Are LED's That Good?

[Odin*]

A melt down, an imbecile boner lasting more than 4 hours, or the simplest and most elegant explanation? it's time to change that diaper, child.

You get "schooled" and that's all you've got?

Can you please post more pics of your shifty grow. It will help me help you.

 

[GrandfatherRat]

not pointing fingers at anyone, kinda more so at all RIU... but even if you are right, degrading into name calling and shit like that turns what woulda been/coulda been a fruitful discussion into mostly useless entertainment(that gets old quick).. i still manage to learn quite a bit through all the shit slinging still, an entertaining education..

so ive learned here that most light sources are good(HPS,CMH,COB)... a warehouse grow in alaska might elect all HPS to supplement heating, a warehouse grow in southern cali may go all COB so save of electric bill and cooling(possibly)... and small fry's like me in small cabs(spaces) not suited for 600 hps or more should probably just look into cob's? basically based on ones specific needs and circumstances, no one size fits all.... and when in doubt just start cursing?? LOL

I love RIU lol

You might think that new grow warehouses would be planning to install LED light, but they are not. I design systems for all the newly legal state expansions, for serveral different consulting compaines. In the last month, I've done at least two dozen designs-- most all of them greenhouses, and none of them planning to use LED-- they are all running standard HPS. None of the dozens of commercial grows I visit regularly are using them either, with one exception of a client using LED in one room on a test basis. I keep hearing this buzz about LED moving into commercial spaces, but I haven't seen it once in hundreds of facilities. Doesn't mean someone's not doing it, but it's a sure sign to me that this matter is well settled in the current commercial environment.

 

[Heil Tweetler]

Honestly though, if that's your grow, it's pretty shitty.

All I see is hair and leaves. No buds, no trichs. I can give you a few pointers if you'd like... ?

The more you type, the better I look. Do carry on, bitch.

You failed at "Grammar Nazi", then fuck up "coherent". What a douche.

I'll bet 1 million that you don't get it...

Tic-toc.

Damn, I guess dipshit had his kindergaten teacher take the iPad away.
Anyhow, I "bold'd" and italicized "cogent" as diversion. Your sentence isn't "coherent" as your "your" doesn't fit the context. You meant "you're", ironic after a failed attempt at "Grammar Nazi".

"Class is is session".

Hurry up, "dummy".

"schooled" doesnt mean what you think. Your misunderstanding explains why you're been corrected and slapped down throughout this thread.

A melt down, an imbecile boner lasting more than 4 hours, or the simplest and most elegant explanation? it's time to change that diaper, child.

 

[ANC]

In a physics lab closed loop sure the overall power pulled would equate the same heat, but at conversion of electrical to radiant the lights themselves are not equals, one will output more heat as a result of wasted energy and one will have put out more radiant light as a result of being more efficient.

For every 1umol of light an HID bulb puts out, the latest generation LEDs can get out 1.7, using the same amount of power. That without putting out any IR which can account for 15% of the output of HID units. (basically heat waves). In large grows, when you factor in the reduced need for AC and the power that eats combined with lower power draw LEDs the meter to recovering your money starts moving to green fast. Lets also not forget that growing plants under lights at the scale seen today is an ecological disaster. So, we need to do our best to use as little as possible.

God, I can't believe I already forgot about diapers. They are almost enough reason on their own not to have more children. Babies will shit on you from the other side of the room.

 

[Odin*]

You might think that new grow warehouses would be planning to install LED light, but they are not. I design systems for all the newly legal state expansions, for serveral different consulting compaines. In the last month, I've done at least two dozen designs-- most all of them greenhouses, and none of them planning to use LED-- they are all running standard HPS. None of the dozens of commercial grows I visit regularly are using them either, with one exception of a client using LED in one room on a test basis. I keep hearing this buzz about LED moving into commercial spaces, but I haven't seen it once in hundreds of facilities. Doesn't mean someone's not doing it, but it's a sure sign to me that this matter is well settled in the current commercial environment.

I've been to a number of large LED/COB grows (100-500 lights), but none of them were at all impressive. In fact, they all looked just about as shitty as @Heil Tweetler grow.

Seriously though, they are not effective on a grand scale. Judging from the video posted and a look into @Heil Tweetler 's crap, it isn't effective anywhere.

That's a bit much (ribbing), I have seen decent pics posted from other members using LEDs/COBs that were good, but those are on a very small scale. Not a viable option in commercial ops.

 

[Heil Tweetler]

I've been to a number of large LED/COB grows (100-500 lights), but none of them were at all impressive. In fact, they all looked just about as shitty as @Heil Tweetler grow.

Seriously though, they are not effective on a grand scale. Judging from the video posted and a look into @Heil Tweetler 's crap, it isn't effective anywhere.

That's a bit much (ribbing), I have seen decent pics posted from other members using LEDs/COBs that were good, but those are on a very small scale. Not a viable option in commercial ops.

bro you're more legit when you get into children, cock, uncles balls and mommy porn. When it comes to growing MJ you're a shit breathing imbecile

 

[Odin*]

"schooled" doesnt mean what you think. Your misunderstanding explains why you're been corrected and slapped down throughout this thread.

A melt down, an imbecile boner lasting more than 4 hours, or the simplest and most elegant explanation? it's time to change that diaper, child.

"Schooled" was a reference to the "kindergarten" jab that I threw at you. It's not my fault that you are this slow. It's all the crack that your grandpa/dad (one, and the same) gave your mom. That, and the Dr. dropped you during delivery.

I'm sorry for you. Seriously. Pretty sad about your fucked up plants too.

 

[Odin*]

bro you're more legit when you get into children, cock, uncles balls and mommy porn. When it comes to growing MJ you're a shit breathing imbecile

This must be your area of expertise. Certainly isn't growing herb.

Again, sorry.

 

[GrandfatherRat]

I've been to a number of large LED/COB grows (100-500 lights), but none of them were at all impressive. In fact, they all looked just about as shitty as @Heil Tweetler grow.

Seriously though, they are not effective on a grand scale. Judging from the video posted and a look into @Heil Tweetler 's crap, it isn't effective anywhere.

That's a bit much (ribbing), I have seen decent pics posted from other members using LEDs/COBs that were good, but those are on a very small scale. Not a viable option in commercial ops.

Yeah, I don't think anyone's saying LED doesn't have it's applications, but the big grow ops aren't using them, and they've shown ready willingness to adopt anything that will save them a buck. The fact that LEDs have had years to proliferate, yet are not in widespread commercial use for cannabis is telling-- though it certainly doesn't lock the legions of closet growers into a certain direction we must follow. There's more experimentation and innovation on this website alone than I see in a hundred commercial grows-- we don't have to risk our job with each crop (unless you grow in illegal states), so we can try different things.

 

[Odin*]

Yeah, I don't think anyone's saying LED doesn't have it's applications, but the big grow ops aren't using them, and they've shown ready willingness to adopt anything that will save them a buck. The fact that LEDs have had years to proliferate, yet are not in widespread commercial use for cannabis is telling-- though it certainly doesn't lock the legions of closet growers into a certain direction we must follow. There's more experimentation and innovation on this website alone than I see in a hundred commercial grows-- we don't have to risk our job with each crop (unless you grow in illegal states), so we can try different things.

The guys I've seen trying them out are doing just that, "trying". They admit that they don't have it figured yet, but they are hoping that they're just a "fine tune" away from getting it right. That just isn't the case. The lights don't have what it takes to make the plants "put out". I've told them, but they aren't listening (high hopes).

There is more to it than "light", everything (not just all variables, but all aspects of the "light" itself) comes into play.

Edit: Forgot to add that these guys have more money than brains, so they have "time" to experiment.

 

[j.t.1986]

Yeah, I don't think anyone's saying LED doesn't have it's applications, but the big grow ops aren't using them, and they've shown ready willingness to adopt anything that will save them a buck. The fact that LEDs have had years to proliferate, yet are not in widespread commercial use for cannabis is telling-- though it certainly doesn't lock the legions of closet growers into a certain direction we must follow. There's more experimentation and innovation on this website alone than I see in a hundred commercial grows-- we don't have to risk our job with each crop (unless you grow in illegal states), so we can try different things.

what is your opinion on why most commercial setups dont go LED? is it just the initial up front cost?
im just curious, i have no plans to ever go commercial lol.

but it seems from my research that all of our artificial lighting (LED,HPS,CMH)all have disadvantages in one area or another and not one is perfect, or produces the "perfect" spectrum from a single bulb/chip.

 

[GrandfatherRat]

what is your opinion on why most commercial setups dont go LED? is it just the initial up front cost?
im just curious, i have no plans to ever go commercial lol.

but it seems from my research that all of our artificial lighting (LED,HPS,CMH)all have disadvantages in one area or another and not one is perfect, or produces the "perfect" spectrum from a single bulb/chip.

I honestly don't know, but I suspect it's the same reason Hollywood turns out shite movies-- sheer inertia tied to the amount of cash invested. When you sit down and design a grow facility, you need to guarantee you are giving someone a proven formula that can make money-- that's what they are investing in, to the tune of serious cash. I recently finished a layout for an East coast facility, forget the state lol so many, and the plant count for that one grow was 30K. It was medical only-- likely Michigan now that I recall-- but I could just tell it was laid out with an eye towards later rec expansion. An expert friend I described the space to wrinked his head a minute, then told me it would likely pull down 250K$ per month, using wholesale market figures. Do you think the people throwing down 3/4 million just to be part of the application process (from another state example, fuck you IL), are going to risk that kind of cash cow by using unproven technology?

Edit: keep in mind these larger facilities are almost all greenhouse operations. Most of these people are using the lights as supplements and in the winter months. Very few large scale grows being designed now are still indoor, because in most states that kind of operation is too ripe to be undercut by large scale outdoor grows which can turn out volume the indoor folks only dream of. You should see the fields in Pueblo and the Northern counties, and now hemp too... it's like pictures I've seen of the Green Triangle, but legal and so much better regulated...

 

[Heil Tweetler]

The guys I've seen trying them out are doing just that, "trying". They admit that they don't have it figured yet, but they are hoping that they're just a "fine tune" away from getting it right. That just isn't the case. The lights don't have what it takes to make the plants "put out". I've told them, but they aren't listening (high hopes).

There is more to it than "light", everything (not just all variables, but all aspects of the "light" itself) comes into play.

Bro' talking out of your ass is really getting old.

You might think that new grow warehouses would be planning to install LED light, but they are not. I design systems for all the newly legal state expansions, for serveral different consulting compaines. In the last month, I've done at least two dozen designs-- most all of them greenhouses, and none of them planning to use LED-- they are all running standard HPS. None of the dozens of commercial grows I visit regularly are using them either, with one exception of a client using LED in one room on a test basis. I keep hearing this buzz about LED moving into commercial spaces, but I haven't seen it once in hundreds of facilities. Doesn't mean someone's not doing it, but it's a sure sign to me that this matter is well settled in the current commercial environment.

Yeah, I don't think anyone's saying LED doesn't have it's applications, but the big grow ops aren't using them, and they've shown ready willingness to adopt anything that will save them a buck. The fact that LEDs have had years to proliferate, yet are not in widespread commercial use for cannabis is telling-- though it certainly doesn't lock the legions of closet growers into a certain direction we must follow. There's more experimentation and innovation on this website alone than I see in a hundred commercial grows-- we don't have to risk our job with each crop (unless you grow in illegal states), so we can try different things.

It took years and a leap in tech for hobby growers to swap out HPS for LED. Expect the same for commercial. The initial cost is much higher and LED might not supply optimal radiant energy for grows that need help with temps. While commercial growers might "do anything to save a buck" they will be cautious about dropping a fortune on latest tech lighting and probably fearful to negotiate the learning curve and potential shortcomings of initial produce. So the conclusion " it's a sure sign to me that this matter is well settled in the current commercial environment" is suspect.

There is no getting around the fact that LED are far more efficient than HPS and the tech is still improving. Also greenhouse grows and warehouse grows are very different. The greenhouse industry has embraced LED tech. The cannabis industry, historically constrained by phrohibition, is hardly the tech, thought or innovation leader when it comes to ag or horticultural innovation

http://www.ballpublishing.com/GrowerTalks/ViewArticle.aspx?articleid=22844

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0099010 <---2014 about a 20% efficiency improvement in LED since then

 

[CannaBruh]

For every 1umol of light an HID bulb puts out, the latest generation LEDs can get out 1.7, using the same amount of power. That without putting out any IR which can account for 15% of the output of HID units. (basically heat waves). In large grows, when you factor in the reduced need for AC and the power that eats combined with lower power draw LEDs the meter to recovering your money starts moving to green fast. Lets also not forget that growing plants under lights at the scale seen today is an ecological disaster. So, we need to do our best to use as little as possible.

God, I can't believe I already forgot about diapers. They are almost enough reason on their own not to have more children. Babies will shit on you from the other side of the room.

There's no need to factor in AC savings when determining which one is more efficient, LED is clear winner.

Not following the second paragraph

 

[j.t.1986]

The guys I've seen trying them out are doing just that, "trying". They admit that they don't have it figured yet, but they are hoping that they're just a "fine tune" away from getting it right. That just isn't the case. The lights don't have what it takes to make the plants "put out". I've told them, but they aren't listening (high hopes).

There is more to it than "light", everything (not just all variables, but all aspects of the "light" itself) comes into play.

Edit: Forgot to add that these guys have more money than brains, so they have "time" to experiment.

its good that they are trying, someone's gotta do it lol. maybe they will "fine tune" it enough one day to be the catalyst for change haha.. what you and @GrandfatherRat are saying makes alot of sense. why invest so much on something thats not a sure shot..


so after all that.... which one's better?? lmao/jks... i know for a fact COB's are the greatest thing ever invented in the history of mankind. i know because i spent money, that i earned, on them and they are currently hanging in my cab. so they must be the very best.....

lol really though good bud is good bud, i could care less how we get there as long as we're getting there.
i think when you get to a certain point of (high)quality, you have to move mountains for incremental increases in quality.. for most it may not be worth it, or even very noticeable.

 

[GrandfatherRat]

Bro' talking out of your ass is really getting old.





It took years and a leap in tech for hobby growers to swap out HPS for LED. Expect the same for commercial. The initial cost is much higher and LED might not supply optimal radiant energy for grows that need help with temps. While commercial growers might "do anything to save a buck" they will be cautious about dropping a fortune on latest tech lighting and probably fearful to negotiate the learning curve and potential shortcomings of initial produce. So the conclusion " it's a sure sign to me that this matter is well settled in the current commercial environment" is suspect.

There is no getting around the fact that LED are far more efficient than HPS and the tech is still improving. Also greenhouse grows and warehouse grows are very different. The greenhouse industry has embraced LED tech. The cannabis industry, historically constrained by phrohibition, is hardly the tech, thought or innovation leader when it comes to ag or horticultural innovation

http://www.ballpublishing.com/GrowerTalks/ViewArticle.aspx?articleid=22844

http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0099010 <---2014 about a 20% efficiency improvement in LED since then

Well I might be overstating that case a bit, and I'm just poking about in a tiny slice of this multi-state billion dollar market, but it's easy to get that impression from my own first hand. What I'd really like to see are growers with commercial funding doing pure research on these subjects. The extraction community is doing mad experimentation at that level, and we see all kinds of new products coming out of it. There's tons of promise in this area of technology, and plenty of money-- we have the example of companies like Surna in innovation tech for cannabis HVAC already (like em or not...). Unfortunately there's not much direction or clarity when it comes to predicting where innovation will go, and some people of course want to take advantage of that.

 

[Heil Tweetler]

i know for a fact COB's are the greatest thing ever invented in the history of mankind. i know because i spent money, that i earned, on them and they are currently hanging in my cab. so they must be the very best.....

.

sounding like a witless jackass bro

 

[budman111]

why all the incestuous talk bitch? Have you suffered abuse?

UncleBuck 2.0

 

[Heil Tweetler]

UncleBuck 2.0

Reported for imbecile vomit stench.

 

[Odin*]

sounding like a witless jackass bro

If you're going to continue to troll this thread please post up more of your laughable grow. Tell us again how your shit setup and totally fucked plants are the "wave of the future". That pic was pretty funny.

Who needs swelled buds, well defined structure/calyxes, smothered in trich's, when you can have hairy, airy, whack ass buds, filled with lawn trimmings, from hairy airy ass top, to shitty hairy airy ass bottom?

That shit is so piss poor that you need a dog groomer shaving the hair on one side, and a team of gardeners "weed whacking" the blades of grass on the other. "Nose" is of wet dog and lawn trimmings. No worries, there is no way that any of them would even suspect that it's "weed". No sticky, no visible trichs, no "nose", they'd never guess.

If you really want to "Champion" the LED/COB movement (bowels), you should get your shit in check, or avoid posting anymore embarrassing pictures. You haven't posted another pic in a few, so off to a good start. If that is current, I'd scrap the entire run, cull the lot of 'em. Practice for a bit with something a little easier, like artificial flowers. Go through the motions for a few years, until you "get it", then try again. Baby steps and trainings wheels, mi amigo.