First SCROG Grow, looking for help from the forum

[GreenLogician]

What's your plan to remove waste water from the collection trays?

 

[PSlacks]

Yeah it will increase the longevity of the fan and more importantly the filter. Fans last a long time anyhow. Ive had the same one running 24/7 for 6 years. Try to get a Variable transformer speed controller so the fan doesn't hum when turned down. They cost a bit more but work by lowering the voltage which make them a better choice.

Haha, your the first person to mention the profile pic. Yeah its one of my favourite movies.. Can you dig it.....

Thanks there @coreywebster, I'll be sure to add this to my list. Can't believe I hadn't came across this information prior. Almost makes no sense whatsoever to simply go with the lowest CFM fan suggested for my grow room.. makes a lot more sense to go bigger than what I need and tone it down to what's suitable for me now. I mean who knows, a couple of years down the road I might have a bigger setup that will make use of those extra CFM's.

"Can you count sukkas!? I say the future is ours.." oh yes my friend, absolutely a favorite. Hm, I think I might watch it tonight over a couple of jays

 

[Lucky Luke]

Here is a 4x4 we just ran... 9.5 ounces dry.under a 400w. One 600w would have been ideal...That thing was a beast.. hydro..

I wouldnt call that a scrog really..its more like a support net. You have allot of wasted space and unfilled holes.
Huge colas for a 400.

1 gram per W is always a good figure to aim for. OP is in a 5 x 5 so also has more light footprint if he wants.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Not many choices on ya poll...neither apply to me.

That seems silly now you edited it!..lol

 

[PSlacks]

First off welcome aboard. Scrog is meticulous and I'd say around 65% of the pictures of scrog pics on the I net are not technically Scrogs haha. . You sound like you are on it already. You have some good research under your belt . So let's get into this!

So why 600's? I'm just guessing that you haven't acquired them yet? In a 5 by 5 it's a crap load of heat to manage. So if I was to put money down at this point in time, I would lay it towards led's personally. You save heat management IE: fan size and length of air swaps or temp control, power consumption around the whole grow, watering rates are less frequent, Easy to get perfect coverage over your grow space, usable vertical space in a tent, the list can keep on going. Just throwing some food for thought out there.

Second. Fox farm is fine for your first run. Grab some Bonticare cal/mag as a supplement and you'll be fine.

3. Really matters depending on your grow space and climate.

4. On sativas I run 70-80% then flip. Indica doms run the whole screen out.
18 inches is a good starting point. As you gain your skill set or technique play around with it. Indicas lower screen height. Sat's Higher. Every pheno of every strain likes their own style so get into a grove with em. They'll let ya know what they want or don't.
Use the tools available to you, keep them where you want them. Just remember stems expand so keep it a little loose if you go down the tie off mode path. Net size is another thing people really don't consider.

A meticulous task it seems to be indeed. To be so hands on with the plant vs. letting it just grow out it's natural way seems a bit intimidating but I must be comfortable with the plants and make them what I desire them to be, so trying this method doesn't scare me too bad. Ya gotta learn some how!

So why the 600s you ask? Well, with the reading I've done, I've came to the conclusion that more watts on the lights, the higher the harvest. So, when I say that I was the two 600s, I'm really saying that I'm aiming for the big yield of having those 1200 watts. Who wouldn't want a bigger yield, haha! I actually had been doing some extensive research in the previous two or so days on the heat build up in the tent and really just maintains the heat in general. I read that these HPS lights tend to create a copious amount of heat to begin with, let alone on top of that, cramming into a little 5x5 space! I just figured that maybe somehow, someway I could keep the tent cool and the lights cool as well. There's gotta be someway, but if one 1000 watt is really the way to go then I can suffice. I actually originally planned on going with one 1000 Watt before I got the idea for two 600s. Just trying to figure it all out my friend.

Will do on the fox farms and I'll be sure to do some research on the bonticare cal/mag as well.

I've always heard that indices tend to be shorter and bushy, even wider. Sativas lean towards taller and more stretched out it seems. Really interesting how the same plant can have such different genetics. Speaking of strains being different and what not, do you suggest any specific strains that I might test out for my first grow? Thanks for all the helpful advise mate, I wish I could help you out near as much as you're helping me

 

[PSlacks]

Agreed If you don't have a bigger tent i wouldn't put more then one 1000w in there and even that seems like it will be too hot unless you maybe get a cool tube and straight duct it through from one side to the other side of the tent. Im Leaning towards leds as well myself. I would look into COBs perhaps..? I Run 2 1000w hps in a decent sized room 7x10ish without any problems. I only use about 5x7 for the plants and trellis themselves and the rest is for me to squeeze my skinny ass in there. I do need a humidifier once the buds get big because it goes way up near the end of flower. unfortunately a humidifier puts out heat. Invest in a good a/c and it should do both for a tent. Look into the growboss on youtube he does some shit in tents you may find useful. Im About to flip soon just starting to fill the trellis. Both strains are Indica dominant .. Filling the trellis 90% for the back ladys and the front will be 100% full then ill flip and adding a second layer trellis after to hold up the floppers .. Not always necessary but it was last time...

Those are some great looking plants there! In what week of veg are you in if ya don't mind me asking? I'd like to see the progress of them for sure.
Speaking on the light, I've been thinking of going with one 600w just for my first grow. Really don't wanna go halfway when I could bang out the bigger harvest, so 1000w is really what I've been considering toning down to. Still as you mentioned, heat might be an issue.. i thought I might go with the 1000w air cooled hood, put some insulated ducting going straight through from one side of the tent to the other (completely independent ventilation system from garden). I figured this with a large enough inline fan would be enough to keep it nice and cool.. what do you think?

As the LEDs go.. I could honestly start up a whole new thread on that, haha. I honestly haven't gone too deep with my research on LEDs because I've always heard that HPS is the way to go if you want dense great nugs. Heard rumors once or twice that leds can result in airy buds. What's your take on this? And ah, cobbs. These were brought to my attention not too long ago and I must be honest, I am quite uneducated on these as well. I've heard they are even better than your standard LEDs.

Well with this hobby, it's better to be safe than sorry. I'm sure I'll get s humidifier just to be safe. Just don't know how heavy duty of one I will need. Don't wanna go overboard. And seems to me like you more experienced scroggers are going no less than 80% full. Seems to be a trend here..

 

[PSlacks]

Look into the growboss on youtube he does some shit in tents you may find useful.

Agree on The Grow boss. Not many people like his personality. I dont mind it and you do get used to him. In regard to what he says I think he is spot on, he tells it like it is. After you have watched his normal grow tip vids, his call in vids are entertaining and educational (albiet a little long for the info supplied) and well worth watching.

Forgot to comment on this.. I will be sure to check this fella out. Being honest and to the point never hurt me. Infact, I welcome it!

 

[Lucky Luke]

lets throw a spanner in the works..hehe

600w with a light mover. With the money saved go CO2 and sealed room. The extra 25% in yield means you can run an AC and its paid for.

 

[PSlacks]

Mmmm... I think that for 4x4 1.5 is aggressive. 10 to 14 ounces would be more accurate depending on strain and grow experience. Not to say that it can't be done, but the breeders typically quantify the expected yield 300grams per meter squared etc..I don't recall any of them saying 1000 grams.

Two 600s is overkill. Two CMH would probably rock that space. COB is always a good option, but expensive.
Did you top the plants? It looks like it in the pics. That would be a good thing..

You will likely need another layer to the scrog, especially if you fill the screen before flip.

As mentioned, don't forget the CalMag.

Where can I get some solid information on these COB lights you guys are talking about? Seems promising. And every now and then I will see a double screen scrog. Always wondered why they do this.

 

[PSlacks]

Here is a 4x4 we just ran... 9.5 ounces dry.under a 400w. One 600w would have been ideal...That thing was a beast.. hydro..

Those are huge colas there my friend! I did some quick math in my head and came to the conclusion that you achieved about .5 gram per watt. Often heard this is the minimum standard for beginner growers to go by. I've heard of experienced growers getting 1.5 to even 2 grams per watt.. that would be lovely.

 

[PSlacks]

What's your plan to remove waste water from the collection trays?

Please give me some info on this if you can my friend. I tried to read up on this and never really got any techniques. Thought about maybe just lining the bottom with plastic? Just a thought though, I really don't wanna be cheap. I would like every thing to be as neat and professional as possible.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Those are huge colas there my friend! I did some quick math in my head and came to the conclusion that you achieved about .5 gram per watt. Often heard this is the minimum standard for beginner growers to go by. I've heard of experienced growers getting 1.5 to even 2 grams per watt.. that would be lovely.

G per W can be tricky though

example.

1000w light and get a 1000 grams= 1 gram per w.

Light mover adds 50%

Co2 adds 25% again.

 

[Lucky Luke]

Please give me some info on this if you can my friend. I tried to read up on this and never really got any techniques. Thought about maybe just lining the bottom with plastic? Just a thought though, I really don't wanna be cheap. I would like every thing to be as neat and professional as possible.

Sorry if im hogging your thread..im bored..lol

You can use a wet and dry vac. I have one but its a large twin motor one so i made up this:

#6065 < click on.

 

[GreenLogician]

Niiiiice! What would you call that kind of a pump?
I see the brand name SingleFlo, but categorically, would they be like... 'two way pump's?

 

[Lucky Luke]

Niiiiice! What would you call that kind of a pump?
I see the brand name Single Flo, but categorically, would they be like... 'two way pump's?

I dont know..inline pump? was only around $20 on ebay.

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/12V-4-3Lpm-Self-Priming-Water-Pump-High-Pressure-Caravan-Camping-Boat-AU-POST/311373681961?_trksid=p2385738.c100677.m4598&_trkparms=aid=222007&algo=SIC.MBE&ao=1&asc=20160908110712&meid=4f5fd67295a3480a977fee0a5ab61196&pid=100677&rk=4&rkt=50&sd=112209288039

 

[GreenLogician]

Thanks, got it!
"The term "self-priming pump" describes a centrifugal pump that can use an air-water mixture"

 

[Lucky Luke]

Thanks, got it!
"The term "self-priming pump" describes a centrifugal pump that can use an air-water mixture"

works well but in use ive found it does need a filter. Ill use a fuel filter.
Its also not quiet.

 

[coreywebster]

Where can I get some solid information on these COB lights you guys are talking about? Seems promising. And every now and then I will see a double screen scrog. Always wondered why they do this.

If you want to check out Cob lights, take a wander over to the LED thread in the indoor growing part of this site.
Also look for growmau5 on youtube. Check it early videos. Check out greengenes on youtube too.
I will take some photos of my cob set up and my quantum boards when I get home from work.

The double net isn't really a scrog, its two support nets. It helps but its not the same as a scrog. Ideas often get watered down over time.

 

[wearealldumb]

Agree on The Grow boss. Not many people like his personality. I dont mind it and you do get used to him. In regard to what he says I think he is spot on, he tells it like it is. After you have watched his normal grow tip vids, his call in vids are entertaining and educational (albiet a little long for the info supplied) and well worth watching.

LMAO yea i agree. Hes a weird dude but his information is good. I dont think i could hang out with that guy tho lol..

 

[wearealldumb]

Where can I get some solid information on these COB lights you guys are talking about? Seems promising. And every now and then I will see a double screen scrog. Always wondered why they do this.

Growmau5 on youtube has the best educational videos all about cobs