Exotics, PGRS, Foilars, "snake oil"

[DesperateFarmer]

Please, don't give me the organic song and dance. I know, I read it in all the other PGR threads on here, I gotcha. We ain't out to kill everyone. I just want to hear anyone's experiences, you're all Gibbin' clones, gibb probably causes cancer. clonex? Cancer.

So farming, I get to try a lot of things, and formulate what I can't get, and if it works on cantaloupes, well maybe it works on cannabis.

So, anybody got experience with any of these:
general PGR (Gibb+Kinetin+IBA) this is common, sometimes I formulate them independently, for example, too hot for turnips to grow roots? IBA 'em! Getting leggy? Kinetin. you get the idea, sometimes as a bandaid, but together as a booster.

Exotic PGRs (like) (Forchlorfenuron) if you ate kiwis or grapes you ate this.
Humic Acid (in its Various Formulations) think "peat water"
Mepiquat (pix) The chinese keep putting this shit on everything, think cancer time! Just wonder if anyone was dumb enough to do it.
GABA (Amino acid) + L-Glutamine (Amino Acid like MSG, without the salt)
Emerald Bio made a product with these and idiots caused it to be pulled because oh noes MSG, ((long story I tried to license this one for production, and they literally told me F off, and are worthlessly holding the patent.)) **The plant likes not making amino acids you provide, those darn lazy plants! (no residue)


This is stuff I have played with for years off and on experimental, the pix is probably the only one I would say is dangerous to health, and I really haven't used it but once without much experience, as I did not try but once. Just curious if anyone was that 'gung ho" I know one of hte other quat chlorides was being used by the Aussie for that nasty junk weed.

with everything else on this list (other than pix) I can make a 83 day melon from seed in dirt to market with a passable brix in 63 days, with a yield 4 times average in my controls. It sure as hell works in melons.

I'm thinking a general PGR early with a amino acid application 3 times would give a really booming product.

I think PGR late is fairly risky, but alas no experience. I am less interested in an ethics debate, and more about pros and cons from a growing point of view. The label rates are relatively safe for most of these, with very short pre Harvest intervals for food.

 

[OG-KGP]

Gravity by Humboldt was a great product (ethics aside). Added density and weight to all flowers it touched. I think I still have a couple bottles laying around somewhere. It never listed the ingredients on the bottle, imagine that.

I also still use a humic / fulvic / amino acid.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

Gravity by Humboldt was a great product (ethics aside). Added density and weight to all flowers it touched. I think I still have a couple bottles laying around somewhere. It never listed the ingredients on the bottle, imagine that.

I also still use a humic / fulvic / amino acid.

Neat, do you use the humic etc in a hydro solution or as a foilar? Do you see a big difference? I had really good luck with the Amino Acids on produce.

 

[OG-KGP]

I grow in soilless. Root drench and foliar. My flowers are top notch, I've been using them for so long, I never did a side by side but definitely a staple in my garden. Very interested in your studies and hope other can chime in too.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

I'm thinking I will try some 2 x 2 tables early next year on clones. so I can get some good controls. I've got to flower next seed batch and hopefully I will find some good candidate mothers. I was thinking as eating broccoli last night, I wonder if anyone has studied BAP. I know we did use BAP more than once on broccoli to keep them tight.

 

[xtsho]

Learn how to grow.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

Learn how to grow.

Yes I'm aware that on top of organic purist crowd there is a "use gud lights and why didn't you use the super cool looking bottle of fertilizer and you need to learn to grow" got it. That's wasn't the point of the thread. I dont have alot of cannabis experience but I suspect I have far more production experience in general ag. Please. Keep toxic stuff to yourself. I'm asking for experiences not "get gud I play cod lulz" spout off.
Why? Because it's a foundation for experiments. And experiments are fun. And sometimes productive. Next thing you know you'll be telling me how you grew in soil with kelp extract and made 18 lbs on a 4x8, because you had some gud lights and the best killer 50 dollar a pint liquid fertilizer called weedzilla or something.

 

[Herb & Suds]

Yes I'm aware that on top of organic purist crowd there is a "use gud lights and why didn't you use the super cool looking bottle of fertilizer and you need to learn to grow" got it. That's wasn't the point of the thread. I dont have alot of cannabis experience but I suspect I have far more production experience in general ag. Please. Keep toxic stuff to yourself. I'm asking for experiences not "get gud I play cod lulz" spout off.
Why? Because it's a foundation for experiments. And experiments are fun. And sometimes productive. Next thing you know you'll be telling me how you grew in soil with kelp extract and made 18 lbs on a 4x8, because you had some gud lights and the best killer 50 dollar a pint liquid fertilizer called weedzilla or something.

Kill em all
Let god sort em out
Amirite?

 

[jondamon]

Yes I'm aware that on top of organic purist crowd there is a "use gud lights and why didn't you use the super cool looking bottle of fertilizer and you need to learn to grow" got it. That's wasn't the point of the thread. I dont have alot of cannabis experience but I suspect I have far more production experience in general ag. Please. Keep toxic stuff to yourself. I'm asking for experiences not "get gud I play cod lulz" spout off.
Why? Because it's a foundation for experiments. And experiments are fun. And sometimes productive. Next thing you know you'll be telling me how you grew in soil with kelp extract and made 18 lbs on a 4x8, because you had some gud lights and the best killer 50 dollar a pint liquid fertilizer called weedzilla or something.

you got @xtsho all wrong dude. He’s the epiphany of simplicity when it comes to growing.

And probably older than you.

 

[mudballs]

Yeah dont mind xtsho he can be absolute dipshit sometimes. Hey im not down pgr's but im down with science and observation so good luck. Also, i use Eraser AP on the ranch here and noticed when a plant survives a spray it bushes out 10x and can only produce these real tiny leaves. Always thought that was cool and wanted to play around with heavily diluted glyphosate foliar on cannabis in pgr context.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

Lol. I was thinking control groups with Jack's 321 and clones with adjacent separate tables of various experiments

 

[DesperateFarmer]

Yeah dont mind xtsho he can be absolute dipshit sometimes. Hey im not down pgr's but im down with science and observation so good luck. Also, i use Eraser AP on the ranch here and noticed when a plant survives a spray it bushes out 10x and can only produce these real tiny leaves. Always thought that was cool and wanted to play around with heavily diluted glyphosate foliar on cannabis in pgr context.

In the 80s the Spanish tried 24d on melons at very low ppm to push vines. And later as a sweetner by "stressing". (It didnt work). I think glyphosate stress is mostly useful as a selection tool for outdoor use to make a tolerant variety in broad acre. By generation 5 of 100 plants you should have a roundup ready variety. But I haven't used glyph like that so I can't say. I do know it makes an absolutely wonderful cleaner. If you do experiment post results. If you'll read what herbicide group you use you can look for what amino acid chain is disrupts and possibly target what you want to do. Just remember alot of these things are dangerous.

 

[OG-KGP]

you got @xtsho all wrong dude. He’s the epiphany of simplicity when it comes to growing.

And probably older than you.

Simplicity is good and nothing against his growing but that was an asshole reply. And from the reply, age doesn't mean maturity.

A person who is interested in experimenting with PGR's, RGS's, and organic plant growth stimulates should not be bashed by asking a question on a open forum.

If the guy doesn't have anything to add, maybe he should shut his mouth and scroll to another posting where he could be of help. Just saying.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

you got @xtsho all wrong dude. He’s the epiphany of simplicity when it comes to growing.

And probably older than you.

Probably. But I grew 53 different crops at my peak in 19. I love experimenting. I would take a job with state university but its too political. Applied for a job as agronomist with private company but just not enough money for being statewide. They're anted a vegetable man but I think they expected me to just bea sweet potato man. No gracias.

 

[jondamon]

Yes I'm aware that on top of organic purist crowd there is a "use gud lights and why didn't you use the super cool looking bottle of fertilizer and you need to learn to grow" got it. That's wasn't the point of the thread. I dont have alot of cannabis experience but I suspect I have far more production experience in general ag. Please. Keep toxic stuff to yourself. I'm asking for experiences not "get gud I play cod lulz" spout off.
Why? Because it's a foundation for experiments. And experiments are fun. And sometimes productive. Next thing you know you'll be telling me how you grew in soil with kelp extract and made 18 lbs on a 4x8, because you had some gud lights and the best killer 50 dollar a pint liquid fertilizer called weedzilla or something.

The things we know for sure are that most synthetic PGR’s aren’t any good for you.

something about paclobutrazol breaking down into Nitrosamines or something when burned etc.


if contaminants in the resulting smoke could be tested somewhere for pollutants etc and whether any of these “supposed” toxins were present rather than just smoking it yourself it would be very useful but I’m not suggesting for one minute you should get it all tested etc just please don’t smoke any of it.




Paclobutrazol impacts a plant cell’s ability to elongate, which in cannabis means cells pack much tighter and denser on the flower. It also hinders the development of key terpenes on the plant, and reduces the ability of the plant to produce THC.

When buds which contains paclobutrazol are smoked, it breaks down into nitrosamines — the most carcinogenic compound found in cigarettes. Studies say paclobutrazol can negatively impact fertility, as well as cause liver damage.

 

[jondamon]

I started using Triacantonol derived from Beeswax during Veg.

the current plant im growing has been vegging for approx 7 weeks and I’ve just flipped to 12/12.

I’ve grown this strain from seed almost every grow since around 2012 and I’ve seen approx 4 or 5 different phenos. I’ve never had one that puts out leaves this thick and dense. Granted it’s in a scrog, but it wasn’t in a scrog the whole time.

This has been trained into the scrog and pruned 3x since Friday lol.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

The things we know for sure are that most synthetic PGR’s aren’t any good for you.

something about paclobutrazol breaking down into Nitrosamines or something when burned etc.


if contaminants in the resulting smoke could be tested somewhere for pollutants etc and whether any of these “supposed” toxins were present rather than just smoking it yourself it would be very useful but I’m not suggesting for one minute you should get it all tested etc just please don’t smoke any of it.




Paclobutrazol impacts a plant cell’s ability to elongate, which in cannabis means cells pack much tighter and denser on the flower. It also hinders the development of key terpenes on the plant, and reduces the ability of the plant to produce THC.

When buds which contains paclobutrazol are smoked, it breaks down into nitrosamines — the most carcinogenic compound found in cigarettes. Studies say paclobutrazol can negatively impact fertility, as well as cause liver damage.

Not being a Nancy, but in early 2000s they made us go from straight fire tobacco barns (LP) to heat exchangers. Why? Gas exhaust cured tobacco has high nitrosamines! Cool right? Who's running CO2 generators on LP? In tobacco labs they were pulling cores and putting them into gas spectrometers and looking for nitrosamine form exchanger leaks and illegal residues. I think combustion of anything is bad and potassium is what will kill you. Radioactive potassium in smoke is what gets you in tobacco imo. It's potash intensive. Just a numbers game. I mean we did spray alot of stuff in tobacco too. All I'm saying is sure it causes cancer but there's roundup in your Cheerios. And radiation everywhere. Etc. I think smoking weed is probably bad for you. Driving a car is bad for you. Humans are self destructive. Anyways this was the ethics discussion I wished to avoid. I do agree that you shouldn't produce what you yourself wouldn't consume. But I also think you'll find hypocrisy in everything chemical related.

 

[DesperateFarmer]

I started using Triacantonol derived from Beeswax during Veg.

the current plant im growing has been vegging for approx 7 weeks and I’ve just flipped to 12/12.

I’ve grown this strain from seed almost every grow since around 2012 and I’ve seen approx 4 or 5 different phenos. I’ve never had one that puts out leaves this thick and dense. Granted it’s in a scrog, but it wasn’t in a scrog the whole time.

This has been trained into the scrog and pruned 3x since Friday lol.
View attachment 5022053View attachment 5022054View attachment 5022056View attachment 5022057

BTW this is the stuff I wanted to see. Thanks for your post. What are your methods, timing, and rates of application

 

[jondamon]

BTW this is the stuff I wanted to see. Thanks for your post. What are your methods, timing, and rates of application

At the moment I’m adding as it’s stated on the product I purchased

4-6 drops per litre of mix.

i mix up 25L top ups for my reservoir and just give a little squirt lol.

 

[jondamon]

The product also states from seed to harvest usage but it helps promote a lot of veg style growth according to what I’ve read. This is the advert blurb


Triacontanol plays a variety of physiological role:


To promote chlorophyll and increase photosynthesis.

Promote energy storage.

To improve cell permeability.

Increase of nutrient intake

To increase photosynthetic strength.

To enhance enzymatic activity, and promote mineral absorption.

To promote seed germination, and rooting.

To increase yield, protein dry material content, promote maturation of plants.

Protect plants from stress and including heat stress,

Healthier plants & vigorous growth