Canadian Suppliers
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AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
If its a sealed room think about doing co2 bottles. No extra humidity or extra heat to deal with. In a fully sealed room a 50LB bottle would do a whole crop on 8-10 lights.
For Propane look at Grozone LP5 and LP10 burners.
Thanks for the suggestions.
Unfortunately co2 isn't an option.
Do you think a five burner is probably too much for an approximately 1000 cu/ft room?
Know anything/feedback on the titan controls brand?
AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
I meant to say "Bottled co2 isn't an option", to clarify.
If anyone in canada has any input/experience on anything co2 related to share, please do. Difficulty in getting bottles refilled, safety concerns with a gas burner inside - whether garage or home, tent, whatever. I'd like to hear experiences.
Also, what are some of the more self proclaimed 'safer' brands of co2 generator (burner variety).
Hey man.
I haven't tried any of those types of co2 generating methods. Yeast, or citric acid and whatever, nor fungi methods. I just feel as though it'd be a waste of time and there's no way to control and set limits.
The more I read about burners, the more I realize potential complications and even hazards.
With the mixtures like yeast/sugar, and other similar methods, another concern is that I'd not know how much to make and how much I'd spend on those materials. Potential issues as well (mold? fungus?), and running inconsistent levels and that affecting whatever light intensity and/or temp one might be trying to hit. In veg maybe this would be less of an issue? I honestly don't know, never tried it.
As far as burners go, several that I've seen don't say anything about 'not using it in a residential setting', but I definitely am learning about all the potential risks - besides the immediately obvious one.
-If propane fireplaces, for example, vent any waste/gases outside, how do they not vent a lot of the heat as well? Do they just rely on IR heat and heating elements (like ceramic elements) and the glass screen to heat the room? Curious.
J232
Well-Known Member
T&T hydro in Edmonton has good prices and I believe they make there own line of burners. Good price on co2 equip in general, have used them a lot over the years. I just grabbed my controller from him. Has all the gas stuff as well.
AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
The burners will have blue flames so create co2 unless they are dirty from carbon buildup and have orange flame and create monoxide.
Personally even for a 20 light room I'd still use bottled co2. No heat, no extra humidity and no toxins.
The only CSA approved burners that I've see were from CVR/Blue Ox or Grozone. Personally I'd go with Grozone. Awesome products and really easy company to deal with for warranty also Canadian company.
CVR is no longer but Blue Ox might be around still.
I know of the online store, looks like decent prices on various products. Thanks for the heads up. Do you use a burner? What type of setting if you don't mind me asking?
Thanks for the additional info. TandT hydro seems to have CVR, and I saw them listed at megawatt hydro too (garden wholesaler). I've found Grozone at a few online retailer though, thanks for that suggestion by the way. Too bad the smallest unit is a 5-burner. This is not for a 20 light / 20,000 watt room. It's barely 1/10th of that. The best deal I've seen is a two burner on amazon.ca, which suggests it's good for up to a 10x10 room, pretty standard residential sized room. Some people set burners up in smaller rooms, some people even in tents(!) - which sounds really stupid, I sure wouldn't.
I have a CO alarm.
-There is nowhere locally that sells co2 refills... So, we're fucked for that. Otherwise, I'd probably not be here looking, asking. Haha. Though, I'm still checking into a couple potential options.
-$300+ for one 20lb tank, $700+ for a 50lb tank... pfff.
-Having to get refills (again, not even an option), and not wanting to be "down" while doing so would require at least two tanks, right? Double that tank price then.
-I can only imagine how heavy a 50lb tank is, and having that brought into a residential setting/building, on the regular... yikes. A 20lb tank might not be so bad.
-The heat (burner) is welcome
-The humidity (burner) from what I heard a few people say, isn't too bad (depending on setup; lighting, etc.) but obviously needs accounting for in regards to dehu and such.
-They also use up the oxygen in the room though, and I think, depending on fuel type, put off more than just co2 and h2o. Though plants create/release oxygen, you'd not now the levels and where you/the room is at. Low oxygen sensor/alarm probably a good idea..?
I might try a small burner, if I can find one, and vent the room (to outside) several times per light cycle. Though that'd through the environment (vpd, etc.) off each time, I suppose. *sigh*. Propane is relatively cheap and readily available, cheap enough to do that...I think...maybe? I'm open to criticism and views from experience though.
We might just be shit outta luck and stuck with a continuous venting room with no real environmental control and ambient co2.
Thanks for the help guys. Much appreciated. I'll be making some calls around tomorrow.
AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
That seems high for 20lb tank. I could do $120+tax+shipping for and empty 20lb aluminum tank. Have you tried searching for a fire safety equipment supplier? They usually do yearly testing of local business for their fire extinguishers and flood lights. Ask a local business who does their testing.
I was actually just double checking whether that $300 price was for aluminum or ...steel (I assume steel tanks can be bought as well, and are cheaper? Not to mention heavier.) And it was aluminum, and I just plucked it from one site, TandT, because I happened to be looking there. Haha.
I will call the few fire safety equipment suppliers I found out about tomorrow (thanks for the tip). And also another "big gas" companies, who definitely won't do business with non-commercial - but I'll call and see anyways.
I know a couple larger scale indoor gardeners who don't use co2, and the reason why is they can't get it...so I'm not very hopeful. Hydro store says can't get it (and he grows as well). Lame.
Thanks again, dude.
I'll update the outcome.
AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
They are buying new tanks so they are expensive I got a hook up for used certified tanks for cheap I buy for my shop. These are customer owned so you can re sell them or get refilled anywhere Also welding supply places will also refill just make sure they give you back a customer owned and not a rental tank as those are usually owned by companies like Air Liquide etc and you cant resell them.
What are reasonable prices for a refill on a 20lb tank? (and price of "testing" as well, should that need to be done)? I'm curious what some prices are for people, at various "sellers" in different regions of canada, if several people could share prices, please.
Edit: Also, I know there are variables, but assume decently sealed room, about 800-1000cu/ft, with say about 40 sq/ft of canopy(?), how long is a 20lb tank gonna last - at moderate levels of around 600-800ppm even. (I'm not trying to push high co2 numbers, I'm trying to have a controlled environment).
Thanks.
AquaTerra
Well-Known Member
$35-45 after tax per 20LB refill. With say 4 lights in a sealed room that bottle would probably last 4-6 weeks.
They don't seem to answer email as of late. Hah.
Maybe I'll call'em.