To flush or not to flush..? Nutrient burn?

[im4satori]

Got the nutrients and reading the girls pretty well. At this point, I'm learning about hormones. Today I just got BAP6, Brassinolide, IBA-K, and triacontanol. Gonna be experimenting with two clones. One for control, the other for the experiment. I've got charts of how and when to use them at what ppm to use them. How's the organic thing going? If you've ever experimented with hormones let me know of any experience

yes I have many years ago

bare with me it was a long time ago so my memory isn't perfect

I did the bap..yes

and the Gibberlins, cytokins, triacontinol, and a few others

the brassinolide I didn't try that one but if I recall its suppose it boost immune system I think

I rand 3 plants for each hormone

1 got nothihng
1 got std dose
1 got double dose

the std dose plants showed minor changes

the double dose plants got frankenstined like freakish lol

the bap if I recall correct ..at the double dose created plants with little leaf and huge stems...almost as if all the energy the plant had went into the stems only

the tricontinol is the only one id consider using again but I might get a product called calcium25 and not bother with trying to mix my own as its a pain in the ass

one of them I think you gotta use lye... I cant recall but I have the chemicals in the back of the closet but I think it was lye I needed

its hard to get them to constitute proper when using a microwave or whatever

in the end it was a fun experiment but I don't feel like any of it was worth the trouble...

for whats its worth for me it seemed as if the hormones would borrow from peter to pay paul so where ever you gain something you lose somewhere else

the tricontenol didn't freak the plants out even at obscene amounts

also keep in mind these hrmones could create hermies

mine didn't but they could have

especially the gibberlin (I think)

ive also explored the use of (misspelled) chomquatchloride, I think that's close but might be wrong
basically its the shit they put into the bushmaster years ago

its expensive to buy...I have a pint minus 1 oz that ive had for years and will never use....
its highly concentrated for commenrical golf course use to keep the grass thick and short

real poison man

its also use on azelas and some other potted flowering plants

you ever wonder how the garden centers get these short stacked potted flowering plants covered with flowers and then you get it home and a few weeks later its stretched out and the flowers are few and far between

that's cuz they spray them with the chomquate or the other shit ( I cant recall the name) to keep them short and full of buds

 

[im4satori]

 

[im4satori]

yup theres the bottle of chomquaute chloride (or whatever its called the label is worn off)
that bottle was very expensive maybe $250 or something if I remember correct

then I still have this lye that I will never ever use lol

 

[im4satori]

http://gpnmag.com/article/using-chlormequat-chloride-success/

Chlormequat chloride, the first plant growth retardant (PGR), was discovered in the late 1950s by Dr. N.E. Tolbert, a chemistry professor at Michigan State University. The first experiments were performed and published on wheat, in which applications of the chemical produced shorter plants with thicker stems. Dr. Tolbert also learned that application of gibberellins could overcome the effects of the PGR application. The first experiments on floriculture crops were performed around 1960 by Tolbert and Dr. R.S. Lindstrom, who showed that the chemical could be used as a drench to inhibit stem extension, increase stem thickness and increase leaf greenness of chrysanthemum and poinsettia.

Today, chlormequat chloride is used to promote flowering or inhibit extension growth of floriculture crops grown in greenhouses, shadehouses and container nurseries such as geranium, poinsettia, begonia, osteospermum and hibiscus. The two most common products in floriculture that contain this active ingredient are Cycocel (OHP Inc.) and Citadel (Fine Americas Inc.) The concentration of both products is the same, 11.8 percent, and their re-entry interval is 12 hours. Compared with other common PGRs, chlormequat chloride is rapidly metabolized by plants, animals, bees and microbes in soil, meaning it is a relatively safe and short-lasting chemical when applied to crops and thus, a more forgiving PGR. For example, chlormequat chloride can be applied to poinsettia at low rates (500 to 750 ppm) after short days begin with little or no effect on bract size. This
can be useful for growers who battle
high temperatures in late September or early October.

Some application guidelines for chlormequat chloride are listed below. Consult the product labels, PGR technical specialists, as well as university and extension educators, for more information on successful commercial use of this PGR.

Chlormequat chloride is absorbed by leaves and roots, so it is effective when applied as a foliar spray, sprench, substrate drench or liner dip.

The most common application method is as a spray at a volume of 2 to 3 quarts per 100 sq. ft. Common spray rates are 750 to 1,500 ppm but can go as high as 3,000 on some crops (Figure 1). However, at rates above 1,250 ppm, a short-term phytotoxic response is more likely to occur. The typical phytotoxic response is a yellowing of immature leaves at the margin that appears within five days of application. Depending on the rate and crop, the yellowing can disappear or be fairly persistent. Therefore, growers are encouraged to experiment with different rates on a small scale to determine height control and phytotoxicity responses.

Drench applications do not cause phytotoxicity. However, since typical drench rates are 1,500 to 3,000 ppm, their expense limits their use.

Spray applications are most effective when made under slow-drying conditions, such as early morning or on a cloudy day. Avoid misting or watering for at least six hours after an application to ensure plant uptake of the PGR.

Growth inhibition responses of sprays typically last for a few weeks, so repeated applications are sometimes necessary.

As with all PGRs, applications are more effective when made as plants begin to rapidly elongate, such as one to two weeks after transplant.

Although chlormequat chloride is primarily used to inhibit extension growth, it can also accelerate flowering of a few crops. For example, sprays of chlormequat chloride can accelerate flowering of some seed geranium cultivars when made between two and five weeks after germination.

Late applications (within two to three weeks of marketing) should be avoided on finish crops, since they can potentially reduce flower size and cause phytotoxicity that persists when plants are sold.

A tank-mix combination of chlormequat chloride plus daminozide (e.g., B-Nine, Dazide) has been shown to be more active than using either product alone.

 

[im4satori]

there it is the brand name cycocel

ya know that kind reminds me of something

I wonder if those cyco nutes have pgr in them and that's why they call it cyco

short for cycocel

 

[im4satori]

if I was going to play around with poison

this is the shit id be using

but I have gone organic to get further from these type products..not closer

every few years someone comes out with a product that's likely this stuff added in just like bushmaster and gravity from the old days

its fucked up and shady for them to add it and not list it on the labels but plenty seem to get away with it for some time before getting popped

even advanced nutes had it in there gear years ago

its how these guys grow freakish plants that yield insane amounts

if you don't mind the poison or getting cancer or your children born with an extra limb

who knows it might not be as bad as round up that we all are now forced to consume

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

every few years someone comes out with a product that's likely this stuff added

I've read most products had pgr in it before they removed them not too many years ago. Including Advanced Nutrients.

 

[im4satori]

maybe so;

but every couple years youll see the same snake oil being repackaged under a new name

I sometimes wonder, if theres a certain sub set of people whom only care about max profit/yield that seek out thse type products as the names change from brand to brand.
so its like some company gets caught, then changes the LLC/name and sells it again ..rebranded and repeat and repeat and repeat

less than a year after bushmaster and gravity got pulled they came out with a product called "stacked"

Id swore it was the same thing but maybe im paranoid lol

for me its not so much that the shit is in the bottle, its that they don't tell you

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

I've read about all these products in forms I've gone through. these people repackaging and rebranding all this shit only care about profit. I've seen sneaky salesmen join these forms to push their snake oil, (sugar water & hormones) and try to recruit well-known members to plug their crap. I will not be using any hormones that are for ornamental use only, except for the IBA-K to root. Which is in all rooting powders and gels.

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

6-Benzylaminopurine (BAP) is commonly used to preserve the color and shelf life of vegetables. Brassinolide (BR) *sorced from Wiki "BR might reveal to have a prominent interest in the role of horticultural crops. Based on extensive research BR has the ability to improve the quantity and quality of horticultural crops and protect plants against many stresses that can be present in the local environment. A major benefit of using BR is that it does not interfere with the environment because they act in natural doses in a natural way. Since it is a “plant strengthening substance” and it is natural, BR application would be more favorable than pesticides and does not contribute to the co-evolution of pests".

 

[im4satori]

6-Benzylaminopurine (BAP) is commonly used to preserve the color and shelf life of vegetables. Brassinolide (BR) *sorced from Wiki "BR might reveal to have a prominent interest in the role of horticultural crops. Based on extensive research BR has the ability to improve the quantity and quality of horticultural crops and protect plants against many stresses that can be present in the local environment. A major benefit of using BR is that it does not interfere with the environment because they act in natural doses in a natural way. Since it is a “plant strengthening substance” and it is natural, BR application would be more favorable than pesticides and does not contribute to the co-evolution of pests".

sounds like your better versed on it than me

I read about it years ago when I first started growing
at the time I didn't understand what I was playing with in some of these chemicals

I know some are more harmful than others...

the tricontenol id use again maybe and I am considering getting some calcium25 again

the BAP I wouldn't just based on my memory of how I felt about it at the time I used it but I cant be specific, but maybe the BR id consider if it was conveniently bottled

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

Alfalfa has triacontanol

 

[im4satori]

Alfalfa has triacontanol

yes that's what im using

but im not sure you can get the ppm nearly as high using alfalfa as you can with the powder

 

[Lite]

blotches are usually cal/mag issues or ph issues. Flushing would make those issues worse if its a deficiency. Whenever i get lost in the woods i do a serious flush underneath the bathtub faucet, let it drain, then flush another gallon or two through with PH'd water until runoff is the PH i want.

then go back and add the proper nutrients the next day.

 

[CanadianDank]

blotches are usually cal/mag issues or ph issues. Flushing would make those issues worse if its a deficiency. Whenever i get lost in the woods i do a serious flush underneath the bathtub faucet, let it drain, then flush another gallon or two through with PH'd water until runoff is the PH i want.

then go back and add the proper nutrients the next day.

Just had to do this in my promix, medium got pretty acidic.
I flushed about 15 gallons of ph 7-8 water through my 5 gal pots and couldn't get the run off above roughly 5.5
Got fkn tired of sitting around the tub all day so I'm just hoping it helped!

Any tips for me?

 

[Lite]

get a salt flush solution, I dont know what other brands mark it as, the one i use is foxfarms sledgehammer. What medium are you in? Can you add cal&dolo lime to reduce acidity?

has this soil been used in a prior grow?

 

[CanadianDank]

get a salt flush solution, I dont know what other brands mark it as, the one i use is foxfarms sledgehammer. What medium are you in? Can you add cal&dolo lime to reduce acidity?

has this soil been used in a prior grow?

It's never been used before,
Promix fruit and vegetable organic, it's peat based as far as I know.

It's about week 6 or 7 of flower so a little late for dolo lime I think. Though this is probably a 10 week strain.

Maybe I will pick up some Clearex this week and give it a try once my soil dries out.

Definitely had a buildup causing acidity and lockout

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

blotches are usually cal/mag issues

Thank you, but if you look at the dates I originally started this thread you'll notice it's from earlier this year. I was under feeding out of fear of burning her. Switched off autos all together. Feels like a waste of time. Just here fallowing up with an old friend. Thanks for the input.

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

Maybe I will pick up some Clearex this week

EDTA tetrasodium salt and EDTA acid.

 

[Delta-9Pyromaniac]

That's what's in most of those solutions.