Donald Trump

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SamsonsRiddle

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But no one can say what is true and not true in a book that is thousands of years old and filled with tales that defy all logic.
How would you know the logic of what is in the bible if you've never tried to understand it? How could you know that it can or can't be proven if you don't understand it? You don't know any of the symbolism, prophecy, or many other details that prove its truth.
 

FauxRoux

Well-Known Member
It doesn't matter what I believe, the word "YES" is not open to interpretation.
TAUTOLOGY: (a sub-category of circular argument) defining terms or qualifying an argument in such a way that it would be impossible to disprove the argument. Often, the rationale for the argument is merely a restatement of the conclusion in different words.
 

SamsonsRiddle

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Hold on there......if he can trust his own opinion which is based on his own experience that's fine. As long as the person has the desire to continue learning and exploring, which he seems to be doing right now. I think hes doing ok.

Just because you hear both sides of something doesn't mean you choose "right". It just means your making a more well rounded decision. But even then It can still be subjective sometimes. In which case his "gut" is all hes got, so he better trust it.
One person may experience life and rejoice, while another may be constantly bombarded by pain - still the truth is the truth. So his opinion based on experiences is subjective - especially when it comes to his experiences with something he's never experienced (based on his own admission).

Someone may continue to learn and explore, but have already decided not to hear the truth no matter how much it can be proven (ie. people who celebrate christmas and church on sunday even though both are ridiculously ignorant of what the bible says).
 

superloud

Well-Known Member
How would you know the logic of what is in the bible if you've never tried to understand it? How could you know that it can or can't be proven if you don't understand it? You don't know any of the symbolism, prophecy, or many other details that prove its truth.
Umm just because I haven't read it front to back dosent mean I haven't spent most my life hearing and reading the stories. You making assumptions that I don't know of wats in the bible just because I haven't read it all.
 

superloud

Well-Known Member
How would you know the logic of what is in the bible if you've never tried to understand it? How could you know that it can or can't be proven if you don't understand it? You don't know any of the symbolism, prophecy, or many other details that prove its truth.
Just one example johna and the whale
 

Lord Kanti

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TAUTOLOGY: (a sub-category of circular argument) defining terms or qualifying an argument in such a way that it would be impossible to disprove the argument. Often, the rationale for the argument is merely a restatement of the conclusion in different words.
Volume 5, Book 59, Number 369:

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:

Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab). "The Prophet said, "You may say it."

Do give us all your interpretation of the meaning behind the word "YES"
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
Umm just because I haven't read it front to back dosent mean I haven't spent most my life hearing and reading the stories. You making assumptions that I don't know of wats in the bible just because I haven't read it all.
???? You are saying you haven't read it all, but reject it because of what you have read? How do you know you didn't miss a main point? How do you know the stories you heard from others were true? How do you know anything for yourself if you just always receive it third hand?

I believed a lot of things about god and the bible before i read and studied it every day, now i just look back at myself as ignorant. Hey man, we can all be wrong especially if we don't take the time to know for sure we're right.

Don't listen to me, though, because i'm just some guy.
 

FauxRoux

Well-Known Member
Someone may continue to learn and explore, but have already decided not to hear the truth no matter how much it can be proven (ie. people who celebrate christmas and church on sunday even though both are ridiculously ignorant of what the bible says).
Are you trying to save them?

well for all those jesus folk in the room I might remind them

2 Timothy 2:14-26
14Keep reminding God’s people of these things.Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen. 15Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 16Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly. 17Their teaching will spread like gangrene.
 

FauxRoux

Well-Known Member
Volume 5, Book 59, Number 369:

Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:

Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab). "The Prophet said, "You may say it."

Do give us all your interpretation of the meaning behind the word "YES"
TAUTOLOGY: (a sub-category of circular argument) defining terms or qualifying an argument in such a way that it would be impossible to disprove the argument. Often, the rationale for the argument is merely a restatement of the conclusion in different words.

everyone agrees...he said it...so what?
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
Are you trying to save them?

well for all those jesus folk in the room I might remind them

2 Timothy 2:14-26
14Keep reminding God’s people of these things.Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen. 15Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a worker who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth. 16Avoid godless chatter, because those who indulge in it will become more and more ungodly. 17Their teaching will spread like gangrene.
“Do not give what is holy to the dogs; nor cast your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn and tear you in pieces."
 

superloud

Well-Known Member
???? You are saying you haven't read it all, but reject it because of what you have read? How do you know you didn't miss a main point? How do you know the stories you heard from others were true? How do you know anything for yourself if you just always receive it third hand?

I believed a lot of things about god and the bible before i read and studied it every day, now i just look back at myself as ignorant. Hey man, we can all be wrong especially if we don't take the time to know for sure we're right.

Don't listen to me, though, because i'm just some guy.
Where did I say I reject it? I said I question the existance of god. And that the bible can not prove anyone right or wrong wich is 100% fact.
 

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
Where did I say I reject it? I said I question the existance of god. And that the bible can not prove anyone right or wrong wich is 100% fact.
100% fact? Maybe you should study the prophecies. It should only take the rest of your life to figure them all out. good luck
 

superloud

Well-Known Member
100% fact? Maybe you should study the prophecies. It should only take the rest of your life to figure them all out. good luck
Why study the prophecies? I go threw life with a completely open mind. Or I could read a book written thousands of years ago say it's truth and have a closed mind to all other options. I'll choose to get my answers about life from life not a book written along time ago.
 

Lord Kanti

Well-Known Member
TAUTOLOGY: (a sub-category of circular argument) defining terms or qualifying an argument in such a way that it would be impossible to disprove the argument. Often, the rationale for the argument is merely a restatement of the conclusion in different words.

everyone agrees...he said it...so what?
You keep blathering on about my supposed beliefs as if I wrote the Koran and Hadith. You continually make assumptions and draw your own conclusions that ultimately are the fruit of your own beliefs. I posted black and white quotes from the books of Islam and Christianity that are polar opposite from one another, cited evidence that the religions are not the same, yet somehow this is not evidence, but just my personal beliefs according to several posters here.

As @Flaming Pie said, personal beliefs are irrelevant in regards to this discussion.

You bring up Muslims being inherently violent.
Your friend brought up one religion being good, the other evil... if anyone is injecting personal belief into this discussion it is not I.
 

FauxRoux

Well-Known Member
You keep blathering on about my supposed beliefs as if I wrote the Koran and Hadith.
No, were going on about you expressing a sentiment that isn't true and your inability to show proof of the implications of a comparison you've made. Other then the literal words you referenced to make it.

So yes these words are a physical thing on paper that preach parallel things, that is true. The insinuation made by pointing them out is still unsubstantiated. ball->your court..... still.....

You continually make assumptions and draw your own conclusions that ultimately are the fruit of your own beliefs.
What assumptions have we made?

I posted black and white quotes from the books of Islam and Christianity that are polar opposite from one another, cited evidence that the religions are not the same, yet somehow this is not evidence, but just my personal beliefs according to several posters here.
So you say the "black and white quotes" are relevant evidence of difference. How is it relevant? Are you simply saying its relevant proof that there is a literal difference in teachings?... (Cause telling me cats aren't dogs would just be fuckin stupid)... Or are you saying its relevant because that difference in teaching is having an impact on its followers or the world in some tangible way?
 
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