QAUNTUM BOARD vs HID heat difference

hillbill

hillbill

Well-Known Member
piratebug said:
The ambient room temperature that all my tents are in always reads between 64f to 68f. I built a cooling chamber in the ground, it is 8 feet in the ground, and in that chamber sits a ABS type 55 gallon drum that is filled with a antifreeze mixed liquid, that continuously pumps that liquid from the bottom of that drum up to a vented radiated cooling system, and the whole system uses batteries and 5 235watt solar panels. I made the cooling system that is just one part of my complete environment controller. The radiated cooling system I made up from a old volvo radiator and fan combo. And it helps keeps my room with the tents in at between 64f to 68f year round. Yes there are other parts of the system that control heat and humidity, but that radiated cooling system keeps the cooling part always in check! Anyway, on to your question... all my reflector intakes are merv 4 filtered and the air that gets sucked into each sealed reflector goes into the reflector @ 64f - 66f and the air that comes out of the sealed reflector before hitting a 440CFM fan that is also battery and solar powered normally reads between 70f to 72f, and that air gets vented directly to the outside.
Click to expand...
Holy shit! Impressive!
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
growingforfun said:
Whoa slow down there on the caffeine an adderall bud. All I said is recommending replacing 600 watts hps with 600 watts led is suspect af
Click to expand...
Eat a dick fool, you were spouting off about how youve been doing this forever and that physics doesn't apply to you. Said you never noticed a difference but then bitched like a school girl about me explaining how distributing the wattage more evenly and with a greater surface area was going to contribute to a lower overall heat increase. It didn't mean he had to run them full blast dummy.

And how would you know a watt is a watt in your grow area if you didn't swap equal wattages LED for HID? Are you calling yourself an idiot? Furthermore it doesnt matter what the hell you think you saw. Facts are facts for a reason. You either didn't swap watt for watt so you're talking completely out your ass, or... you did but you didn't maintain all other variables, and/or your LEDs are shit and running same effeciency or almost identical to your HID that you replaced with equal wattage..

And if you added more plants to your area to offset the increase, he could've too.. Or if you raised your lights higher, he could have too! So fuck off with your bs agenda of trying to pick at my credibility when you haven't contributed dick all and just barely started with LED..
 
Last edited:
G

growingforfun

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
Eat a dick fool, you were spouting off about how youve been doing this forever and that physics doesn't apply to you. Said you never noticed a difference but then bitched like a school girl about me explaining how distributing the wattage more evenly and with a greater surface area was going to contribute to a lower overall heat increase. It didn't mean he had to run them full blast dummy.

And how would you know a watt is a watt in your grow area if you didn't swap equal wattages LED for HID? Are you calling yourself an idiot? Furthermore it doesnt matter what the hell you think you saw. Facts are facts for a reason. You either didn't swap watt for watt so you're talking completely out your ass, or... you did but you didn't maintain all other variables, and/or your LEDs are shit and running same effeciency or almost identical to your HID that you replaced with equal wattage..

And if you added more plants to your area to offset the increase, he could've too.. Or if you raised your lights higher, he could have too! So fuck off with your bs agenda of trying to pick at my credibility when you haven't contributed dick all and just barely started with LED..
Click to expand...
Lol you've been a member since 2018 an your saying I just started... that's rich.

A watt is a watt I dont care what you think you know because you watched 300 youtube videos produced by led manufactures.

When i add x number of watts led I have to reduce that same number of hid watts to maintain temp in my well established room. That's all that changed.

If your trying to cling to un-noticable decimals then you need to put the stimulants down and reevaluate your life.
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
growingforfun said:
Lol you've been a member since 2018 an your saying I just started... that's rich.

A watt is a watt I dont care what you think you know because you watched 300 youtube videos produced by led manufactures.

When i add x number of watts led I have to reduce that same number of hid watts to maintain temp in my well established room. That's all that changed.

If your trying to cling to un-noticable decimals then you need to put the stimulants down and reevaluate your life.
Click to expand...
Lol 1 month since you ordered your first QB... Have you got it yet?

You have no clue. Carry on.
 
G

growingforfun

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
Lol 1 month since you ordered your first QB... Have you got it yet?

You have no clue. Carry on.
Click to expand...
Not accurate. I've been running it atleast a month, working towards replacing my de gavitas at a ratio of 700 watts per 1000.

I noticed I immediately had to dim my 1k from 850 to 600 when I added my 240 watt qb to maintain the same room temps. It was pretty straightforward actually.
 
Moflow

Moflow

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
If air exhaust is kept at equal rates, a more effecient light source will create less ambient temp rise than a less effecient light source.

Heat flows from hot to cold, this is important because when you use the entire surface area of the tent to dissipate the light portion of the fixture energy, the temp of the tent walls is small (and also has a 70% greater cp), so it has less of a gradient to flow enegy across before its equalized, which means it flows at a slow rate. When half of the fixtures enegy is kept in a small form factor like a light bulb or ballast, then the gradient is much greater at the fixture-air boundary, and the enegy flows from the hot fixture to the air much faster. On top of this, the tent walls will absorb 5x as much light energy as the air can absorb the hot portion of the fixture, and in a low effecient fixture the hot portion is the greatest % of the enegy output. This means the air increases temp much faster from the hot portion of the light compared to the air temp increase of an equivalent amount of energy that's transferred to the tent walls, plants, pots, water, ect, and then onto the air. The fixture doesn't have a huge surface area connected to the outside air or floor, and has to dissipate a greater % of energy than the tent walls do for a low effecient fixture. Also, the hot portion of the fixture can't dissipate energy to the outside air like the tent walls can, the hot portion of the fixture can only dissipate enegy to the inside of the tent.

A hot fixture is your enemy when talking about ambient temp rise. You have to isolate the air that the hot portion comes into contact with, ie a cool tube, and/or increase exhaust rates to notice the same ambient temp rise as a high effecient fixture. There's a thread on here where someone goes through and explains it with graphs ect, but if you don't understand thermodynamics or at least the basis, you probably will end up disagreeing.

In the most extreme cases it's maybe an effeciency delta of 20%, so while there is a huge difference when comparing the total ambient air temp increase due to the % energy being transferred to the tent air vs the total ambient air temp increase due to the % energy being transferred to the tent wall (considering equal energies applied), both those types of fixtures will still produce a hot portion, so altogether it makes a noticeable difference but theres no free lunch, you'll still have to vent QBs under most circumstances..

One day ppl will start to see I'm not just talking out my ass lol.. One day.. :bigjoint:
Click to expand...
tenor.gif

Lol
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
On the whole "a watt is a watt" question: im not touching that, its one of the trolliest subjects ever. Physics seems to say a wattbis a watt, but irl 600w of hps (no cool tube) seems to run hotter than 600w of led
Click to expand...
As stated: there is something about this subject that makes pages of angry debating. Everyone seems to have an opinion on this but nobody have tried it. Iirc nevergoodenough made some tests on this and said watt per watt hps is hotter. Personally i think both wattage and temprature of the hottest part of the light matters in how hot your ambient gets. In any case, leds need more heat anyway so its its fa hard to get your space too hot with led. We need heating all thru winter
 
G

growingforfun

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
As stated: there is something about this subject that makes pages of angry debating. Everyone seems to have an opinion on this but nobody have tried it. Iirc nevergoodenough made some tests on this and said watt per watt hps is hotter. Personally i think both wattage and temprature of the hottest part of the light matters in how hot your ambient gets. In any case, leds need more heat anyway so its its fa hard to get your space too hot with led. We need heating all thru winter
Click to expand...
Maybe the fact that I have always valued a lot of air movement has a impact on this. I have wall fans blowing across both my lights and canopy, my lights are always just above ambient temp, unlike fister, I've found air is good at pulling away heat.
 
ChiefRunningPhist

ChiefRunningPhist

Well-Known Member
Hey @growingforfun

What happens to the air temp when 100W fan is put in a grow tent and 100W space heater is put in a grow tent? Do you observe the same rates of air temp increase? Nope. That's because 1 device is immediately transferring more of its energy to into the air as thermal compared to the other device. HID and LED are just space heaters with flashlights. 1 of the heaters is smaller with a bigger light, and the other heater is bigger with a smaller light. Both are the same wattage. Does that make sense to you?

When you include the plants (99% water) and the buckets of water into the area the heat sinking ability of the space increases tremendously. But all the things in the space are mainly absorbing only the light, while the air absorbs the thermal. Air is what we measure when we measure temp. We don't measure the wall temp or the bucket temp ect. Air is the only thing we measure even though the energy goes into the wall and the buckets ect.

A 1000W HPS @ 40%
=
600W space heater


1000W LED @ 67%
=
330W space heater

^^^Does that make sense?

If you didn't personally notice a difference it's because your lights are probably about the same effeciency as your HPS.
 
G

growingforfun

Well-Known Member
ChiefRunningPhist said:
Hey @growingforfun

What happens to the air temp when 100W fan is put in a grow tent and 100W space heater is put in a grow tent? Do you observe the same rates of air temp increase? Nope. That's because 1 device is immediately transferring more of its energy to into the air as thermal compared to the other device. HID and LED are just space heaters with flashlights. 1 of the heaters is smaller with a bigger light, and the other heater is bigger with a smaller light. Both are the same wattage. Does that make sense to you?

When you include the plants (99% water) and the buckets of water into the area the heat sinking ability of the space increases tremendously. But all the things in the space are mainly absorbing only the light, while the air absorbs the thermal. Air is what we measure when we measure temp. We don't measure the wall temp or the bucket temp ect. Air is the only thing we measure even though the energy goes into the wall and the buckets ect.

A 1000W HPS @ 40%
=
600W space heater


1000W LED @ 67%
=
330W space heater

^^^Does that make sense?

If you didn't personally notice a difference it's because your lights are probably about the same effeciency as your HPS.
Click to expand...
I just dont agree. For myself it seems a watt is a watt. Doesnt matter if its fans, dehumidifiers, lights, radios, etc.

The power flows into the device, and heat with it.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
A watt is most definitely a watt but the thing is the whole calculation is much more complicated cause a led lit system is not the same as a hps lit system. IR transmitts heat and penetrates in a completely different way which means the 2 setups arent apples to apples. Sometimes you may find that yeah they do compare easily but some other times no.

Please read some advanced thermal engineering and you will realize that its more complicated than any of the other things we try to tacle here at riu. Thermodynamics is a wolf in sheeps clothing, seems all simple but when you start looking into it its a deep rabbithole. I recommend reading about Maxwells demon to get a feel for the complexities.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top