Examples of Democratic Party leadership

[DIY-HP-LED]

This is where it gets complicated. Why do people flock to authoritarian leaders? It's been contemplated ever since Athens was a world power. A lot of books and PhDs have been written that studied this subject since WW2. But also too, the US never has been completely free and so-called civil rights were not enshrined into law until 1967. That was a turning point for the white power movement and when Republican fascism started to develop. If one looks at what the SCOTUS has done recently, we are less free now than we were in the 1970's, Then again people of color are more optimistic about their future than white people are. So maybe what we are dealing with is a white power authoritarian counter revolution against democracy that is running its course.

We live in interesting times. Whatever the near future holds for us is still not known. Will Trump, his MAGA party and the Christofascist movement derail the US experiment with democracy? Or will demographic shift and the vision of a multicultural democracy become the norm? Whatever happens, the current situation is not stable and some things are going to have to be settled, whether its at the ballot box or on the street but probably both.

More in the ballot box and in the courts I should think. Donald already tried to rally the faithful to the courthouse steps to no avail and "only he can do it", just like on J6 where he peaked out and burned out too.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

Say what you will, Donald did destroy conservativism in American politics and almost eliminated mention of Jesus or religion, he looks like he will take down the GOP too before he is done. We need to wait until the end of the month to see, like cresting a hill after that we will be able to see a bit further into the future. It should be very bad for the GOP at all levels in 24, chaos reigns at all levels and the party is filled with cultists, nut cases and bigots, most of the conservatives walked out along with the decent people. Look at the scandals FFS the party is also filled with criminals, hypocrites and perverts, every week it is some republican official, or another ensnared in a sex scandal, corruption, abuse of power, or crime. Not to mention they have all the issues from gun control to women's rights, to democracy itself against them. It is just white grievance, bigotry, racism, craziness, disinformation, lies and fear keeping them alive!

 

[Fogdog]

Say what you will, Donald did destroy conservativism in American politics and almost eliminated mention of Jesus or religion, he looks like he will take down the GOP too before he is done. We need to wait until the end of the month to see, like cresting a hill after that we will be able to see a bit further into the future. It should be very bad for the GOP at all levels in 24, chaos reigns at all levels and the party is filled with cultists, nut cases and bigots, most of the conservatives walked out along with the decent people. Look at the scandals FFS the party is also filled with criminals, hypocrites and perverts, every week it is some republican official, or another ensnared in a sex scandal, corruption, abuse of power, or crime. Not to mention they have all the issues from gun control to women's rights, to democracy itself against them. It is just white grievance, bigotry, racism, craziness, disinformation, lies and fear keeping them alive!

More in the ballot box and in the courts I should think. Donald already tried to rally the faithful to the courthouse steps to no avail and "only he can do it", just like on J6 where he peaked out and burned out too.

I don't know if Donald changed the course and nature of conservatism in the US or if their change in status from majority to minority voter status is why they removed the flags that draped over their white robes or brown shirts. I'm of the opinion that they always had been anti-democratic or better put, for democracy with limits. They became more and more radicalized when they saw women, black, brown, asian, gay and trans people exercise the rights and gain status that white men took for granted as being their own. I never forget that the young men in this photo are the MAGA of today.



They have become the old guys. Proud Boys are standing in their place as their threat for mayhem. But they are every bit as dangerous and prone to violence as they ever were. What has changed is, they aren't a super majority and will soon become a plural group but not a majority on their own. Which is why they are working hard to cut back on voting rights and access to the polls. If Trump wins in the fall, they might just manage to pull it off. It's not certain who will win right now.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

I don't know if Donald changed the course and nature of conservatism in the US or if their change in status from majority to minority voter status is why they removed the flags that draped over their white robes or brown shirts. I'm of the opinion that they always had been anti-democratic or better put, for democracy with limits. They became more and more radicalized when they saw women, black, brown, asian, gay and trans people exercise the rights and gain status that white men took for granted as being their own. I never forget that the young men in this photo are the MAGA of today.

View attachment 5358285

They have become the old guys. Proud Boys are standing in their place as their threat for mayhem. But they are every bit as dangerous and prone to violence as they ever were. What has changed is, they aren't a super majority and will soon become a plural group but not a majority on their own. Which is why they are working hard to cut back on voting rights and access to the polls. If Trump wins in the fall, they might just manage to pull it off. It's not certain who will win right now.

I'll let Joe reply... Good speech.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

I don't know if Donald changed the course and nature of conservatism in the US or if their change in status from majority to minority voter status is why they removed the flags that draped over their white robes or brown shirts. I'm of the opinion that they always had been anti-democratic or better put, for democracy with limits. They became more and more radicalized when they saw women, black, brown, asian, gay and trans people exercise the rights and gain status that white men took for granted as being their own. I never forget that the young men in this photo are the MAGA of today.

View attachment 5358285

They have become the old guys. Proud Boys are standing in their place as their threat for mayhem. But they are every bit as dangerous and prone to violence as they ever were. What has changed is, they aren't a super majority and will soon become a plural group but not a majority on their own. Which is why they are working hard to cut back on voting rights and access to the polls. If Trump wins in the fall, they might just manage to pull it off. It's not certain who will win right now.

Evidence of technology causing change, a pretty disgusting photo eh? People back then thought so too when it was removed from the local context these assholes were operating in, they didn't see the camera with their narrowed focus caused by hate and fear. Cellphones are having an even greater effect and have done more for black people than laws in many cases. The viewer often gets the hate spewed at them if the video camera angle is right!

 

[Fogdog]

Evidence of technology causing change, a pretty disgusting photo eh? People back then thought so too when it was removed from the local context these assholes were operating in, they didn't see the camera with their narrowed focus caused by hate and fear. Cellphones are having an even greater effect and have done more for black people than laws in many cases. The viewer often gets the hate spewed at them if the video camera angle is right!

I don't think it caused change, they were there at a moment of change and the image captures the moment well. The US was very divided over this and the Democratic Party was as well. A lot of people at the time who looked at that image thought the people at the counter were scum, not the boys.

Same thing regarding BLM, Eric Chauvin and Rittenhouse.



How people view and think of that picture depends completely on the POV of the person. Who are heroes and who are villains in this image:




Who is the hero is controversial at the moment. It will be decided later depending on who writes the history.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

I don't think it caused change, they were there at a moment of change and the image captures the moment well. The US was very divided over this and the Democratic Party was as well. A lot of people at the time who looked at that image thought the people at the counter were scum, not the boys.

Same thing regarding BLM, Eric Chauvin and Rittenhouse.

View attachment 5358341

How people view and think of that picture depends completely on the POV of the person. Who are heroes and who are villains in this image:


View attachment 5358343

Who is the hero is controversial at the moment. It will be decided later depending on who writes the history.

There is an element of truth in what you say, but the cellphone video of George Floyd's murder did cause people to hit the streets even here in Canada. Such videos have put a lot of cops in jail and will probably cause new laws to be made one day, a lot of Karens made social media hits too.

 

[cannabineer]

… It will be decided later depending on who writes the history.

This.

(I hope small-r republicans do the writing.)

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

They want Donald though, I wonder why, any excuse will do, Biden is too old, but Trump is not much younger, in far worse shape and clearly insane as well as unfit. The last time the guy was in office he killed more Americans than Hitler through malicious incompetence in the midst of a deadly pandemic that killed more Americans than many poor countries lost FFS... He got rid of the pandemic early warning system just before the pandemic struck and advocated quack cures and drinking Clorox bleach on TV while hampering the response. Jesus Christ! It was a fucking fiasco and disaster until Joe took over.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1743266144885121136

 

[Fogdog]

There is an element of truth in what you say, but the cellphone video of George Floyd's murder did cause people to hit the streets even here in Canada. Such videos have put a lot of cops in jail and will probably cause new laws to be made one day, a lot of Karens made social media hits too.

Did it really change people's minds? More than a month after his murder, people were still posting this kind of bullshit on RIU.

Posted on Aug. 5, 2020

When told to show his hands, he repeatedly reached all over the vehicle. At this point the officer drew his weapon as he had every right to. Once they got him to the cruiser he would not get in. Officers were trying to push and pull him into the cruiser at the same time. Floyd then decided to jump over the back seat and out of the cruiser on the other side. This is when he was met with force. He was not complaint in any way throughout the entire ordeal.

Two members of this site liked that post. There were a string of remarks defending all aspects of that event from the viewpoint of white racist men. Change happens slowly. That photo presented the facts so clearly that it exhausted the people who were lying and claiming it was Floyd's fault. The truth needs to be told once but lies must be repeated over and over again. Eventually the lies stop having their intended effect. So, yes, the photo helped make changes but not right away.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1743375270931739102

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

Did it really change people's minds? More than a month after his murder, people were still posting this kind of bullshit on RIU.

Posted on Aug. 5, 2020



Two members of this site liked that post. There were a string of remarks defending all aspects of that event from the viewpoint of white racist men. Change happens slowly. That photo presented the facts so clearly that it exhausted the people who were lying and claiming it was Floyd's fault. The truth needs to be told once but lies must be repeated over and over again. Eventually the lies stop having their intended effect. So, yes, the photo helped make changes but not right away.

You can't reach everyone, and it takes time for the full social and even legal effects to be felt. Racists generally don't care, and they probably didn't play it on foxnews much. People with such strong biases are easily manipulated by propaganda or just don't care if Trump shoots someone on 5th Ave, much less a cop killing a black man. Racism turns people into suckers, Trump made that crystal clear, they are pathological in that they harm themselves and others (including their society and country) by believing and acting on bullshit. Their hatred is leading to their own political self-destruction as their numbers steadily diminish with demographic and generational change. I mean look at the GOP house or Trump for examples of the kind of people they vomit up and will continue to.

 

[Fogdog]

You can't reach everyone, and it takes time for the full social and even legal effects to be felt. Racists generally don't care, and they probably didn't play it on foxnews much. People with such strong biases are easily manipulated by propaganda or just don't care if Trump shoots someone on 5th Ave, much less a cop killing a black man. Racism turns people into suckers, Trump made that crystal clear, they are pathological in that they harm themselves and others (including their society and country) by believing and acting on bullshit. Their hatred is leading to their own political self-destruction as their numbers steadily diminish with demographic and generational change. I mean look at the GOP house or Trump for examples of the kind of people they vomit up and will continue to.

yep, that photo did not change people's minds. Not right away. The truth in that image is convincing people but it will take more time for others, some never. I'm glad that you can agree.

 

[Fogdog]

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1743375270931739102

Dark Brandon spits fire from his eyes.

 

[DIY-HP-LED]

Dark Brandon spits fire from his eyes.

The election has begun, and Joe is in fighting form, courts have ruled or will soon, and Trump is in legal Hell. Joe is hoping to run against him, in spite of the polls. His immunity claim should be thrown out and he should be on trial before Chutkan on schedule or by summer, he is also about to get cleaned out in NY and will be on trial there again over defamation and it is expected he will lose big. He also appears to be losing his mind and it will only get worse when reality starts bitch slapping him in the face.

 

[Grandpapy]

 

[Fogdog]

An unofficial rebuttal to Joe's speech today

 

[Grandpapy]

That's hard to watch.
Where would Fox be without trump, they must keep him relevant.

 

[CCGNZ]

This is where it gets complicated. Why do people flock to authoritarian leaders? It's been contemplated ever since Athens was a world power. A lot of books and PhDs have been written that studied this subject since WW2. But also too, the US never has been completely free and so-called civil rights were not enshrined into law until 1967. That was a turning point for the white power movement and when Republican fascism started to develop. If one looks at what the SCOTUS has done recently, we are less free now than we were in the 1970's, Then again people of color are more optimistic about their future than white people are. So maybe what we are dealing with is a white power authoritarian counter revolution against democracy that is running its course.

We live in interesting times. Whatever the near future holds for us is still not known. Will Trump, his MAGA party and the Christofascist movement derail the US experiment with democracy? Or will demographic shift and the vision of a multicultural democracy become the norm? Whatever happens, the current situation is not stable and some things are going to have to be settled, whether its at the ballot box or on the street but probably both.

Yup,I'm expecting 2024 to be the mother of all turbulence,either way someone is going to be fatalistic w/the result,I'd be WAAAY more comfy if a pop. vote held sway and these battle ground states better be flooded ad nauseum w/all the prior occupants indiscretions for undecided /independent voters,along w/comparisons of where we'd be were you know who were confronted w/the issues on Joe's plate currently.I hope under the COG (Continuity of Gov) plan there is a scenario that can deal w/massive civil unrest in the aftermath of a Trump defeat that MAGA forces are sure to unleash, without breathing life into more conspiracy BS. That said, I'm not even considering the aftermath of a victory for the dark side,I refuse to let my mind take that fork in the road.

 

[Bagginski]

I read it otherwise: the people in the echo chamber are not moderate Republicans, but (in his take) Democrats, who are “the left” only by comparison. I could be wrong.

Liberals in the GOP were rendered listed as extinct by the relentless agency (since Bonzo) of Unnatural Selection.

I don’t disagree on any point.

I do remember, circa 1988, that I was seeing a pattern in the extreme-right chatter (of the derivative talking-point variety). The through line was essentially ‘all democrats do is lie, they lie about everything: they hate god, they hate this country, they hate YOU…lucky for you, *WE* are onto them, we know what their lies really mean, so DONT LISTEN TO THEM - listen to US…WE will tell you what they’re doing & what they mean & we’ll explain it all to you…so you don’t get confused’.

Sound familiar? It worked outrageously, & it came from media, from family, from bosses, from preachers, from suppliers, from politicians. It really ramped up during the ‘90 campaigns, and went on the offensive when Gingrich took over the House.

it’s provided the gaping gullets required to flood the zone w/ bullshit, and it’s crystallized into what I’ve called the imaginary liberal: said creature is stupid, greedy, craven, evil…wildly clever, tho - they’re commie masterminds who control everything (while stupid & evil) despite GOP dominating the federal level for most of the last 40 years (it’s why “we need more MAGA in office”: only a takeover will oust the demonic Dems). Fortunately, big spenders on bibles, televangelism, & MAGA “collectibles” can rely on the imaginary liberal being SO afraid of conflict, confrontation, & firearms that they piss themselves & curl into weeping balls when faced w/ righteous playtriotism.

That mythical ‘composite’ “democrat” - criminal, race-traitor, pedophile, willing agent of destruction, incompetent master of the world - doesn’t exist. It was made up. It was made up on purpose: to energize & weaponize the beliefs, prejudices, & assumptions of post-Confederate Confederates. It’s been deliberately poured down as many gullets as could be found, over and over, for decades, “from every corner of the building”. When Trump arrived, they turned it all over to him & did EVERYTHING they could think of to pursue *their* overthrow agenda while hiding behind the big loud ape.

The entire PARTY is culpable in the overthrow effort: accessories & accomplices before, during, and after the entire effort to scare normal people into giving “conservatives” enough power & numbers to take the nation, their vote, their weapons, their citizenship CLEAN AWAY FROM THEM. And us, sure, but we’re not devoted to being told we’re *not seeing what we’re seeing; they aren’t talking TO us, ever…or their ‘base’, really.

ASIDE: it’s kinda like the way “Bible study” has changed since the Gold-Plated Age. It was all about understanding how to live a better life, be a better person by learning from the gospels; now, it’s devolved into brainwashing sessions: the reading now includes what it means in terms of political beliefs and imaginary policies (like “open borders”). Living a Christ-like life is no longer ‘operational’…and somehow, when asking/asked “what would Jesus do?”, they show a COMPLETE lack of knowledge about the Jesus of the gospels, the magic inerrant word of gawd.

No real surprise that the degeneration of Christianity & of ‘conservativism’ have gone hand-in-hand

WITHOUT it, Trump insanity & the MAGA frenzy could never have gained purchase & influence as it has, could not have overridden the *real* patriotism, otherwise-working brains, & actual humanity of so many otherwise perfectly decent, ordinary folks, could not have spent generations warping our government so it would bend to their purposes when “the leader” (Der Fuhrer”) arrived.

Gawd I really DO go on sometimes

To sum up: I actually agree with the bulk of his post, only his vector is off by 180; like many others trip into the Upside-Down…the result being, ‘all right-side-up people are wrong’.

He’ll probably stay as wrong until/unless he begins to do some real research - and some questioning of those he’s never actually questioned

Thank you for your patience