Why Has No One Killed George Zimmerman?

[UncleBuck]

Do you not have the ability to place yourself in a different context?

Rape, the violent and forceful violation of someone could never be acceptable. It might not be illegal in some societies across time.

We only call sex with a 10 year old bad and make it illegal on the basis that a 10 year old can not consent. Can you not imagine a society that did not have this legal constraint?

If the consent of the 10 year old is deemd to be valid, then what is wrong with him or her consenting to it?

The fact that some societies have allowed it goes to show it can be moral. It can also be immoral. In a society where 10 year olds are having sex 10 year olds are prepared to have sex. These 10 year olds would be different from our 10 year olds, who are by and large sheltered from sexuality.

why are you so intent on telling me why you think it should be OK to have sex with 10 year old children?

 

[Ace Yonder]

That is a good example of my point that says it is possible to have a society where it is not considered amoral.

Moral values are different across time.

I agree some societies consider it moral. But they are wrong. When viewed from a Utilitarian perspective, morals are not subjective. To me, that is conflating morals with mores, which are subjective. Certain groups have immoral mores, and are largely ignorant of the difference between the two ideas.

 

[NLXSK1]

I agree some societies consider it moral. But they are wrong. When viewed from a Utilitarian perspective, morals are not subjective. To me, that is conflating morals with mores, which are subjective. Certain groups have immoral mores, and are largely ignorant of the difference between the two ideas.

So you have decided your moral values exceed all of some societies. Since you apparently are the expert, could you please set the universal age for consent?

 

[Ace Yonder]

Do you not have the ability to place yourself in a different context?

Rape, the violent and forceful violation of someone could never be acceptable. It might not be illegal in some societies across time.

We only call sex with a 10 year old bad and make it illegal on the basis that a 10 year old can not consent. Can you not imagine a society that did not have this legal constraint?

If the consent of the 10 year old is deemd to be valid, then what is wrong with him or her consenting to it?

The fact that some societies have allowed it goes to show it can be moral. It can also be immoral. In a society where 10 year olds are having sex 10 year olds are prepared to have sex. These 10 year olds would be different from our 10 year olds, who are by and large sheltered from sexuality.

The problem is that to believe this would require active rejection of many things we know about human psychology and child development and the effect of sexual experiences on that development. No 10 year old is actually prepared for sex, no matter how much they think they are, no matter what culture they are from. Their brains are not physically developed enough to handle that in a healthy way. It's science.

 

[ThickStemz]

I don't buy the Moral Relativity bullshit. As an Atheist Utilitarian, things that cause harm are always immoral, no matter what society says, and fucking a 10 year old always causes harm, thus it is never moral. Case closed.

We can all imagine the harm that is caused to an American child who was forced into a sexual relationship with an adult.

My question to you would be, what harm is endured to these young teens who are forced married in Iran?

You cant answer this by an American standard. Its not as if but for this marriage early in her life she would go on to medical school and become a doctor and then cure diabeties.

What is the life hindering impact of these early teen brides compare to their more moderate neighbors who's parents wait until 16 or 18 to arrange their marriage. No one can argue that a late teens body isn't ready for sexual activity. In America we might say their minds aren't. But you cant judge these things appropriately by our standards. We have to use theirs.

 

[Ace Yonder]

We can all imagine the harm that is caused to an American child who was forced into a sexual relationship with an adult.

My question to you would be, what harm is endured to these young teens who are forced married in Iran?

You cant answer this by an American standard. Its not as if but for this marriage early in her life she would go on to medical school and become a doctor and then cure diabeties.

What is the life hindering impact of these early teen brides compare to their more moderate neighbors who's parents wait until 16 or 18 to arrange their marriage. No one can argue that a late teens body isn't ready for sexual activity. In America we might say their minds aren't. But you cant judge these things appropriately by our standards. We have to use theirs.

No we don't have to use theirs. There are well documented effects on brain development that are caused by early sexual experiences, we can use science to set universal standards.

 

[ThickStemz]

The problem is that to believe this would require active rejection of many things we know about human psychology and child development and the effect of sexual experiences on that development. No 10 year old is actually prepared for sex, no matter how much they think they are, no matter what culture they are from. Their brains are not physically developed enough to handle that in a healthy way. It's science.

Their cultures do not handle it in a healthy way.

What sexual freedom does any woman have in that society? Again, you seem to have difficulty getting out of your western mindset here.

 

[ThickStemz]

No we don't have to use theirs. There are well documented effects on brain development that are caused by early sexual experiences, we can use science to set universal standards.

I would agree mostly. But as I said, sexualization in these societies for women is contrary, on the whole, to what we know of psycological science.

How is the harm worse for a child bride in Iran than the entire culturizarion that she is the property of her father then husband. She can express no or little of her own sexuality. She was likely circumcised as a baby. Her entire sexual personality is washed clean.

What difference does it make to marry this piece of warm flesh with tits and a hole off at 10 or 16?

 

[Ace Yonder]

So you have decided your moral values exceed all of some societies. Since you apparently are the expert, could you please set the universal age for consent?

Depends on what you are consenting to. The brain isn't fully formed until, on average, around age 25, so before you are 25, relationships with people over 25 could easily be harmful as you lack the cognitive development of your partner. To be on the safe side, I would say universally, before 25 you can give consent to anyone within 10% of your age difference, after 25 you can give consent to anyone (though if they are under 25 they cannot give consent to you).

 

[UncleBuck]

you seem to have difficulty getting out of your western mindset here.

you seem to be having difficulty getting out of your pedo mindset.

 

[Ace Yonder]

I would agree mostly. But as I said, sexualization in these societies for women is contrary, on the whole, to what we know of psycological science.

How is the harm worse for a child bride in Iran than the entire culturizarion that she is the property of her father then husband. She can express no or little of her own sexuality. She was likely circumcised as a baby. Her entire sexual personality is washed clean.

What difference does it make to marry this piece of warm flesh with tits and a hole off at 10 or 16?

You have it backwards. Making her a child bride is the thing that allows the perpetuation as the "Women as property of older men" dynamic in society as a whole, because women will always be subject to the wills of a man who is more cognitively developed than she is, and thus has more control of the relationship dynamic and will use that to reinforce the sexist ideology of his beliefs.

 

[ThickStemz]

You have it backwards. Making her a child bride is the thing that allows the perpetuation as the "Women as property of older men" dynamic in society as a whole, because women will always be subject to the wills of a man who is more cognitively developed than she is, and thus has more control of the relationship dynamic and will use that to reinforce the sexist ideology of his beliefs.

That would be a good point but for even in a place like Iran it is the minority. More marriages are between similarly aged people.

It is a paternalistic society. And if it wasn't her husband it would be her father who brow beat her. They don't need husbands to keep the women subordinated.

 

[NLXSK1]

Depends on what you are consenting to. The brain isn't fully formed until, on average, around age 25, so before you are 25, relationships with people over 25 could easily be harmful as you lack the cognitive development of your partner. To be on the safe side, I would say universally, before 25 you can give consent to anyone within 10% of your age difference, after 25 you can give consent to anyone (though if they are under 25 they cannot give consent to you).

So we can send people to war at 18 but they are not ready for sex till 25? LOL!!! How many people have not had sex before 25?

Seems like science doesnt have a good grasp on society and reality.

 

[Ace Yonder]

So we can send people to war at 18 but they are not ready for sex till 25? LOL!!! How many people have not had sex before 25?

Seems like science doesnt have a good grasp on society and reality.

You clearly didn't read what I wrote. I said sex was 100% okay before 25, it just had to be with someone less than 10% older or younger than you. So two 14 year olds can do whatever they want with eachother, they just can't sleep with adults (Sex isn't inherently damaging, sex (and sexual relationships whether or not actual sex in involved, I would not support a child marrying an old man even if there would be no sex) between people of vastly different developmental levels is)

 

[ThickStemz]

You clearly didn't read what I wrote. I said sex was 100% okay before 25, it just had to be with someone less than 10% older or younger than you. So two 14 year olds can do whatever they want with eachother, they just can't sleep with adults (Sex isn't inherently damaging, sex (and sexual relationships whether or not actual sex in involved, I would not support a child marrying an old man even if there would be no sex) between people of vastly different developmental levels is)

If it is ok for 14 year olds to be having sex, what on earth does the age of the 14 year olds partner have to do with it?

A penis entering a vagina is essentially the same at 14 as it is at 41, although I'm sure that 14 year old honey pot is a lot sweeter, but the 41 year old knows how to use that thing to its fullest. Same with penises. A 14 year old penis Can go all night long. But a 41 year old cock can satisfy the woman the first time.

 

[UncleBuck]

I'm sure that 14 year old honey pot is a lot sweeter

fucking pedo.

 

[bundee1]

My stomach kinda turned.

 

[Ace Yonder]

If it is ok for 14 year olds to be having sex, what on earth does the age of the 14 year olds partner have to do with it?

A penis entering a vagina is essentially the same at 14 as it is at 41, although I'm sure that 14 year old honey pot is a lot sweeter, but the 41 year old knows how to use that thing to its fullest. Same with penises. A 14 year old penis Can go all night long. But a 41 year old cock can satisfy the woman the first time.

Sounds like you've fantasized about this a bit too much... did you happen to turn 41 this year?

 

[NLXSK1]

You clearly didn't read what I wrote. I said sex was 100% okay before 25, it just had to be with someone less than 10% older or younger than you. So two 14 year olds can do whatever they want with eachother, they just can't sleep with adults (Sex isn't inherently damaging, sex (and sexual relationships whether or not actual sex in involved, I would not support a child marrying an old man even if there would be no sex) between people of vastly different developmental levels is)

So two sexually immature people having sex is ok but a mature person and an immature person having sex is bad? Not advocating the latter, it just seems the former is logically impossible.

It seems more like the pseudoscience you are suggesting is more about what people feel is ok rather than actually having some scientific basis.

 

[UncleBuck]

a mature person and an immature person having sex is bad?

keep it up, i've been saving for a sig featuring right wingers making pedophilia-suggestive comments.