The Democratic Divide

Do you support shifting to a more progressive position or incremental change?

  • A more progressive position

  • Incremental change

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Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
This question is posed for progressives

There has been a divide within the Democratic party; those that support progressives like Bernie Sanders and those that support moderates like Hillary Clinton. I'm curious where the members of RIU stand on this issue.

Do you support the Democratic leadership shifting to a more progressive position, or do you support them kind of continuing the course of Obama and Hillary Clinton, small, incremental changes?
 
tangerinegreen555

tangerinegreen555

Well-Known Member
I support the Democratic candidate for president. Period. 12 elections in a row.

Is it always the candidate I wanted?
No.

Am I NOT going to vote for the Democrat to help the right push their agenda?
Fuck No. It just wouldn't make sense to me.

It's not a perfect world, there is no perfect political party, there is no perfect candidate, and I have never had second thoughts in any of those 12 elections.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
tangerinegreen555 said:
I support the Democratic candidate for president. Period.
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I'm not sure I understand

What if the Democratic platform, or at least the one the Democratic party claims to have fundamentally changes from what you support?

Would you still support the Democratic party, just because you believe the Republican party is worse?
 
tangerinegreen555

tangerinegreen555

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
I'm not sure I understand

What if the Democratic platform, or at least the one the Democratic party claims to have fundamentally changes from what you support?

Would you still support the Democratic party, just because you believe the Republican party is worse?
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In the past 12 elections that I voted in, the republican party was worse choice, each and every time. There are fundamental and obvious differences between the platforms of the 2 parties, now and in the past.

The reforms I would support would affect both parties (i.e. campaign finance reform), to get the unsavory big money out of politics.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
tangerinegreen555 said:
In the past 12 elections that I voted in, the republican party was worse choice, each and every time. There are fundamental and obvious differences between the platforms of the 2 parties, now and in the past.

The reforms I would support would affect both parties (i.e. campaign finance reform), to get the unsavory big money out of politics.
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But since neither party largely supports campaign finance reform in any meaningful or pragmatic way, how would supporting one party over the other make much difference in the way of changing those things?

Corporatist Democrats and Republicans want the same things, Republicans (the base) are just too ignorant, scared and manipulated by politicians and media to understand it
 
tangerinegreen555

tangerinegreen555

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
But since neither party largely supports campaign finance reform in any meaningful or pragmatic way, how would supporting one party over the other make much difference in the way of changing those things?

Corporatist Democrats and Republicans want the same things, Republicans (the base) are just too ignorant, scared and manipulated by politicians and media to understand it
Click to expand...
But there's so much more involved than the corporatist angle to things.

The environment alone would keep me from voting for those regressive idiots.

The whole country has drifted to the right over the last 30 years. It's a constant struggle. And it just went a little further last November. I did what I could to prevent it.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
tangerinegreen555 said:
But there's so much more involved than the corporatist angle to things.

The environment alone would keep me from voting for those regressive idiots.

The whole country has drifted to the right over the last 30 years. It's a constant struggle. And it just went a little further last November. I did what I could to prevent it.
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I feel like if they don't represent me in one area that is pretty important to me, they don't represent me, so why should I give them my vote? Just because some other people perceive the other guy to be worse? Isn't that a matter of perspective? Subjective opinion? Isn't that the main problem with the two party system?
 
twostrokenut

twostrokenut

Well-Known Member
tangerinegreen555 said:
But there's so much more involved than the corporatist angle to things.

The environment alone would keep me from voting for those regressive idiots.

The whole country has drifted to the right over the last 30 years. It's a constant struggle. And it just went a little further last November. I did what I could to prevent it.
Click to expand...
Keith Ellison or tom Perez?
 
tangerinegreen555

tangerinegreen555

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
I feel like if they don't represent me in one area that is pretty important to me, they don't represent me, so why should I give them my vote? Just because some other people perceive the other guy to be worse? Isn't that a matter of perspective? Subjective opinion? Isn't that the main problem with the two party system?
Click to expand...
When I'm given 2 choices on something, I will pick the one I feel is closest to my beliefs.
There have been many times there was one aspect I didn't like about who I voted for. But you have to vote for one whole package or the other whole package.

And I always realized I'm not just voting for a president, I'm voting for an entire adminstration. Cabinet positions, judicial appointments, etc. The judicial appointments alone could have decades of influence. I was a 40 year union worker, I prefer judges who support the rights of unions and the NLRB and the middle class.

It's not just one guy, it's a whole group of people.
I voted for Sanders in the primaries as his views were closest to mine.
When he lost, I voted for Clinton in the general election because her views were closest to mine.
 
T

ThickStemz

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
But since neither party largely supports campaign finance reform in any meaningful or pragmatic way, how would supporting one party over the other make much difference in the way of changing those things?

Corporatist Democrats and Republicans want the same things, Republicans (the base) are just too ignorant, scared and manipulated by politicians and media to understand it
Click to expand...
Dude, that may be true, but where you're wrong is that you are equally a sheep and not capable of the critical thought required to achieve your goals. You operate on your feelings of what ought to be. Feelings are rational. And facts aren't subject to opinion.

You support Sanders for things like ending money in politics. Yet you support policies that encourage pumping more money into politics.

You support making the government stronger to do things like promote income equality and force your political agenda which will make the government what decides who wins and who loses.

In a system like you want those with money are forced to try to influence politics.

In a system like what I would favor there would be no need to put money into politics.
 
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