Calli's Conundrums
- Thread starter calliandra
- Start date
dannyboy602
Well-Known Member
Sounds like a plan...wish I still had pix of all those balconies and decks I did...I had such a blast back in the day. Where are you? Washington? Those mountains, like omg! Why would you put maters on a deck when you have ground space for them? You'll get better results with a deeper root run. I could see an herb garden on a deck, that could be beautiful.Ah that's really cool! I will want to pick your mind for sure when I finally get round to designing that space!
Though it's south-facing, light is going to be an issue, the other day I measured the lux (only roughly, with a cell phone app), max was 3500, and the spot where I wanted to place the tomatoes originally was even shy of 1000
I've just officially postponed that for a year - this year I'm just going to put some pots out there and see how things do, observe light, winds... observe observe, then plan and do
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Great to have you aboard! Yes I hope there'll be a thing or two we can scratch our heads over haha!
Yes right in the Alps, with Italy a half-hours and Germany three-quarter-hours ride away.
And yes, I love that garden, with all the people who are connected to it, just spent another lovely afternoon over there today with two amazingly funny and wise women
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Nope other side of the big blue sea, in Austria
Sadly my garden is going to get plowed under when they tear down the old houses and build new ones there. But that'll be another few years. So I have a bit of time to get my balcony garden up... Plus, I need zones, I do best at eating my veggies when they pretty much grow into my mouth
Best tomatoes are those eaten directly off the bush, I swear!
And herbs, most definitely! I have this hunch that truly alive herbs, I could get all my nutes from those alone!
Cheers!
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Just taking a step back, for the big picture.
What this is aaalll about.
Yes, we can heal this land!
What this is aaalll about.
Yes, we can heal this land!
dannyboy602
Well-Known Member
Oh nice...I traveled through Austria...saw Insbruck where they did the Sound of music...funny story: the hostel I stayed in showed The Sound of Music every freakin day at noon for the travelers in the common area. I didnt watch it but I did take a selfie in the gazebo they used in the movie.Nope other side of the big blue sea, in Austria
Sadly my garden is going to get plowed under when they tear down the old houses and build new ones there. But that'll be another few years. So I have a bit of time to get my balcony garden up... Plus, I need zones, I do best at eating my veggies when they pretty much grow into my mouth
Best tomatoes are those eaten directly off the bush, I swear!
And herbs, most definitely! I have this hunch that truly alive herbs, I could get all my nutes from those alone!
Cheers!
ShLUbY
Well-Known Member
This is a nice jam!! I can dig it!Just taking a step back, for the big picture.
What this is aaalll about.
Yes, we can heal this land!
calliandra
Well-Known Member
omg lol! Imagine having to work there haha
I think that must've been Salzburg though, Innsbruck's attractions are the Golden Roof
and Zaha Hadid's ski jump tower
- though they used to take tourists to the old one too haha
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dannyboy602
Well-Known Member
Oh ur right it was salzburg...i was there too....i was a regular tourista....a dumb kid who just had a major break up and liked to run away from his problrms...always been like that.
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Conundrum #2:
Improving the soil of an alfalfa patch
So last year, I planted a patch of alfalfa. I hoped and expected all sorts of things of it, and was duly disappointed when I went to check on the nitrogen fixing nodules in the autumn and there were none!
I was shocked, as the patch I had chosen was never really great but I had gotten some tolerable veggies out of it nonetheless...
So what happened there. Legumes only make nitrogen-fixing nodules when the soil is good enough.
And if my alfalfa doesn't have nodules, it's not hi-nitrogen either.
Again.
I have made the mistake of thinking if I just plant some "enriching" plants in bad soil, they will fix everything up themselves. Various times in my garden.
Oh and that may not even be wrong --- maybe it just takes too long
Here it is, about 70cm x 2m, two days ago - I had fluffed up the leaf mulch a bit a week earlier.
For documentation's sake, I dug up some roots, oh and there were actually one or two tiensy tiny nodules, though I wouldn't really count them considering these nodules can have diametersin the centimeter range under good conditions...
Oh and I need to take pix like this with a ruler or something beside them in future - the plants incl. roots were like 20-25cm long.
And the mini nodules, hm about 2 millimeters diameter?!
Well no wonder.
Assessing this soil under the microscope, I wasn't expecting much.
Fact is, the soil there is worse than I would've expected.
TOTALLY bacterial, not a fungus in sight.
Just a few very sketchy microaggregates built.
Some indications there may be protozoa about.
But most of the stuff you see in there, especially the midsized jaggedy stuff, it's the mineral content of the soil.
I have yet to develop a feeling for how microherd activity fluctuates over the course of the year, but even if they're still kinda dormant due to temps, just the basic setup shows how this soil is pretty much at the lowest stage of succession.
Well, isn't that excellent for some experimentation!
I thought compost tea at first (unless I miraculously find a good source for compost, it'S the max I can do at the mo in that direction).
But I have been reading in Teaming with Fungi how mycorrhizae play an important role for the nitrogen-fixing bacteria to feel at home too.
There has been quite a hype around the mycos hereabouts, in fact it was so bad it turned me off them for a while haha
Like EM, people putting EM everywhere a few years ago - oh and just recently, I saw a professional gardener pour EM solution onto rock-hard, bare soil in the glaring sun, expecting some wonder to happen
So I would actually like to try 2 things:
on one half of this patch, add just mycofungi spores, and the other, mix those spores into my next compost tea.
Just rake the mulch aside, perhaps moisten the soil a bit before (or better after, or both?) watering in the innoculant, then re-cover with the mulch....
I need to think on this a bit more, as I may be overlooking something - any thoughts / ideas welcome!
(yours too, @DonBrennon, when you get your "voice" back )
Improving the soil of an alfalfa patch
So last year, I planted a patch of alfalfa. I hoped and expected all sorts of things of it, and was duly disappointed when I went to check on the nitrogen fixing nodules in the autumn and there were none!
I was shocked, as the patch I had chosen was never really great but I had gotten some tolerable veggies out of it nonetheless...
So what happened there. Legumes only make nitrogen-fixing nodules when the soil is good enough.
And if my alfalfa doesn't have nodules, it's not hi-nitrogen either.
Again.
I have made the mistake of thinking if I just plant some "enriching" plants in bad soil, they will fix everything up themselves. Various times in my garden.
Oh and that may not even be wrong --- maybe it just takes too long
Here it is, about 70cm x 2m, two days ago - I had fluffed up the leaf mulch a bit a week earlier.
For documentation's sake, I dug up some roots, oh and there were actually one or two tiensy tiny nodules, though I wouldn't really count them considering these nodules can have diametersin the centimeter range under good conditions...
Oh and I need to take pix like this with a ruler or something beside them in future - the plants incl. roots were like 20-25cm long.
And the mini nodules, hm about 2 millimeters diameter?!
Well no wonder.
Assessing this soil under the microscope, I wasn't expecting much.
Fact is, the soil there is worse than I would've expected.
TOTALLY bacterial, not a fungus in sight.
Just a few very sketchy microaggregates built.
Some indications there may be protozoa about.
But most of the stuff you see in there, especially the midsized jaggedy stuff, it's the mineral content of the soil.
I have yet to develop a feeling for how microherd activity fluctuates over the course of the year, but even if they're still kinda dormant due to temps, just the basic setup shows how this soil is pretty much at the lowest stage of succession.
Well, isn't that excellent for some experimentation!
I thought compost tea at first (unless I miraculously find a good source for compost, it'S the max I can do at the mo in that direction).
But I have been reading in Teaming with Fungi how mycorrhizae play an important role for the nitrogen-fixing bacteria to feel at home too.
There has been quite a hype around the mycos hereabouts, in fact it was so bad it turned me off them for a while haha
Like EM, people putting EM everywhere a few years ago - oh and just recently, I saw a professional gardener pour EM solution onto rock-hard, bare soil in the glaring sun, expecting some wonder to happen
So I would actually like to try 2 things:
on one half of this patch, add just mycofungi spores, and the other, mix those spores into my next compost tea.
Just rake the mulch aside, perhaps moisten the soil a bit before (or better after, or both?) watering in the innoculant, then re-cover with the mulch....
I need to think on this a bit more, as I may be overlooking something - any thoughts / ideas welcome!
(yours too, @DonBrennon, when you get your "voice" back
)
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calliandra
Well-Known Member
Conundrum #3:
Improving the soil for strawberries with mycorrhizae
I know I don't have enough compost, but I just can't stop haha
So about every 2 years, I have to pull the goutweed, which is firmly (and unreachably) established between the roots of a hydrangea, out of the strawberries, because otherwise, no more strawberries.
Before:
For those who have never seen goutweed roots:
often, the whole strawberry root mass has to be taken apart, either because the goutweed roots can't be pulled out, or because there's a suspicion there may be more strands inside
It's always more than one thought haha
It's a massive disturbance -- but strawberries like it more fungal, and hence preferably undisturbed
lol
So to make up for the chaos and destruction, I innoculated every plant with mycos powder before planting it back into the soil.
Here we can see the area that was weeded & mycorrhized:
Of course, everything got mulched up again in the end.
Leaving the goutweed roots to dry along the edge of the bed as protection from the elements.
After:
I took samples from the tilled part and from the part to the right of the dug-up patch, but didn't see much difference in the samples: in both, the soil structure just "melted", giving very particle-rich samples.
However, there are indications of life in there nonetheless. Bacteria of course, but here, I also found a few strands of fungi, albeit no active "higher" organisms like large flagellates, amoebae or nematodes.
From the clumps of humic / fulvic acids that are all over the soil, there must have been more life in there previously, which brings me back to my newbieness, not knowing whether samples just look like this in spring in general
Here's a really nice one, with tons of fungi starting to grow out on the bottom:
There's also a really interesting growth on the top - looks snake-like but consists of...bacteria I think?
Could be a hypha dissolving, having gotten eaten, and now the bacteria are just hanging out lazily in the glues they produced eating?
I think on this one, I'm not going to do anything else this year (and if I do decide to give them protoplasma water/chlorophyll water, or magically have compost/tea, all of them will get that), just let em grow, and see how soil and plants develop in the mycorrhized part.
Cheers!
Improving the soil for strawberries with mycorrhizae
I know I don't have enough compost, but I just can't stop haha
So about every 2 years, I have to pull the goutweed, which is firmly (and unreachably) established between the roots of a hydrangea, out of the strawberries, because otherwise, no more strawberries.
Before:
For those who have never seen goutweed roots:
often, the whole strawberry root mass has to be taken apart, either because the goutweed roots can't be pulled out, or because there's a suspicion there may be more strands inside
It's always more than one thought haha
It's a massive disturbance -- but strawberries like it more fungal, and hence preferably undisturbed
lolSo to make up for the chaos and destruction, I innoculated every plant with mycos powder before planting it back into the soil.
Here we can see the area that was weeded & mycorrhized:
Of course, everything got mulched up again in the end.
Leaving the goutweed roots to dry along the edge of the bed as protection from the elements.
After:
I took samples from the tilled part and from the part to the right of the dug-up patch, but didn't see much difference in the samples: in both, the soil structure just "melted", giving very particle-rich samples.
However, there are indications of life in there nonetheless. Bacteria of course, but here, I also found a few strands of fungi, albeit no active "higher" organisms like large flagellates, amoebae or nematodes.
From the clumps of humic / fulvic acids that are all over the soil, there must have been more life in there previously, which brings me back to my newbieness, not knowing whether samples just look like this in spring in general
Here's a really nice one, with tons of fungi starting to grow out on the bottom:
There's also a really interesting growth on the top - looks snake-like but consists of...bacteria I think?
Could be a hypha dissolving, having gotten eaten, and now the bacteria are just hanging out lazily in the glues they produced eating?
I think on this one, I'm not going to do anything else this year (and if I do decide to give them protoplasma water/chlorophyll water, or magically have compost/tea, all of them will get that), just let em grow, and see how soil and plants develop in the mycorrhized part.
Cheers!
Mohican
Well-Known Member
What is your soil pH?
In Oregon all of the Hydrangea flowers are blue in reaction to the acidic soil. Here in Southern California the flowers are pink in reaction to the basic soil.
After I started amending my clay soil with leaf compost (I have the lawn people give me the clippings and leaves) my soil became soft and loamy. Now it contains worms the size of small snakes!
Make sure you promote predators in your garden - wasps eat aphids.
I burn all infected plant parts and then add the ash back to the compost pile.
Fish fertilizers and rabbit droppings can be used directly on plants without causing any burn.
You can collect leaves and organic matter from the floor of an old growth forest to obtain mature leaf molds and fungi as a nice starter for your compost.
Do you ever go hunting for fungi?
I want to visit Austria during Christmas. I have a friend who went and the experience he shared in pictures and words revealed a country that loves to celebrate Christmas in style!
In Oregon all of the Hydrangea flowers are blue in reaction to the acidic soil. Here in Southern California the flowers are pink in reaction to the basic soil.
After I started amending my clay soil with leaf compost (I have the lawn people give me the clippings and leaves) my soil became soft and loamy. Now it contains worms the size of small snakes!
Make sure you promote predators in your garden - wasps eat aphids.
I burn all infected plant parts and then add the ash back to the compost pile.
Fish fertilizers and rabbit droppings can be used directly on plants without causing any burn.
You can collect leaves and organic matter from the floor of an old growth forest to obtain mature leaf molds and fungi as a nice starter for your compost.
Do you ever go hunting for fungi?
I want to visit Austria during Christmas. I have a friend who went and the experience he shared in pictures and words revealed a country that loves to celebrate Christmas in style!
ShLUbY
Well-Known Member
i love watching the wasps combing the plants for aphids and other critters. I don't really like them other than that though hahaha. but i see the work they do so i leave em alone
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Hey hi Mo, thanks for stopping by and sharing your garden "secrets"!
I do love your garden, great to know it's got compost as its main engine!Ah yes, the leaf compost
I'm fixing to make my thermal compost as soon as there are lots of greens around, and I'm sure that will step up things in a way as you describe too! TBH if I had enough ready, the whole garden would get innoculated and pronto
As is, I get to try all these things out, gradually, and see what helps how much.
I haven't begun gathering innoculants from intact natural spaces nearby - though last year I did start bringing tiny handsful of soil from my hikes and added them to my wormbin. Retrospectively, that wasn't effective, since the microherd up at 2150m above sea level is surely going to be a different one than down in the valley where I live and garden. Another thing to be aware of.
But yes, definitely something that's in my plan of things, if not in time to go into the woodchip pile thats going into this round of compost, the next!
Oh and I have been pondering how I want to handle diseased plant matter in future, I think composting is quite enough, and possibly more beneficial than burning it first... unless of course it turns out chop and drop isn't a problem, or there is no more infected stuff haha
As for my soil, I don't know its pH
lolNo, seriously, after I learned that there are all sorts of pH's in the rhizosphere, depending on what's being processed there at the mo, and that plants do establish their own pH environment down there, even in adverse soil - I never bothered... hm, maybe I should, just to have the complete data...
The bedrock in my garden is limestone (the Dolomites are just around the corner), and yes, hydrangeas tend to be pink hereabouts
Oh and Christmas! Yes there is a strong catholic tradition that has integrated older pagan customs, paired with americanization has become quite spectacular these past years. I'm quite the grinch LOL and avoid going into town in those times
If you come by Innsbruck though make sure to drop by anyway - I do bake gingerbread and cookies.. and light a solstice fire haha
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calliandra
Well-Known Member
Update @ Conundrum #1
compost tea vs. rust & blackspot
(https://www.rollitup.org/t/callis-conundrums.936771/#post-13425044)
Today, the cherry tree and the 3 roses got their 2nd compost tea application. This time, I brewed up what I have to call protozoan soup -- hardly a sign of fungi, though I did see 1 sprouting, some very long bacteria that almost could've been beginning actinomyces, but just 1 ciliate.
And the rest - very diverse morphologies in the bacteria, and flagelates of all sizes. Not very many testate amoebae (who prefer more fungal environments).
But naked amoebae! I've never had so many in an ACT - or anywhere for that matter lol
Not completely happy, as I was hoping for a more rounded affair.
And because I don't know why this batch turned out so different. It was only 36hrs, and I used blackstrap molasses for the first time (I had been using sugarbeet molasses before I ran out and used that agave sirup last round).
Also not happy with the unsharpness of my images today, nooo idea, I just couldn't get the scope focused right
Well... that's why I'm not doing this for a living, yet
As is, it doesn't matter. So last time they got something way more fungal, not so very protozoan, this time, bigtime protozoa party, and who knows what my iffey brew setup will put out next time haha
End of the day, they get everything.
Of course the midterm goal is to be able to brew my ACTs spot-on for their purpose.
But that, is stuff for another conundrum...
Out into the garden with it!
I've decided to do the compost tea treatments only in one quarted of the garden - which conveniently houses the cherry, the roses, the tomato bed, and will now also include the rest of the bed in which they are (adding a few verrry rusty hollyhocks to the treated plants).
And the cherry tree, spring explosion upcoming in the next 2 days or so
Oh, and the adopted roses have gotten taken out of the ACT-experiment - to adapt to the scarcity of resources
Instead, I'm going to use them to see whether just adding mycos can also mitigate or fend off those spots and rusts (especially these had the rusts, this was also the soil with the actinobacterial and anaerobic pockets).
So, they had mycorrhizae watered in today: pulled the mulch aside and watered them in according to the myco-company's instructions.
The two main adoptives
(there's another row of roses back by the cypress, not sure yet what to do with them... also mycorrhize or as control group? though I have controls all around, for the fungal diseases anyway):
btw... I was at their shop yesterday to request they produce an endo-only mix, which was met with a groan of despair - apparently the beaurocratic side of producing and selling mycorrhizae in Austria is apalling... like trying to walk through quicksand (why was I not really surprised? ), and they're still fighting (I think for bio-certification), though they have been on the market for a few years now.......
So for now, I'm just going to continue using the mix I was using to now (with ectos, tricos, and assorted bacteria added - "universal" type mix), but have begun paying more attention to amounts (for once, I need to use more lol - because of the endo counts being relatively low).
The flower bed - that's the one that got the greens mixed into its soil last year - got lightly aerated before application. That means sticking the digging fork in the ground, tilting it back and forth once or twice and that's it.
The single rose only got mulched up really well last year, and when I took off the mulch - and remembered part of the reason was the peonies that grow at its foot - I decided to leave it that way and make an experimental variant of it. So the mycos just got watered in and covered up with mulch again, no messing with the soil or the root chaos I know is in there.
Also, in setups like this, I actually like the goutweed, it's a nice green mulch all summer.
Using my brain to justify being plain lazy?
Cheers!
compost tea vs. rust & blackspot
(https://www.rollitup.org/t/callis-conundrums.936771/#post-13425044)
Today, the cherry tree and the 3 roses got their 2nd compost tea application. This time, I brewed up what I have to call protozoan soup -- hardly a sign of fungi, though I did see 1 sprouting, some very long bacteria that almost could've been beginning actinomyces, but just 1 ciliate.
And the rest - very diverse morphologies in the bacteria, and flagelates of all sizes. Not very many testate amoebae (who prefer more fungal environments).
But naked amoebae! I've never had so many in an ACT - or anywhere for that matter lol
Not completely happy, as I was hoping for a more rounded affair.
And because I don't know why this batch turned out so different. It was only 36hrs, and I used blackstrap molasses for the first time (I had been using sugarbeet molasses before I ran out and used that agave sirup last round).
Also not happy with the unsharpness of my images today, nooo idea, I just couldn't get the scope focused right
Well... that's why I'm not doing this for a living, yet
As is, it doesn't matter. So last time they got something way more fungal, not so very protozoan, this time, bigtime protozoa party, and who knows what my iffey brew setup will put out next time haha
End of the day, they get everything.
Of course the midterm goal is to be able to brew my ACTs spot-on for their purpose.
But that, is stuff for another conundrum...
Out into the garden with it!
I've decided to do the compost tea treatments only in one quarted of the garden - which conveniently houses the cherry, the roses, the tomato bed, and will now also include the rest of the bed in which they are (adding a few verrry rusty hollyhocks to the treated plants).
And the cherry tree, spring explosion upcoming in the next 2 days or so
Oh, and the adopted roses have gotten taken out of the ACT-experiment - to adapt to the scarcity of resources
Instead, I'm going to use them to see whether just adding mycos can also mitigate or fend off those spots and rusts (especially these had the rusts, this was also the soil with the actinobacterial and anaerobic pockets).
So, they had mycorrhizae watered in today: pulled the mulch aside and watered them in according to the myco-company's instructions.
The two main adoptives
(there's another row of roses back by the cypress, not sure yet what to do with them... also mycorrhize or as control group? though I have controls all around, for the fungal diseases anyway):
btw... I was at their shop yesterday to request they produce an endo-only mix, which was met with a groan of despair - apparently the beaurocratic side of producing and selling mycorrhizae in Austria is apalling... like trying to walk through quicksand (why was I not really surprised?
), and they're still fighting (I think for bio-certification), though they have been on the market for a few years now.......So for now, I'm just going to continue using the mix I was using to now (with ectos, tricos, and assorted bacteria added - "universal" type mix), but have begun paying more attention to amounts (for once, I need to use more lol - because of the endo counts being relatively low).
The flower bed - that's the one that got the greens mixed into its soil last year - got lightly aerated before application. That means sticking the digging fork in the ground, tilting it back and forth once or twice and that's it.
The single rose only got mulched up really well last year, and when I took off the mulch - and remembered part of the reason was the peonies that grow at its foot - I decided to leave it that way and make an experimental variant of it. So the mycos just got watered in and covered up with mulch again, no messing with the soil or the root chaos I know is in there.
Also, in setups like this, I actually like the goutweed, it's a nice green mulch all summer.
Using my brain to justify being plain lazy?
Cheers!
calliandra
Well-Known Member
@ShLUbY
I think the ones I have in my garden are ostrich ferns?! Just noticed these a few days ago:
So I think I'm set not to get poisoned - unlike the general outcry at our permaculture group meeting the other day would lead me to assume, namely, that I will DIE if I even THINK of eating ferns lol. (they were speaking of bracken, mainly)
Quite unknown, this fiddlehead business, in these parts here!
I think the ones I have in my garden are ostrich ferns?! Just noticed these a few days ago:
So I think I'm set not to get poisoned - unlike the general outcry at our permaculture group meeting the other day would lead me to assume, namely, that I will DIE if I even THINK of eating ferns lol. (they were speaking of bracken, mainly)
Quite unknown, this fiddlehead business, in these parts here!
calliandra
Well-Known Member
Conundrum #4
oh, the myriad ways of composting leaves
So last fall, I collected lots and lots of leaves and put them into all sorts of scenarios.
@greasemonkeymann , mediate my madness please I'm driving myself crazy
The mulched ones
did a good job of keeping the soil covered over winter, though I took care to pin them down, either with dead branches or pieces of fencing - vs. storms and blackbirds
They're weathered and crumbly now, and will probably become part of the soil really fast when the first layer of fresh mulch comes on. Actually, they seem to be disappearing now already, loks the soil is taking them up as they crumble.
No doubts here, I would've liked to have more of them to mix with those hi-n greens!
The trampled ones
Quite a lot of leaves went onto the pathways, which are a bit lower than the beds, and got trampled on....
Well, they got stomped down when I put them there, and then there wasn't really enough traffic
Except the path behind the adopted roses - there, the top layers have been totally weathered, and I have a moist layer underneath, that perhaps can be a bit of a weed-stopper?
(there's goutweed under, unweedable due to its being totally knitted up with the cypress roots)
We'll see about that
The ones mixed with woodchips
had disappeared before the big snows came
The woodchips were meant as browns for the thermal compost, hopefully fungal by virtue of having lain around all winter... I may add some, but I do also like this for wormbin bedding!
The composted ones
didn't compost, as I had too little greens, it was too late in the year, and I made the huge error of leaving town after setting the pile up - returning to an actinobacterial, 66°C pile 3 days later. Immediate turning and re-watering couldn't turn it around, not lastly because it got really cold shortly after.
I already know that these will definitely make up the "woody" part of my next attempt at thermal composting
Nice and orderly lol
halfcompost left, woodchips right
both are at around 30-40% RH (squeezing oozes water), enough for now?
The stuffed and stacked ones
I made a tower out of fencing that was lying about, pretty much 1m high. The leaves really got stuffed down in there, and were left untarped at the mercy of the elements.
Sunk down to half the volume, the outside leaves are weathered, the inner ones pretty wet, and especially, stuck to each other in layers.
The piled-up ones
Mainly maple, about half a m³
in varying stages of decomposition, mainly dry and going flaky or very wet, not smelling bad though
And impossible to photograph too!
I could just leave them where they are, and plant a pumpkin into them?
Or, I start a slow and pure leaf mold for future potting pleasures
I could add the stuffed and stacked leaves to it too.
But are those enough leaves to be worth even starting?
This garden is going to get scrapped sooner or later, at the mo it looks like the gardens will stay for a year guaranteed, and another almost certainly, but you never know..
And would the strip of "lawn" to the left of my leafy patch be a good spot?
It's pretty shady in the summer, there's access to water (in case it needs moistening? should it even?), but it's open to the north (cold side, even in summer) - would it be helpful to have that side a bit protected?
Or is it, all factors considered, just not worth the effort, and more sensible to make a second thermal compost with those, which I could use soo much sooner...
I could just use the lawn strip for collecting..
Cheers for your thoughts, ideas, admonitions and asides
oh, the myriad ways of composting leaves
So last fall, I collected lots and lots of leaves and put them into all sorts of scenarios.
@greasemonkeymann , mediate my madness please I'm driving myself crazy
The mulched ones
did a good job of keeping the soil covered over winter, though I took care to pin them down, either with dead branches or pieces of fencing - vs. storms and blackbirds
They're weathered and crumbly now, and will probably become part of the soil really fast when the first layer of fresh mulch comes on. Actually, they seem to be disappearing now already, loks the soil is taking them up as they crumble.
No doubts here, I would've liked to have more of them to mix with those hi-n greens!
The trampled ones
Quite a lot of leaves went onto the pathways, which are a bit lower than the beds, and got trampled on....
Well, they got stomped down when I put them there, and then there wasn't really enough traffic
Except the path behind the adopted roses - there, the top layers have been totally weathered, and I have a moist layer underneath, that perhaps can be a bit of a weed-stopper?
(there's goutweed under, unweedable due to its being totally knitted up with the cypress roots)
We'll see about that
The ones mixed with woodchips
had disappeared before the big snows came
The woodchips were meant as browns for the thermal compost, hopefully fungal by virtue of having lain around all winter... I may add some, but I do also like this for wormbin bedding!
The composted ones
didn't compost, as I had too little greens, it was too late in the year, and I made the huge error of leaving town after setting the pile up - returning to an actinobacterial, 66°C pile 3 days later. Immediate turning and re-watering couldn't turn it around, not lastly because it got really cold shortly after.
I already know that these will definitely make up the "woody" part of my next attempt at thermal composting
Nice and orderly lol
halfcompost left, woodchips right
both are at around 30-40% RH (squeezing oozes water), enough for now?
The stuffed and stacked ones
I made a tower out of fencing that was lying about, pretty much 1m high. The leaves really got stuffed down in there, and were left untarped at the mercy of the elements.
Sunk down to half the volume, the outside leaves are weathered, the inner ones pretty wet, and especially, stuck to each other in layers.
The piled-up ones
Mainly maple, about half a m³
in varying stages of decomposition, mainly dry and going flaky or very wet, not smelling bad though
And impossible to photograph too!
I could just leave them where they are, and plant a pumpkin into them?
Or, I start a slow and pure leaf mold for future potting pleasures
I could add the stuffed and stacked leaves to it too.
But are those enough leaves to be worth even starting?
This garden is going to get scrapped sooner or later, at the mo it looks like the gardens will stay for a year guaranteed, and another almost certainly, but you never know..
And would the strip of "lawn" to the left of my leafy patch be a good spot?
It's pretty shady in the summer, there's access to water (in case it needs moistening? should it even?), but it's open to the north (cold side, even in summer) - would it be helpful to have that side a bit protected?
Or is it, all factors considered, just not worth the effort, and more sensible to make a second thermal compost with those, which I could use soo much sooner...
I could just use the lawn strip for collecting..
Cheers for your thoughts, ideas, admonitions and asides
greasemonkeymann
Well-Known Member
hmmm, well, somehow the first thought that comes to mind is "what would happen if I sprinkled baby oatmeal in there and lightly tossed it around, I wonder what types of fungal explosion it'd create?"Conundrum #4
oh, the myriad ways of composting leaves
So last fall, I collected lots and lots of leaves and put them into all sorts of scenarios.
@greasemonkeymann , mediate my madness please I'm driving myself crazy
The mulched ones
did a good job of keeping the soil covered over winter, though I took care to pin them down, either with dead branches or pieces of fencing - vs. storms and blackbirds
They're weathered and crumbly now, and will probably become part of the soil really fast when the first layer of fresh mulch comes on. Actually, they seem to be disappearing now already, loks the soil is taking them up as they crumble.
No doubts here, I would've liked to have more of them to mix with those hi-n greens!
The trampled ones
Quite a lot of leaves went onto the pathways, which are a bit lower than the beds, and got trampled on....
Well, they got stomped down when I put them there, and then there wasn't really enough traffic
Except the path behind the adopted roses - there, the top layers have been totally weathered, and I have a moist layer underneath, that perhaps can be a bit of a weed-stopper?
View attachment 3916226
(there's goutweed under, unweedable due to its being totally knitted up with the cypress roots)
We'll see about that
The ones mixed with woodchips
had disappeared before the big snows came
The woodchips were meant as browns for the thermal compost, hopefully fungal by virtue of having lain around all winter... I may add some, but I do also like this for wormbin bedding!
The composted ones
didn't compost, as I had too little greens, it was too late in the year, and I made the huge error of leaving town after setting the pile up - returning to an actinobacterial, 66°C pile 3 days later. Immediate turning and re-watering couldn't turn it around, not lastly because it got really cold shortly after.
I already know that these will definitely make up the "woody" part of my next attempt at thermal composting
Nice and orderly lol
halfcompost left, woodchips right
both are at around 30-40% RH (squeezing oozes water), enough for now?
View attachment 3916227
The stuffed and stacked ones
I made a tower out of fencing that was lying about, pretty much 1m high. The leaves really got stuffed down in there, and were left untarped at the mercy of the elements.
Sunk down to half the volume, the outside leaves are weathered, the inner ones pretty wet, and especially, stuck to each other in layers.
View attachment 3916229
The piled-up ones
Mainly maple, about half a m³
View attachment 3916232
in varying stages of decomposition, mainly dry and going flaky or very wet, not smelling bad though
And impossible to photograph too!
View attachment 3916236
I could just leave them where they are, and plant a pumpkin into them?
Or, I start a slow and pure leaf mold for future potting pleasures
I could add the stuffed and stacked leaves to it too.
But are those enough leaves to be worth even starting?
This garden is going to get scrapped sooner or later, at the mo it looks like the gardens will stay for a year guaranteed, and another almost certainly, but you never know..
And would the strip of "lawn" to the left of my leafy patch be a good spot?
It's pretty shady in the summer, there's access to water (in case it needs moistening? should it even?), but it's open to the north (cold side, even in summer) - would it be helpful to have that side a bit protected?
Or is it, all factors considered, just not worth the effort, and more sensible to make a second thermal compost with those, which I could use soo much sooner...
I could just use the lawn strip for collecting..
Cheers for your thoughts, ideas, admonitions and asides
now, i'm not saying go do that, but that's what i'd do, purely to see what happens.
Dry slow composts are usually more fungal anyhow..
Just a thought.
I just got a rush of customers to juggle at my shop, i'll post again in a lil bit
there are more practical uses for the leaves
calliandra
Well-Known Member
hmmm!!
Thanks I completely forgot about oatmeal - also for my wormbin and such
Sounds like if I decide to make a pure leaf pile, I won't be having to check on it, not regarding humidity at least?
But yes, to juggle your customers first.
greasemonkeymann
Well-Known Member
alright, so my only complaint with doing a leaf mold where they are is that it'll magically disappear..hmmm!!
Thanks I completely forgot about oatmeal - also for my wormbin and such
Sounds like if I decide to make a pure leaf pile, I won't be having to check on it, not regarding humidity at least?
But yes, to juggle your customers first.
it's weird, but humus tends to do that, almost degrades into nothing it seems like, and where they are you'll only notice the pile shrinking and you'll have issues trying to gather that humus/leaf mold.
so what i'd do if you are wanting a leaf mold pile is to get it in some sort of breathable bin, a large fabric pot works well for that, in fact when I did mine I had a smartpot full of leaves only and on top of that I put my wormbin, it worked great, but I lack attention issues sometimes, so I didn't feel like waiting for them to finish, so I then put them into my compost.
I've actually tried three times to make pure leaf mold without any green inputs, but it takes SOOO damn long I think I waited a full calendar year once.. and my leaves looked almost the same as when I bagged them.
hell I've seen a 10 day old compost that has more degraded leaves than a year of leaf mold