Police Interactions.

mooray

Well-Known Member
I don't know about a lot, just because I don't think police chase accident deaths happen a lot, but for sure in population dense areas like SoCal where range is less of an issue, drones would be useful. Of course they already have heli's on chases, so they kind of already have the drone, plus the cop cars back off these days once things are looking sketchy. At that point if you want tech to help, then you implement mandatory vehicle disable systems that can be remotely operated....which you know how that goes...but mah car freedoms!!!!...and it's tied up in court and goes nowhere and we endlessly squabble about that magic combination of hardware again.

And of course more eyes on scene with a third party perspective would be great. Thermal cameras to see inside homes/buildings so they know where to enter safely, things like that. At that point it's movie stuff, because while we have the tech to make every encounter better, spending a quarter million dollars on every small town police department and five million on every moderate police department and fifty million on every large police department, is probably more than what you'd spend on jobs/education programs...and you still haven't really fixed anything, but sure, you've saved a few lives. Then the next guy comes along and he thinks if only we had the super *duper* hardware kit, that'd really solve it. Nope, that next kit won't do it either, because you haven't actually made anyone's life better.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I don't know about a lot, just because I don't think police chase accident deaths happen a lot, but for sure in population dense areas like SoCal where range is less of an issue, drones would be useful. Of course they already have heli's on chases, so they kind of already have the drone, plus the cop cars back off these days once things are looking sketchy. At that point if you want tech to help, then you implement mandatory vehicle disable systems that can be remotely operated....which you know how that goes...but mah car freedoms!!!!...and it's tied up in court and goes nowhere and we endlessly squabble about that magic combination of hardware again.
https://www.fettolawgroup.com/personal-injury-blog/2018/march/statistics-on-emergency-vehicle-accidents-in-the/Screen Shot 2021-08-22 at 3.47.30 PM.png


And of course more eyes on scene with a third party perspective would be great. Thermal cameras to see inside homes/buildings so they know where to enter safely, things like that. At that point it's movie stuff, because while we have the tech to make every encounter better, spending a quarter million dollars on every small town police department and five million on every moderate police department and fifty million on every large police department, is probably more than what you'd spend on jobs/education programs...and you still haven't really fixed anything, but sure, you've saved a few lives. Then the next guy comes along and he thinks if only we had the super *duper* hardware kit, that'd really solve it. Nope, that next kit won't do it either, because you haven't actually made anyone's life better.
You put out lots of numbers, but I am not sure that any of them actually mean much in reality. But eventually we will actually have to invest in how we police our society and bring it out of the last millennium.

But I am not holding my breath.
 

mooray

Well-Known Member
I think the big shocker in there are the fire truck accidents, 31,600 between 2000 and 2009!

My numbers aren't "real", high or low, I have no idea. I just know that selling anything to the gov't in regard to public safety gets 100x scrutiny and as a result, is very expensive.

I hear you, and I'm not holding my breath on anyone proactively making society better either.
 
Last edited:

RobCat

Well-Known Member
Forgot only black people this happens too.......
I watched the protests at their peak. Most of those clowns were hipsters, artists, trustifarians, liberals "struggling to keep their head above water in a sea of white man" and all that other PC crap. Far less minorities attended.Hell, I grew up in a majority black community and not a single one I keep in touch with went to those protests. The point i was making is that the people pushing this whole agenda are by and large privileged upper class white folks that dont have to deal with the daily drama a lot of the rest of us do. BTW Im white AND poor as well
 
Last edited:

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I watched the protests at their peak. Most of those clowns were hipsters, artists, trustifarians, liberals "struggling to keep their head above water in a sea of white man" and all that other PC crap. Far less minorities attended.Hell, I grew up in a majority black community and not a single one I keep in touch with went to those protests. The point i was making is that the people pushing this whole agenda are by and large privileged upper class white folks that dont have to deal with the daily drama a lot of the rest of us do. BTW Im white AND poor as well
 

DaFreak

Well-Known Member
Police chases are just incredibly stupid. Where I'm from they are not allowed, after a certain speed they have to back off. They get the license plate number and deal with it later, too dangerous. I hear that America is starting to head this way as well.
 

RobCat

Well-Known Member
If only we could figure out why black people are hesitant to protest to the cops about police brutality.

What you should really be figuring out is why they insist on voting for politicians that use them for sheep and then discard them like last weeks garbage. Example: When i got out of the service I moved to Austin to attend college, that was 15 years ago, and it was a perfectly diverse city if there ever was one. Most of the white neighborhoods in the north and west, minority neighborhoods in the east and on the south side. A healthy mix of democrats and republicans alike. Everybody was getting along fine. The police force was also very diverse and professional, probably the best in Texas at one time. Then the "progressives", mostly well-to-do outsiders from places like California and New York, moved in and slowly hijacked the city council, swearing that "We will never allow gentrification to expand East of I-35". Ya been there lately? The minority neighborhoods are all but extinct. They gutted them. They gutted them and pushed them out, along with their mom and pop stores. The mexican restaurants, the black owned BBQ stands on the east side. They just couldn't compete with the rising costs of living there. The only black folks left I see there these days are hipsters(go figure). Now theyre taking aim at Chicano Park, a place where people meet up to have car shows and smoke some grass. But that has to go too. Why? Because some popular feminist in the condos that overlooks the park has sway with the city and constantly menstruates about the "toxic masculinity going on in that parking lot". Thats not to mention all the times the property mongers call the cops on them for something as trivial as lighting a joint or whistling at a jogger. Yeah, you can live in whatever reality suits you the best. All living there showed me is that inside most progressives is an activist that loves minorities but only from a good distance. It pays to realize when you're being taken for a chump, especially when its happening in every major city across the country.
 

doublejj

Well-Known Member
"I don't trust the police. They feel they have a license to kill." That got me out of jury duty.:D
that won't work in Cali where there are plenty of jury trials that don't involve police. You would get rescheduled to another jury pool...
 

mooray

Well-Known Member
What you should really be figuring out is why they insist on voting for politicians that use them for sheep and then discard them like last weeks garbage. Example: When i got out of the service I moved to Austin to attend college, that was 15 years ago, and it was a perfectly diverse city if there ever was one. Most of the white neighborhoods in the north and west, minority neighborhoods in the east and on the south side. A healthy mix of democrats and republicans alike. Everybody was getting along fine. The police force was also very diverse and professional, probably the best in Texas at one time. Then the "progressives", mostly well-to-do outsiders from places like California and New York, moved in and slowly hijacked the city council, swearing that "We will never allow gentrification to expand East of I-35". Ya been there lately? The minority neighborhoods are all but extinct. They gutted them. They gutted them and pushed them out, along with their mom and pop stores. The mexican restaurants, the black owned BBQ stands on the east side. They just couldn't compete with the rising costs of living there. The only black folks left I see there these days are hipsters(go figure). Now theyre taking aim at Chicano Park, a place where people meet up to have car shows and smoke some grass. But that has to go too. Why? Because some popular feminist in the condos that overlooks the park has sway with the city and constantly menstruates about the "toxic masculinity going on in that parking lot". Thats not to mention all the times the property mongers call the cops on them for something as trivial as lighting a joint or whistling at a jogger. Yeah, you can live in whatever reality suits you the best. All living there showed me is that inside most progressives is an activist that loves minorities but only from a good distance. It pays to realize when you're being taken for a chump, especially when its happening in every major city across the country.
So you're in Texas? Because I've spent some time in Texas as well, from Austin to Houston on out to East Texas towards Shreveport. We call it, "The South-Lite". Most white people in the south think there is no racism, because they think racism is when you beat the shit out of a black person and drag them through the street, which doesn't actually happen very often anymore. However, there's a real, "you do your thing over there and I'll do my thing over here" type of soft-segregation that goes on all throughout the south, and that's segregation where whites think, "everyone was getting along fine", when in reality, it's, "I don't want any fucking blacks in my neighborhood". I think that when you're in an area that's balls deep in racism, then moderate racism looks like, "everybody getting along fine", and when you're in an area with very little racism, moderate racism looks like a shit-ton of racism.
 

RobCat

Well-Known Member
So you're in Texas? Because I've spent some time in Texas as well, from Austin to Houston on out to East Texas towards Shreveport. We call it, "The South-Lite". Most white people in the south think there is no racism, because they think racism is when you beat the shit out of a black person and drag them through the street, which doesn't actually happen very often anymore. However, there's a real, "you do your thing over there and I'll do my thing over here" type of soft-segregation that goes on all throughout the south, and that's segregation where whites think, "everyone was getting along fine", when in reality, it's, "I don't want any fucking blacks in my neighborhood". I think that when you're in an area that's balls deep in racism, then moderate racism looks like, "everybody getting along fine", and when you're in an area with very little racism, moderate racism looks like a shit-ton of racism.
I LIVED in Texas a long time ago. Unlike you the black folks I grew up with in the south didn't have a pompous attitude towards other races. They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine. There was fights but never over race. And that dragging youre dramatizing was an isolated incident.......in a backwoods town.....25 years ago. Houston? Theres areas of that dumpster fire where a white guy would get capped just for standing around. Yeah, Ive encountered plenty of your kind. Racism could disappear in a day and youd still find a way to blame whitey for all your shortcomings
 

topcat

Well-Known Member
that won't work in Cali where there are plenty of jury trials that don't involve police. You would get rescheduled to another jury pool...
It worked for me just a month ago. No rescheduling. I'm in Sonoma County.
 
Last edited:

doublejj

Well-Known Member
I LIVED in Texas a long time ago. Unlike you the black folks I grew up with in the south didn't have a pompous attitude towards other races. They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine. There was fights but never over race. And that dragging youre dramatizing was an isolated incident.......in a backwoods town.....25 years ago. Houston? Theres areas of that dumpster fire where a white guy would get capped just for standing around. Yeah, Ive encountered plenty of your kind. Racism could disappear in a day and youd still find a way to blame whitey for all your shortcomings
was George Floyd murdered?
 

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
I LIVED in Texas a long time ago. Unlike you the black folks I grew up with in the south didn't have a pompous attitude towards other races. They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine. There was fights but never over race. And that dragging youre dramatizing was an isolated incident.......in a backwoods town.....25 years ago. Houston? Theres areas of that dumpster fire where a white guy would get capped just for standing around. Yeah, Ive encountered plenty of your kind. Racism could disappear in a day and youd still find a way to blame whitey for all your shortcomings
wrong.

Nobody really lives there.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
I LIVED in Texas a long time ago. Unlike you the black folks I grew up with in the south didn't have a pompous attitude towards other races. They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine. There was fights but never over race. And that dragging youre dramatizing was an isolated incident.......in a backwoods town.....25 years ago. Houston? Theres areas of that dumpster fire where a white guy would get capped just for standing around. Yeah, Ive encountered plenty of your kind. Racism could disappear in a day and youd still find a way to blame whitey for all your shortcomings
So say a bunch of stupid racist shit about how segregation is great, then jump on your high horse and claim you know all about someone you have never met with your .... 2 month old account, then fling your dumb racist shit again.

Sounds about right.
 

hanimmal

Well-Known Member
https://apnews.com/article/health-police-mental-health-41883ccc67210e505e13bdd7aaf4713aScreen Shot 2021-08-23 at 11.28.10 AM.png
EDITOR’S NOTE — This story includes discussion of suicide. If you or someone you know needs help, please call the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 1-800-273-8255.

The videos are difficult to watch.

In one, a man dangles over the edge of an Oklahoma City overpass, his legs swinging in midair as police grab his arms and pull him from the brink. In another, a woman hangs high above the Los Angeles Harbor as a half-dozen officers drag her, head-first, up the side of the bridge. The panicked voices of cops cry out, “We got you, we got you!” just before they pin her to the ground and pull out handcuffs.

The short clips were posted on official law enforcement social media accounts, part of a longstanding practice by police agencies to showcase their lifesaving efforts online — especially in 2021 as desperation grows for positive press amid accusations of excessive force and racism following George Floyd’s murder, and rising gun violence and killings.

But with renewed attention on officer interactions with people who are suffering from mental health issues, experts and advocates are taking another look at these posts with an eye toward whether they exploit the very victims law enforcement just saved.

“It’s like we were living in this tragedy with them,” said Kevin Berthia, a mental health advocate who has survived his own suicide attempts. “Now how is that not creating trauma for anybody else? Who else is this triggering?”

The posts are easy to find on Facebook, Instagram and Twitter. Police departments nationwide may upload them without the permission of the person in crisis — though their identities are obscured — without a warning about contents and without consulting mental health professionals.

Debbie Plotnick, vice president for state and federal advocacy at Mental Health America, reviewed a half-dozen from around the country.

“Yes, they helped get a person down and that is commendable,” she said, but added: “I’m not seeing that this has value in helping people’s mental health.”

While police say mental health is their priority, the footage appears to tell a different story. Law enforcement agencies have long tried to showcase the harrowing and dangerous work of fighting crime and saving lives, and the feeds also include officers delivering babies, acts of kindness and shows of strength.

The New York Police Department, along with images of smiling cops, often tweets detailed captions that include the exact pier someone jumped from or the number of pills they swallowed before the officers “saved” them. Other posts include videos from the scene.

Yet the American Association of Suicidology specifically suggests that any reporting on suicide or suicide attempts not include the method or location. The association recommends that photos and videos from the scene also be excluded, even if the person’s identity is concealed.

The NYPD declined requests for comment.

Some experts fear copycats, saying such detailed posts — like the recent Los Angeles Police Department posts with body-cam footage of the woman’s suicide attempt on the bridge — basically give a manual to vulnerable people.

“Here’s a spot on the bridge where it literally took like six uniformed police officers to drag this person back over the side,” said Jonathan Singer, president of the American Association of Suicidology.

The LAPD declined to comment, but said in a statement that it does not have a specific policy in these cases. The agency said it strives to protect the individual’s identity but does not typically seek permission beforehand.

In the 55-second video — posted to Facebook, Twitter and Instagram less than a month after the incident — police were called to the bridge in San Pedro after the woman was seen climbing over the side. The scene is fraught with tension — rushing wind, the woman’s panicked breathing, the squawking of the radios echoing off the bridge’s metal, the clicking of handcuffs.

“Great teamwork resulted in her receiving the help she needed,” the LAPD’s posts said, with a link to the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline’s website. “Remember, you are never alone and there is always help.”

In Oklahoma City, the overpass video posted to the police department’s Facebook page in May includes body-cam footage and interviews with responding officers. The man’s face is blurred out, though the department did not seek his permission before posting the video.

The final clip shows the man being loaded into a police cruiser with the text: “After rescuing the man, officers took him to the hospital and started the process of getting him the help he needed.” The phone number of the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline follows.

Master Sgt. Gary Knight, a spokesperson for the Oklahoma City Police Department, said the goal was showing residents how the actions of the officers saved the man’s life during the two-hour incident.

“The last thing we ever want to do is hinder somebody’s recovery when they’ve been in a state of crisis,” Knight said. “We’re not out here to try to make somebody’s condition worse. That’s why we showed up in the first place — to try to help that person.”

Daniel Reidenberg, executive director of the Minnesota-based Suicide Awareness Voices of Education, said such social media posts may actually deter viewers from calling 911, for fear they might also get handcuffed or arrested.

“It’s too complex of an issue to boil down into a video like that,” he said.

Ronnie Walker agrees. Her stepson died by suicide when he was a college junior, prompting her to form a now-international support group and online forum for other grieving families, the Hawaii-based Alliance of Hope For Suicide Loss Survivors.

“It was really devastating for everybody who knew and loved him,” she said, speaking on the 26th anniversary of her stepson’s death. “It was as if a grenade went off in our family and everyone was wounded, each in their own way.”

Looking at the police posts, Walker said, could easily be traumatizing for people who have lost loved ones to suicide.

“I don’t want to dismiss the heroism of the police or that they have kindness in their hearts,” she said. “I just don’t see some of those videos as portraying that or conveying that. It’s more sensational.”

The police department of Appleton, Wisconsin — a city of 74,000 north of Milwaukee — took a different approach. They had discussions for nearly a month before going public in February with an eight-minute suicide intervention video that is much less explicit than others. They also sought permission from the man who had been in crisis and his family and worked with mental health organizations.

“Is this going to be positive for our community? Is this actually going to cause the conversations that we want to happen around mental health?” Lt. Meghan Cash said. “Or is this just a video?”

In recent years, officials who oversee so-called suicide hot spots like San Francisco’s Golden Gate Bridge and the George Washington Bridge, which connects New York City and New Jersey, have worked to install prevention or deterrent systems.

About 30 people die by suicide annually on the Golden Gate Bridge, and another 150-plus people try to take their lives there each year. Many come in contact with the 36 members of the bridge patrol — whose captain, David Rivera, hopes new conversations around mental health, like Simone Biles’ discussions at the Olympics, will encourage people to get help.

Rivera’s department does not post publicly about suicide interventions, and instead chooses to privately honor its members and others who may have been involved in rescues, like bridge ironworkers, roadway staffers or officers from other police agencies.

“We can recognize them and write up a commendation,” Rivera said.

Berthia, the mental health advocate, went to the bridge in 2005 with the intent to end his life. His encounter over the railing with a California Highway Patrol officer was captured in a photograph published on The San Francisco Chronicle’s front page. The picture haunted him for years.

“It brought me back to the day,” Berthia said. “It brought me back to the moment. It brought me back to the wind, and the smell.”

Now, Berthia speaks nationally about suicide prevention, and says there’s a long way to go on mental health awareness. Still, his message to people in crisis is a hopeful one.

“I need you here,” he says, “I need you here. So please call or reach out, do whatever you’ve got to do.”
 

mooray

Well-Known Member
I LIVED in Texas a long time ago. Unlike you the black folks I grew up with in the south didn't have a pompous attitude towards other races. They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine. There was fights but never over race. And that dragging youre dramatizing was an isolated incident.......in a backwoods town.....25 years ago. Houston? Theres areas of that dumpster fire where a white guy would get capped just for standing around. Yeah, Ive encountered plenty of your kind. Racism could disappear in a day and youd still find a way to blame whitey for all your shortcomings
Black people certainly aren't exempt from racism. The soft segregation I'm referring to isn't, "aw jeez, we sure wish we could live with you wonderful white folks", it's more like, "yeah well fuck you too". I know your sentences, because I've heard them a thousand times and I've seen what they translate to. You just skirt the truth. When you say, "They knew that would get them nowhere. We all got along fine.", it's actually, "they knew their place".
 
Top