while allowing water to flow in and out of the pot during flooding.
RW floc is HIGHLY absorbent, better than a sponge. It's actually too absorbent and you have to use care not to allow it to be saturated. You can only water pots of RW floc 1x/day without inducing overwatering symptoms, especially in small plants. Fytocell can be flooded more often; I'm flooding plants 3x/lights-on post wk2 now.
It's important to note that the RW & Fytocell in my pots isn't actually mixed, as such. The floc is packed in a 25-50mm thick layer, very tightly in the bottom of each pot to act as a filter. Keeps the Fytocell crumbs in the pots. Fytocell has a very high air content (40%) and tends to float. When the layer of floc is wetted, the pots won't float.
The colder, the better! Mind you, I think I would not draw air in at below -100C as this might shatter the HPS tube envelope. Of course, the only way you'll get temps low enough to do any harm is to use liquefied air on your intakes, something you're probably not going to do.
If the cooltubes have a closed air circuit (drawing air in from outside the grow & dumping it outside as well), it will not be picking up the humidity transpired (or scents) from the plants and so will not produce any steam, even in very cold temps, unlike air from your clothes dryer or exhaust gases sent up a chimney from a natural gas water heater.
DR. VonDankenstine
Well-Known Member
Whats up brother?---Does that tstat come in 120v or is there a mod that can be made?--I'm going to use it set up to my exhaust fan. Anyway-hope you are well and that all is good...
bigtittymilf
Well-Known Member
hey alby could you check out this post i made and gimme a hand when you have a minute its long so im not gonna retype it
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/100666-need-help-asap-please-i.html
thanks man for any help
https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/100666-need-help-asap-please-i.html
thanks man for any help
toast master
Well-Known Member
Hey ABf ...... been sitting on the sidlines for some time, soaking it all up and just wanted to say many big thanks ..............
I hope i can pass along a llitle info for all . Have been running your op for 2 mo. getting ready to get that first harvest.. some things i changed were mostly enviromental.. I had problems getting fytocell so i use perlite, to stop any from escaping i use landscape fabric , cut 2 in. larger than the bottom of the pot . soak a couple of hand full of rock floc in a bucket of water and use it to hold the fabric in place like putty. I then top with perlite to full. It works real well .... no spills, water wicks right thru , since thats whats its for.... no more floc escaping.... clogging pumps hope some find this usefull .... I know you dont like praises ... but the test of a true human being is someone who helps and expects nothing in return... thanks again
I hope i can pass along a llitle info for all . Have been running your op for 2 mo. getting ready to get that first harvest.. some things i changed were mostly enviromental.. I had problems getting fytocell so i use perlite, to stop any from escaping i use landscape fabric , cut 2 in. larger than the bottom of the pot . soak a couple of hand full of rock floc in a bucket of water and use it to hold the fabric in place like putty. I then top with perlite to full. It works real well .... no spills, water wicks right thru , since thats whats its for.... no more floc escaping.... clogging pumps hope some find this usefull .... I know you dont like praises ... but the test of a true human being is someone who helps and expects nothing in return... thanks again
ZEN MASTER
Well-Known Member
hey dude thanks for the info. i plan on getting started a.s.a.p., i think i'll start with some 5L pots.
and as for the ealier comment, didn't mean to freak you out. its just that there are a lot of people on this joint that have a lot of xperience and tested methods that are awesome. but for the most part yours is easier to understand for the xtreme novice, or beginner, and most of the time better,just my opinion ya know.
but anyway i'm out.
and here's a +rep for your time.PEACE!!!!
-ZEN-
and as for the ealier comment, didn't mean to freak you out. its just that there are a lot of people on this joint that have a lot of xperience and tested methods that are awesome. but for the most part yours is easier to understand for the xtreme novice, or beginner, and most of the time better,just my opinion ya know.
but anyway i'm out.
and here's a +rep for your time.PEACE!!!!
-ZEN-
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