NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
Right up until he is crucified by the RomansWhos hating?
The Bible (the New Testament anyways) is all about love.
~PEACE~
I talked to God last week
- Thread starter bobharvey
- Start date
CrackerJax
New Member
The Bible (the New Testament anyways) is all about love
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There are few things worse than a moderate Christian....you can't pick and choose which part of the Bible is correct or not..it's all or nothing. Have the courage to believe totally. Otherwise you just come across as wishy washy...and by the perusal of your posts, you've got a good start down that road already.
out.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
There are few things worse than a moderate Christian....you can't pick and choose which part of the Bible is correct or not..it's all or nothing. Have the courage to believe totally. Otherwise you just come across as wishy washy...and by the perusal of your posts, you've got a good start down that road already.
out.
CrackerJax
New Member
The Bible is false so anything which grows from it is false....and history has proven that over and over again.
out.
out.
WoldofWeedcraft
Well-Known Member
Silly monkeys where there's one you're bound to divide.
Right in two...
Right in two...
CrackerJax
New Member
pamaris
Well-Known Member
As I have read through the past 7 pages or so... I wanted to add a few things.
First of all, I think it was Stoney who said that no Roman historians ever mentioned Jesus. This is not true. Josephus mentioned Jesus twice in The Antiquities of the Jews. However, the authenticity of the text is disputed- (of course). The fact is that many writers mentioned Jesus (hence we have gospel texts). It is the authenticity of the texts that are in question, since obviously the texts do exist. Since none of us were there, we simply have to look at the evidence and make a choice. It is almost laughable that we have SO MANY ancient texts that mention Jesus (dead sea scrolls etc) yet people say there' s no historical mention of him? OK.
Another misconception is that Jesus is based on Mithras or Horus... if one is truly interested in the truth, they should read both sides of the argument: http://www.christian-thinktank.com/copycat.html. Be warned- the writing style is very heavy, and tools of logic are employed, even though it is written by a weak, narrow-minded idiot (this is sarcasm- just chuckling at the allegation that ALL of Jesus' followers have no brain & won't think for themselves; the sarcasm is directed at no one; I just think I've heard that one somewhere before). Every atheist could and should read every link here: http://www.christian-thinktank.com/topix.html but they will still be an atheist if the wool doesn't come off. I'm not really one to go back and forth about these things though, just putting it out there.
The point is, the human race is at an impasse. 2 roads. Life. Death. Atheists say Christianity has been "debunked"; Christians point to the fact that the "debunkers" have been debunked. Round and round we go with all these semantics when there are people starving and dying and children being kidnapped for sex so we can keep the porn industry going strong and satisfy every evil individual curiosity we have as humans. (http://www.humantrafficking.org/updates/498) It is because of unfettered capitalism that children can be sold for sex. Supply and demand. I hope I have disgusted someone.
The point is- THIS IS GOING ON IN A BIG WAY AND IT IS A BIG DEAL- children are being destroyed because of the west's appetite for self gratification... what does this have to do with Jesus? Well if everyone did what Jesus said and loved their damn neighbors then we would all be free; we would all have enough to eat. Christians believe that humans are so broken that belief in Jesus is the only way we are capable of truly loving each other (humankind). American (and western) "Christians" do not have a clue what is going on; they are so brainwashed. All over the world, individuals from different cultures are waking up and having visions... God wants to save humanity from itself. God wants to save the planet. He wants us all to have enough to eat. I don't see why anyone would reject that?
The problem is that rich westerners are so addicted to image, money, beauty, wealth, power, etc that they choose to live in denial rather than address the atrocities that sin causes. We all know about Africa. The cause of their problems is not that they don't have enough money or enough to eat... they don't need more money... The problem is corruption- (sin). Africa has a vast, widespread culture of corruption, and people will continue to die by the millions until this changes. As a human race, we can continue to chase the glorification of the self- with fake tans, white teeth, empty eyes and fake boobs- hell they have fake people now (love dolls) or we can follow Jesus and become other-focused.
Here is how I see it... the rich of the world (the west) is so obsessed with themselves and trying to get money and look beautiful and thin that they are in denial about what is going on elsewhere in the world (and even under their own noses). This pertains to Jesus because if only we would follow his commands (love one another- more than you love yourself) then everyone would have enough to eat, and innocent children would not be bearing the brunt of our disgusting actions.
I know I come on strong and I also know I'm "crazy" but it's just that I feel desperation about the state of the world. I know that things can be different (starving children can be fed) but in order for this to happen, the entire system has to change (unfettered capitalism can be replaced with another system, but corruption is within the human heart and will continue in a different system). Anyway, we are looking forward to a time when everyone has enough to eat, the murders stop and the children are happy. That makes us completely bonkers according to most in the world, but I don't care; I just want everything to change so that the misery stops.
I look forward to a world in which there is no money, or the love of it (root of all evil you know). I think everyone who is awake wants the same thing (an end to the misery) but we come to different conclusions. Followers of Jesus know that even if money were abolished tomorrow, the love of it would still exist, so people would still be bought and sold. Love is the only way, not a new system. Non-believers think that if we just change the system, things will change. Believers look at the evidence of how disgusting human beings are (evidence= child pornography; evidence= war) and we realize there is no way we will be able to make it on our own. Change the system, but evil will still exist until Jesus comes back. Non-believers look at the evidence of what MAN has done to its own children and blame God for it. However, it is man who has done this to his own brother... goes all the way back to Cain & Abel. Man kills man; that is because man is evil. Man will continue to kill man until Jesus comes back.
The way to love Jesus is not to get "saved". People who are "saved" don't know what's going on. The way to love Jesus is to love the words he said. Those who love the words of Jesus try to DO them.
And when will all you people learn that the "church" and Bible camp and "Christian" music and every other cultural and societal religious trapping has absolutely nothing to do with Jesus!? We all have bad experiences with "church"... "church" is irrelevant. Just because organized religion is a fraud does not make Jesus one!
p.s. I don't use boards to debate- I just read all responses, and say my piece. I try to be respectful but I feel very, very passionately about... everything.
Love Love Love
I love Love.
First of all, I think it was Stoney who said that no Roman historians ever mentioned Jesus. This is not true. Josephus mentioned Jesus twice in The Antiquities of the Jews. However, the authenticity of the text is disputed- (of course). The fact is that many writers mentioned Jesus (hence we have gospel texts). It is the authenticity of the texts that are in question, since obviously the texts do exist. Since none of us were there, we simply have to look at the evidence and make a choice. It is almost laughable that we have SO MANY ancient texts that mention Jesus (dead sea scrolls etc) yet people say there' s no historical mention of him? OK.
Another misconception is that Jesus is based on Mithras or Horus... if one is truly interested in the truth, they should read both sides of the argument: http://www.christian-thinktank.com/copycat.html. Be warned- the writing style is very heavy, and tools of logic are employed, even though it is written by a weak, narrow-minded idiot (this is sarcasm- just chuckling at the allegation that ALL of Jesus' followers have no brain & won't think for themselves; the sarcasm is directed at no one; I just think I've heard that one somewhere before). Every atheist could and should read every link here: http://www.christian-thinktank.com/topix.html but they will still be an atheist if the wool doesn't come off. I'm not really one to go back and forth about these things though, just putting it out there.
The point is, the human race is at an impasse. 2 roads. Life. Death. Atheists say Christianity has been "debunked"; Christians point to the fact that the "debunkers" have been debunked. Round and round we go with all these semantics when there are people starving and dying and children being kidnapped for sex so we can keep the porn industry going strong and satisfy every evil individual curiosity we have as humans. (http://www.humantrafficking.org/updates/498) It is because of unfettered capitalism that children can be sold for sex. Supply and demand. I hope I have disgusted someone.
The point is- THIS IS GOING ON IN A BIG WAY AND IT IS A BIG DEAL- children are being destroyed because of the west's appetite for self gratification... what does this have to do with Jesus? Well if everyone did what Jesus said and loved their damn neighbors then we would all be free; we would all have enough to eat. Christians believe that humans are so broken that belief in Jesus is the only way we are capable of truly loving each other (humankind). American (and western) "Christians" do not have a clue what is going on; they are so brainwashed. All over the world, individuals from different cultures are waking up and having visions... God wants to save humanity from itself. God wants to save the planet. He wants us all to have enough to eat. I don't see why anyone would reject that?
The problem is that rich westerners are so addicted to image, money, beauty, wealth, power, etc that they choose to live in denial rather than address the atrocities that sin causes. We all know about Africa. The cause of their problems is not that they don't have enough money or enough to eat... they don't need more money... The problem is corruption- (sin). Africa has a vast, widespread culture of corruption, and people will continue to die by the millions until this changes. As a human race, we can continue to chase the glorification of the self- with fake tans, white teeth, empty eyes and fake boobs- hell they have fake people now (love dolls) or we can follow Jesus and become other-focused.
Here is how I see it... the rich of the world (the west) is so obsessed with themselves and trying to get money and look beautiful and thin that they are in denial about what is going on elsewhere in the world (and even under their own noses). This pertains to Jesus because if only we would follow his commands (love one another- more than you love yourself) then everyone would have enough to eat, and innocent children would not be bearing the brunt of our disgusting actions.
I know I come on strong and I also know I'm "crazy" but it's just that I feel desperation about the state of the world. I know that things can be different (starving children can be fed) but in order for this to happen, the entire system has to change (unfettered capitalism can be replaced with another system, but corruption is within the human heart and will continue in a different system). Anyway, we are looking forward to a time when everyone has enough to eat, the murders stop and the children are happy. That makes us completely bonkers according to most in the world, but I don't care; I just want everything to change so that the misery stops.
I look forward to a world in which there is no money, or the love of it (root of all evil you know). I think everyone who is awake wants the same thing (an end to the misery) but we come to different conclusions. Followers of Jesus know that even if money were abolished tomorrow, the love of it would still exist, so people would still be bought and sold. Love is the only way, not a new system. Non-believers think that if we just change the system, things will change. Believers look at the evidence of how disgusting human beings are (evidence= child pornography; evidence= war) and we realize there is no way we will be able to make it on our own. Change the system, but evil will still exist until Jesus comes back. Non-believers look at the evidence of what MAN has done to its own children and blame God for it. However, it is man who has done this to his own brother... goes all the way back to Cain & Abel. Man kills man; that is because man is evil. Man will continue to kill man until Jesus comes back.
The way to love Jesus is not to get "saved". People who are "saved" don't know what's going on. The way to love Jesus is to love the words he said. Those who love the words of Jesus try to DO them.
And when will all you people learn that the "church" and Bible camp and "Christian" music and every other cultural and societal religious trapping has absolutely nothing to do with Jesus!? We all have bad experiences with "church"... "church" is irrelevant. Just because organized religion is a fraud does not make Jesus one!
p.s. I don't use boards to debate- I just read all responses, and say my piece. I try to be respectful but I feel very, very passionately about... everything.
Love Love Love
I love Love.
CrackerJax
New Member
You are not crazy, just easily fooled. Fooled by centuries of text manipulation.
Here's a very simple posit for you. very simple. jerusalem was a center point of that region and there were tons of scribes (historians) in that area. Rome was very insistent on paperwork. Combine these two very simple things together and not much escaped the texts.
Now look at the CLAIMS of the bible about Jesus. Miracle here, miracle there, multitudes here, multitudes there.
Except for the Bible (written by whom???? Mark...Mark who? Luke...Luke who? etc...), no mention of him....anywhere.
There should be literally reams written about him...and yet...nothing.
The ONLY link to the Gospels is through Paul....and Paul NEVER heard of jesus.
MYTH.
out.
Here's a very simple posit for you. very simple. jerusalem was a center point of that region and there were tons of scribes (historians) in that area. Rome was very insistent on paperwork. Combine these two very simple things together and not much escaped the texts.
Now look at the CLAIMS of the bible about Jesus. Miracle here, miracle there, multitudes here, multitudes there.
Except for the Bible (written by whom???? Mark...Mark who? Luke...Luke who? etc...), no mention of him....anywhere.
There should be literally reams written about him...and yet...nothing.
The ONLY link to the Gospels is through Paul....and Paul NEVER heard of jesus.
MYTH.
out.
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
I had to learn all about the history of the church (not to mistaken with Jesus) while I attended a catholic High School. Constantine invented the Roman Catholic Church and wrote the Bible during the Council of Nicaea.
As far as historical evidence of Jesus, there is none.
Even with historical documents stacked against them Christian historians still make attempts to prove Jesus as written in a book composed by a Roman emperor who never even converted himself.
The Bible has been re-written throughout history by powerful men to suit their political goals.
I believe that it is very likely that Jesus did exist but his message was one of Agnostic "faith". A very buddhist message that has since been translated into a poly-theistic belief to better appeal to the Pagan masses.
Three Main Gods:
1. Jesus
2. Holy Spirit
3. The "Father"
No to mention the idols that are worshiped, such as the Virgin Mary.
Of course Catholic's would call this blasphemy, luckily the inquisition (killed more people than the holocaust BTW) no longer exists.
As far as historical evidence of Jesus, there is none.
Even with historical documents stacked against them Christian historians still make attempts to prove Jesus as written in a book composed by a Roman emperor who never even converted himself.
The Bible has been re-written throughout history by powerful men to suit their political goals.
I believe that it is very likely that Jesus did exist but his message was one of Agnostic "faith". A very buddhist message that has since been translated into a poly-theistic belief to better appeal to the Pagan masses.
Three Main Gods:
1. Jesus
2. Holy Spirit
3. The "Father"
No to mention the idols that are worshiped, such as the Virgin Mary.
Of course Catholic's would call this blasphemy, luckily the inquisition (killed more people than the holocaust BTW) no longer exists.
NewGrowth
Well-Known Member
a wonderful example of this polytheistic faith.God( he is referring to the "father")
speaking through the Son (Jesus)
bravo sir!
CrackerJax
New Member
Ding we have a winner... NG gets a Cupie doll.
I hate to pile on........but know this bit thumper.....Jesus(myth) was a mythical JEW....Paul was a Jew. they were all Jews. It was never intended for gentiles....but for the Jews....not you. If you read carefully you can see that they never intended for people outside of their tribes (which is what that area was made up of), which makes PERFECT sense. It got hijacked in Rome ala Constantine as NG (with the Cupie doll) has just pointed out....quite correctly I might add.
out.
I hate to pile on....
....but know this bit thumper.....Jesus(myth) was a mythical JEW....Paul was a Jew. they were all Jews. It was never intended for gentiles....but for the Jews....not you. If you read carefully you can see that they never intended for people outside of their tribes (which is what that area was made up of), which makes PERFECT sense. It got hijacked in Rome ala Constantine as NG (with the Cupie doll) has just pointed out....quite correctly I might add.out.
CrackerJax
New Member
out.
Stoney McFried
Well-Known Member
Josephus lived AFTER Jesus, number one.Number two, many of his writings were edited by Christians or faked.Period.Any "historical" mention of him is made AFTER he supposedly died, there is no CONTEMPORARY of him that has been proved not to be faked.
AS for children being used for sex, people starving,etc, well, if the Catholic church was so worried about that, they'd put their child molesting priests to death, and give ALL of their vast monies towards helping those in need.But they don't.Because they are evil and corrupt.
Now, I don't think you can't believe what you want, but don't try to tell people it's the truth when it simply ISN'T.Jesus is NOT a historical figure.He is a character in the Bible, which is a work of fiction.
It is not a misconception that Christianity has borrowed from other religions...look at the catholic altar...the chalice,for water, is also used in paganism to represent that element.The paten, to make an offer of bread...it's counterpart in paganism is usually a bowl of salt, also representing earth.Candles, of course, for fire...incense for air...an altar cloth.....and each piece is exactly placed in a position which corresponds with the element it's meant to represent.North, earth, south, fire,east air, west, water.This is just the altar! Satan himself is a rip off of the goat god Pan. Mary?The mother?Brigid.And, Brigid was a "trinity"...maiden, mother, crone....trinity,huh?Sounds familiar...father, son, holy ghost? God himself is a ripoff of the Daghda,known as the good god, the all father.Oh...and Brigid had the cross associated with her, too.So, these are just a few examples...but there are MANY more.Believe in Jesus if you want to.Just realize where you get him from.
AS for children being used for sex, people starving,etc, well, if the Catholic church was so worried about that, they'd put their child molesting priests to death, and give ALL of their vast monies towards helping those in need.But they don't.Because they are evil and corrupt.
Now, I don't think you can't believe what you want, but don't try to tell people it's the truth when it simply ISN'T.Jesus is NOT a historical figure.He is a character in the Bible, which is a work of fiction.
It is not a misconception that Christianity has borrowed from other religions...look at the catholic altar...the chalice,for water, is also used in paganism to represent that element.The paten, to make an offer of bread...it's counterpart in paganism is usually a bowl of salt, also representing earth.Candles, of course, for fire...incense for air...an altar cloth.....and each piece is exactly placed in a position which corresponds with the element it's meant to represent.North, earth, south, fire,east air, west, water.This is just the altar! Satan himself is a rip off of the goat god Pan. Mary?The mother?Brigid.And, Brigid was a "trinity"...maiden, mother, crone....trinity,huh?Sounds familiar...father, son, holy ghost? God himself is a ripoff of the Daghda,known as the good god, the all father.Oh...and Brigid had the cross associated with her, too.So, these are just a few examples...but there are MANY more.Believe in Jesus if you want to.Just realize where you get him from.
Stoney McFried
Well-Known Member
Even as you are full of it.