And the noose continues to tighten..

UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
That's an interesting question. There has been quite a bit of obstruction in Congress to stop any action on climate change. Hillary, by the way was in the Senate for one term. Most of that time it was controlled by Republicans. Junior Senators from the minority party don't get the chance to implement big changes like that.

Are you aware that most Republicans subscribe to the idea that there is no global warming?
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didn't republicans propose a cap and trade bill, and then run away from their own idea once the black president got behind it?
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Your land value would likely go down if sea levels rise as high as projected. Not to worry for you, you'll be dead long before it all happens.
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No. Less land means what's left becomes more valuable, especially with rising population.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
The paper the money is based on will crash; high ground in a flood will always be valuable for keep my irreplaceable ass high and dry, lol!
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So, forget paper money, in the eventuality of the kind of event that is forecast the rise in sea levels, an economic collapse is part of the scenario. Prices will depend on how much assets people have. Prices go down in depressions, which is exactly what will happen when the climate debt comes due because people will have less spending power. During the great depression or the Weimar meltdown, when paper money became worthless, people didn't turn to gold, they turned to bartering. Gold and land will actually decrease in value because people won't have the kind of assets that they do today. As you point out, some special pieces of real estate might become more valuable but not all land that isn't inundated will.

Land like @bluntmassa1 's which is far away from the sea and from the sound of it is not in a desirable location -- no insult intended but he isn't exactly living in a destination resort -- will decline in value because of a lack of buyers and a broken capital system. As a source of independently producing ones needs, it will be valuable to those that manage to keep it but how much butter and eggs can be used to buy land?
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
So, forget paper money, in the eventuality of the kind of event that is forecast the rise in sea levels, an economic collapse is part of the scenario. Prices will depend on how much assets people have. Prices go down in depressions, which is exactly what will happen when the climate debt comes due because people will have less spending power. During the great depression or the Weimar meltdown, when paper money became worthless, people didn't turn to gold, they turned to bartering. Gold and land will actually decrease in value because people won't have the kind of assets that they do today. As you point out, some special pieces of real estate might become more valuable but not all land that isn't inundated will.

Land like @bluntmassa1 's which is far away from the sea and from the sound of it is not in a desirable location -- no insult intended but he isn't exactly living in a destination resort -- will decline in value because of a lack of buyers and a broken capital system. As a source of independently producing ones needs, it will be valuable to those that manage to keep it but how much butter and eggs can be used to buy land?
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Butter and eggs FEED YOU. In the event of economic and/or socio-financial collapse, this becomes rather a convenient advantage.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Yes. But the price of land then becomes what?
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If money ceases to have value in relation to land, investments or Doritos, what is the point of asking about its price? Its VALUE then becomes the critical factor, value as defined as the level of its productivity. In unstable times, productive land is nothing short of security against an uncertain future. Such value is simply beyond price.
 
F

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
Lol care to guess what percentage of the entire US population just got wet? And you don't think that's gonna shake things up a bit?

Go buy beachfront property.
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Care to guess the boost in economy that would create? It was built once, it can easily be built again. This countries infrastructure is falling apart. I think flooding out the majority of it and starting over is one of the best things that could happen to us. Think of the jobs it would create.

Maybe when we rebuild it all we can spread it out a little. No sense in being so packed together. With the advancements in technology and transportation we could easily give ourselves some breathing room.

So yeah, I still don't see the problem.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
ttystikk said:
If money ceases to have value in relation to land, investments or Doritos, what is the point of asking about its price? Its VALUE then becomes the critical factor, value as defined as the level of its productivity. In unstable times, productive land is nothing short of security against an uncertain future. Such value is simply beyond price.
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You may not know it, but you just agreed.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
fdd2blk said:
I'm not really seeing the problem ...

View attachment 3694218
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Try this:

http://choices.climatecentral.org/#9/29.5950/-94.7200?compare=temperatures&carbon-end-yr=2100&scenario-a=warming-4&scenario-b=warming-2

I can't download images but this tool gives better resolution than Google maps. Check out the coastal area around Galveston. That city as well as Port Arthur cease to exist as do many others in the area. Even parts of Houston are inundated. This without storm surges or erosion which will make areas unlivable even it they aren't completely under water.
 
F

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Try this:

http://choices.climatecentral.org/#9/29.5950/-94.7200?compare=temperatures&carbon-end-yr=2100&scenario-a=warming-4&scenario-b=warming-2

I can't download images but this tool gives better resolution than Google maps. Check out the coastal area around Galveston. That city as well as Port Arthur cease to exist as do many others in the area. Even parts of Houston are inundated. This without storm surges or erosion which will make areas unlivable even it they aren't completely under water.
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That's why they move and rebuild. :)
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
fdd2blk said:
If it happens, it happens. I'm taking the best out of the situation. Looking at the bright side, so to speak.
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Yeah, you've said before that it was inevitable so we should just deal with it. I don't think you've thought through what that means. And, it isn't inevitable that we experience 4 degree temperature rise. It is if we don't work to reduce emissions.

The loss of New Orleans, the delta, coral reefs and other habitats, lands and cities. Weigh that cost against implementing less polluting tech. The cost of prevention isn't even close to the cost of losses. So, no, when confronted with rape, sitting back and enjoying it isn't what I'd advise as a good counter measure.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Yeah, you've said before that it was inevitable so we should just deal with it. I don't think you've thought through what that means. And, it isn't inevitable that we experience 4 degree temperature rise. It is if we don't work to reduce emissions.

The loss of New Orleans, the delta, coral reefs and other habitats, lands and cities. Weigh that cost against implementing less polluting tech. The cost of prevention isn't even close to the cost of losses. So, no, when confronted with rape, sitting back and enjoying it isn't what I'd advise as a good counter measure.
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Wellllllll When you're the rapist... that is, the fossil fuel energy companies...
 
F

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
Yeah, you've said before that it was inevitable so we should just deal with it. I don't think you've thought through what that means. And, it isn't inevitable that we experience 4 degree temperature rise. It is if we don't work to reduce emissions.

The loss of New Orleans, the delta, coral reefs and other habitats, lands and cities. Weigh that cost against implementing less polluting tech. The cost of prevention isn't even close to the cost of losses. So, no, when confronted with rape, sitting back and enjoying it isn't what I'd advise as a good counter measure.
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Once I see the whole world actually get on board and start to make measurable changes I may change my mind. Meanwhile, there's no harm in facing reality.

New deltas will be created. New cities will be built. New habitats will develop. Life will not end. Things will simply change. It's what this planet does. Just ask the dinosaurs.

Denying the future won't prevent it.
 
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