Mar- A Lago raided FBI Warrants

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ActionianJacksonian

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
I kinda hate that feel such a strong desire to rub the face of deliberate ignorance into the concrete…

the lunatic “right” has been screaming about lawless governments and boots thru doors literally since Clinton was elected (it was like the flipping of a switch: everything from Free Republic to Guns’n’Ammo was on message all at once, and discussions IN THOSE ZONES gave way to apocalyptic fantasies and scream of revolution; sensible talk was shouted down and banned. Actual conservatives, BANNED on these now proto-MAGA breeding grounds. In short, sane conversation with ‘conservatives’ ended suddenly, 30 years ago.

”Are you OK with law enforcement with a boot through your door for doing exactly what others do but only you are getting raided with no criminal charges being filed first?”

What a stupid attempt to end an accusation with a question mark. Grow up. If you imagine that OO should have been charged BEFORE an authorized search was carried out, then your imagination should STFD/STFU.

Whoever told you that charges came before searches was lying to you. Even if THEY believed it, it’s the lie of another they were passing along. Obtaining evidence comes BEFORE charges; charges WITHOUT EVIDENCE would frankly be WORSE than what you imagine, so try to imagine how much you’d like it in a country where where AN ACCUSATION was enough to get your door kicked down - and YOU imprisoned - WITHOUT EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT IT?

I mean, that’s what you’re cawing about, right? That would be an out-and-out police state - which has been the signature move of Tyrants since the ancient Greeks. Exactly the kind of tyranny our constitution and laws are DESIGNED TO PREVENT. A valid search with a valid search warrant, carried out by proper authorities has been SOP in the non-JimCrow parts of the country for pretty much our entire existence as a nation.

It’s a tool to PREVENT tyrant, and it’s worked pretty well so far.

your last “question”: “Maybe they just take all your files and computers for 6 months and look them over for wrong doing” is every bit as stupid as the first:
- if you took something you knew you weren’t supposed to take,
- tried to hide it,
- refused to return it,
- refused to return it,
- had some of it taken from you by properly-authorized agents,
- denied you still had any,
- were ordered by a court to return what they knew hadn’t been returned,
- then subjected to a search for what THEY KNEW a was still missing,
- AND THEY FOUND IT while carrying out that search,
- AND THEY TAKE with them what they found,
- WHICH YOU KNEW YOU SHOULDN’T HAVE,
WHAT - *EXACTLY* - was taken THAT WAS YOURS?
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"Knew you weren't supposed to take"

Patently retarded. Read the full text of the suit I posted. There are many others where a the others took what you say they knew they weren't supposed to. It's a civil matter and it was upheld as such.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member

Trump Fears Indictment As 'Lock Her Up' Rallying Cry May Come Back To Haunt Him
27,803 views Aug 25, 2022 Chris Hayes: "There is a profound irony in Donald Trump's current legal predicament, which is of course that the intentional mishandling of classified documents—which Trump now stands accused of doing—is exactly what he said Hillary Clinton should be ‘locked up’ for back in 2016."
 
Dorian2

Dorian2

Well-Known Member
Herb & Suds said:
This is getting good
View attachment 5187302View attachment 5187303
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Going to tell a quick story because this reminded me. In Art 10 (grade 10 Art class), we were given a project along these exact lines. Of course following the tradition of those stickers that we used to get when we were kids. I came up with "Iran Wrap" and the byline was something to do with bodybags. This was completely politically correct at the time and got a good laugh from the class.

Perspective and time are powerful teachers.
 
cannabineer

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
Bagginski said:
… The Vatican set ‘Western Civilization’ in stone. After well over a thousand years, we’re only just now beginning to try to think - and live - outside the puzzle box. It’s as hard as it is to do because it wasn’t just “religion” or “worship” that was set in stone: the basis of European political systems (including ours), business, logic, diplomacy, philosophy, and science were all SET during that same period.
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I recently had the pleasure of reading Cantor’s Civilization of the Middle Ages. It contained an ecclesiastical history that was surprisingly touch-and-go well into the twelfth century. In fact one of his more engaging theses was that from the mid-eleventh on (and forgiving the notch cut by the Black Death) things have been on a general ascendant up to this day. I will need to reread; I grow interested in history fairly late in life. I am contemplating buying a set of Gibbon. Many wonderful, old, and imposingly physical books to be had for not much scratch. E-books do not smell right.

For the ones who are really trying to see deeply into the torrent of events, who really want to stop the acceleration of corruption in its tracks, and put guardrails in place to prevent such things in the future, it’s a huge temptation to give in to Panglossian best-of-all-possible-worlds *despair* that this is indeed things actually happening for the best, “so relax and enjoy it”, or to ‘hakuna matata’ ourselves into deep distraction, ‘having faith’ that things will work out on their own anyway
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I believe myself to be fairly unaffected by the panglossian premise — or its diametric opposite. I think the Epicureans struck a nice balance: enjoy life’s pleasures — within balance to life’s drudgeries.

THE BIGGEST RISK being taken by the Overthrow Party Is an increase in cognitive dissonance. Cognitive dissonance breaks illusion when the break between belief and experience collide…and typically most effective when it strikes personally. Given the revelations beginning to pour out about MAGA, it’s nefarious cast of charachters/bad actors, and the plots driving it all behind the scenes, we are beginning to see more and more people experience that break…but it won’t work on everyone. There will always be some who will burrow further into protective fantasyland, and double down - triple down, even - do virtually ANYTHING to avoid having to LOOK at what they’ve been part of, the things they’ve helped happen (it is *why* we have such massively effective (and successful) distraction industries (streaming video, video games (all sorts), film, music, drugs, alcohol, sex, QVC, gambling, conspiracy theorizing) devoted to impelling the sociopolitical passivity of the citizenry by ever-new distraction methods & fantasies of ‘enough money for THAT new house, new car, hot new “investment”, new look, new vacation, new spouse, new drug, new kink, new fashion, etc.
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I think we get to the real meat of the matter. I will work backward: you list a number of “addictive” behaviors, every one of which coopts our neurology of reward. Different personalities have different levels of effort needed to muster and implement the act of sustained will needed to get unaddicted.

Here I am grateful for having inherited some of my dad’s iron. (One day he said “I will stop smoking.” He did.) I have recently grabbed two escape-motivated spirals by the horns, and am contemplating a third with great ambivalence: cutting out carby foods. That’ll be harder because it uses a necessary drive.

The thing I am steering toward is that it is a very tentative hypothesis of mine that mastering such destructive drives (where necessary, with the support of Sundry Addicts Anonymous) makes it possible to tackle cognitive dissonance as well. I spoke of a Stockholm syndrome. This can be met with some combination of community/loved-ones support, and applying a level of opposed will that is formidable but generally not heroic. (It is of course necessary to leave enabling communities, be it your church, your drinking buddies or your fellow shoppers.)

Ultimately the only discipline is self-discipline. However, choosing one’s community prudently during the transition time helps a lot.

You put your finger directly on the beating artery I spoke of earlier. The churches value faith above reason, with some fascinating aberrations like the Jesuits. This promotes tolerating, then embracing cognitive dissonance, all the while the warm bath of congregational enablement gently soothes away rational reservations. Without making this another of my counterreligious jeremiads,
deprogramming cognitive dissonance can be, I now believe, positively engaged by a sufficiently self-motivated individual using the addiction-survivor toolset. Let’s say that my own research is ongoing.

However it’s been the historical rule that eventually, enough pressure will crack any nut…and a lot of the MAGA-Jesus-Hitler types have already had their nuts cracked & that’s how they ended up there.
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On a more cautionary note, old Egypt held out for almost three millennia. Rome had a few centuries of glory. We are at the quarter-millennium mark, and living in interesting times. The only thing of which I am certain is that the republic will emerge changed, if at all. I hope it is in a a direction of greater cognitive health, even as we lose the éminences grises of the greatest generation to that implacable taskmistress.
 
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Bagginski

Bagginski

Well-Known Member
Offmymeds said:
Right on cue. Blame, blame, blame, victim, victim, victim, unfair, unfair, unfair. Who the hell would want to represent this knowing he will blame everyone around him, not listen, lie, drive off clients, and ruin a reputation through malice?

I don't have the malignant narcissist playbook in front of me but isn't it getting close to burn it all down time?
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…time for Dorothy to hit him w/ a bucket of water
 
printer

printer

Well-Known Member
Trump receiving legal advice from conservative activist Tom Fitton: report
Former President Trump has been receiving legal advice related to his retention of presidential records from the head of Judicial Watch, a conservative legal activist group, CNN reported Friday.

Trump began taking calls from Tom Fitton, the president of the group, soon after the National Archives confirmed it obtained 15 boxes of records from Trump’s Mar-a-Lago property earlier this year.

The Archives reportedly asked the Justice Department (DOJ) to investigate after it received the boxes, some of which contained classified information.
Fitton told Trump that providing the boxes to the Archives was a mistake and the records belonged to Trump, three sources familiar with the matter told CNN.

Fitton said Trump should not provide any additional records if the Archives came back for more. He reportedly cited a 2012 case that Judicial Watch was involved in that he said gave Trump the authority to do what he wanted with records from his time in the White House.
One source told CNN that Trump requested Fitton brief his attorneys on the legal argument.

Trump has repeatedly maintained that he has fully cooperating with investigators seeking to reclaim the records. But Fitton increasingly began convincing him that he should have control over the records he possessed, according to CNN.

The Hill has reached out to representatives for Trump and Fitton for comment.

The report comes as an affidavit that the FBI used to establish probable cause that a crime was being committed is set to be publicly revealed Friday. A federal judge ruled that the DOJ must release a redacted version of the affidavit by noon.
The DOJ had argued that the affidavit’s full release could compromise its investigation.
thehill.com

Trump receiving legal advice from conservative activist Tom Fitton: report

Former President Trump has been receiving legal advice related to his retention of presidential records from the head of Judicial Watch, a conservative legal activist group, CNN reported Frida…
thehill.com thehill.com

Wait. He is not even a lawyer. Heck, Sidney could have given him that advice.
 
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