First Grow: 400 watt HPS, Permafrost, White Widow, White Rhino, Blackjack

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

SPIDER MITES!!!!

I donated my extra clones to a local medical marijuana club today. The first thing they said when I put them on the table is "You've got a bad spider mite problem". They recommended that I use Zero Tolerance, anyone ever heard of it or used it? I just used a 50% solution on my seedlings and clone and went 100% on my big girls, hopefully it won't burn the leaves. With all of the pics I've posted I'm kinda surprised that no one from RIU has pointed out my spider mite problem. I'll let you know how the plants react.

OUCH! Spider mites are not uncommon. My buddy has them (his plants LOL). Avid was the recommended treatment. Spider mite become pesticide resistant so they have to keep coming out with new stuff. They probably gave you the latest formula at a place like that so... good luck with it!
I dont think we could have seen a mite problem in your pics sorry.

 

[jrp677]

I've done a lot of reading on spider mite solutions and I'm considering going to my local grow shop to pick up some preditor mites. Anyone ever used them and if so did they do the trick?

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

Is there a problem with the Zero tolerance? Not working?

 

[jrp677]

Is there a problem with the Zero tolerance? Not working?

Hard to say if it's working or not but I'm a little wary about spraying solution on plants that I'll be smoking in about a month regardless if it comes from an organic source. From what I've read the sprays work well but never totally eliminate the problem whereas the preditor mites eat all of the spider mites and then eat each other. The problem is that it would take me hours to entirely cover every nook and cranny on those plants with a pretty good chance that I missed some places. I guess I'm a little lazy but I really prefer the idea of nuking the hell out of those bastards with preditor mites and just let the bugs do all the work. If the preditor mites don't work then I can always resort back to the ZT and I'll continue to use ZT on the clones since it's not hard to drench those in solution. It sounds like I've made up my mind but please let me know if something else has worked to rid your ladies of spider mites.

 

[OB Cron Kenobi]

I myself have never experienced the little devils- but as a preventative I always put about 2 inches of sandbox soil (can be purchased at any self-respecting hardware store). This will do 3 things; 1st it will keep them from making a habitat (they live in dirt, sand is too dry and difficult) 2nd disperse your water on its way to the roots and give you an easy way to measure whether it needs feeding (when the soil is sandy- its dry, when moist- its still holding moisture, and 3rd and this is a stretch- but it is more reflective (sandbox sand is white and may bounce back lumens to the underleaves and buds). For what its worth.

I've never had it, so perhaps it worked. But I just switched to hydro- so hopefully they don't pop up.

I've also heard of neem oil (also sold at hardware stores) mixed as a foliar spray and utilized.

They are very common! Don't feel bad. They can easily be dragged in from outdoors. Never mow the lawn, garden your outdoors, or spend excessive outdoor time before entering the garden without a shower and change of clothes.

Otherwise your ladies look fine. A very professional looking cab I might add.

Your plug got me ; )
Scribed!
OB Cron

PS: Thanks for the PM and compliment, someday I will produce my own strains; OB Cron Kenobi, Luke Skytoker Haze, Yoda's Saber, Darth Blazer, Doja the Hut, and Bowla fet.

 

[jrp677]

I myself have never experienced the little devils- but as a preventative I always put about 2 inches of sandbox soil (can be purchased at any self-respecting hardware store). This will do 3 things; 1st it will keep them from making a habitat (they live in dirt, sand is too dry and difficult) 2nd disperse your water on its way to the roots and give you an easy way to measure whether it needs feeding (when the soil is sandy- its dry, when moist- its still holding moisture, and 3rd and this is a stretch- but it is more reflective (sandbox sand is white and may bounce back lumens to the underleaves and buds). For what its worth.

I've never had it, so perhaps it worked. But I just switched to hydro- so hopefully they don't pop up.

I've also heard of neem oil (also sold at hardware stores) mixed as a foliar spray and utilized.

They are very common! Don't feel bad. They can easily be dragged in from outdoors. Never mow the lawn, garden your outdoors, or spend excessive outdoor time before entering the garden without a shower and change of clothes.

Otherwise your ladies look fine. A very professional looking cab I might add.

Your plug got me ; )
Scribed!
OB Cron

PS: Thanks for the PM and compliment, someday I will produce my own strains; OB Cron Kenobi, Luke Skytoker Haze, Yoda's Saber, Darth Blazer, Doja the Hut, and Bowla fet.

OB Cron: Thanks for the advice, it definitely wouldn't hurt to try adding sand to the pot. Those strain names are hilarious. I'll be the first one in line to pick up a few cuttings, "Attack of the Clones"!

 

[jrp677]

I've done some more reading on spider mites and came across an execellent source. Mad Props go out to TRIX who originally posted the info below.

Soooo did some research, much of which may already be posted here somewhere but either way, will post it all. Basically though, spider mites are transferred in, through, clothes, wind, dirt etc... ready for a read??
ps this is RESEARCH...my own personal experience is not over yet...

Mites by themselves are not aggressive movers. They pretty much stay on the same leaf or nearby leaves for their entire lives. They are moved (vectored) by bird feathers, dog and animal hair, and clothing. They are usually worst in dry dusty conditions, although two spotted mites have been known to thrive even under very wet conditions.

Spidermites thrive in dry (20%-30% humidity), warm(70-80 degrees F) conditions. In temperatures above 80 degrees F, spidermites can reproduce in as little as 5 days, making early detection a necessity.

The most important step you can take to avoid pests is to keep your growroom clean, free of odours, free of bacteria and free of rubbish.
• Keep your environmental conditions as close to perfect as you can, maintaining variables such as temperature, humidity and air quality. Make sure that you have got good air exchange, and keep the air moving.
• After visiting a risk area and before entering your growroom, change clothes to reduce the chance of cross contamination.
• Try not to draw air into your growroom directly from outside if possible. If you do then filter the air, especially in summer.
• Do not let other gardeners or people who may have come from infected areas into your growroom.
• Quarantine any cuttings that have come from other growrooms for a few days (or until you are sure they are free of mites) before introducing them into your growroom.
• Keep pets out of and away from your growroom.
• Stick to quality growing media rather than compost and other bagged media from garden centers. Dedicated hydroponic media is much less likely to contain bugs than standard soil.

Mites usually start becoming a problem in late spring and reach a peak by late summer or just at the peak heat of the season. They are definitely hot weather critters. In cold weather they move and multiply much more slowly. In summer their life cycle is about seven to ten days, that is, hatchlings are laying eggs after a week or two. Any treatment must take this into account. Just killing the adults does little good. Repeat treatments are almost always necessary to kill the emerging mites. In winter they begin moving off trees and shrubs to winter over on grasses.

Mites, like aphids are easily dislodged from the leaf surface, at least before they have a chance to begin building webbing. A weekly hard blast of water can stop an infestation from occuring or slow it down once it starts. However, you must be able to spray the undersides of the leaves. Just hitting the top surface will do little or nothing. Concentrate your attention on the lower parts of the plant. Mites won't be found on the upper and succulent parts of the plant.

If you find more than an occasional mite, and most of the lower leaves have two or more mites and perhaps webbing, you are probably in trouble. Begin lower levels of control. First try blasting them off with a spray of water. Do this about every two or three days. It may or may not work. If the population continues to build, use an insecticidal soap designed for mites (it should be on the label), or introduce predators.

Once mite count reaches about 40 per leaf, the population will really explode and mites will begin moving to other leaves and plants. In the worst cases, they will even begin moving to other species that are usually resistant. Treatment with predator mites at this stage is possible, but difficult and expensive. At this stage you may want to take a more toxic route.

Red spider mites are pretty easily dealt with. You can usually knock them out with water sprays. The big problem is that there are few effective ovicides for mites, so you must follow up in five to seven days with a repeat treatment to kill the hatchlings. Usually three treatments are necessary to end an infestation. Read and follow all label instructions carefully. Do not use more or less than the recommended amount or concentration. Using less can result in breeding mites with resistance to that chemical.

If you have two spotted mites, your job is even harder. These mites are very difficult to control and most are resistant to most miticides. Don't bother using typical over the counter insecticides, they will do nothing. These mites can build a resistance to pesticides very quickly, so repeated use of the same one just breeds new problems for the rest of us. These two spotted mites can still be killed it just takes a more serious approach.

Critics have said that while predators may work in a nursery situation, it won't in a small yard as long as your neighbors are engaging in chemical warfare. I think it is worth a try as long as you have a yard that will provide a complete environment, which usually means some exposed soil, trees and shrubs. In fact predator mites are more useful to small scale operations, than to larger ones such as mine. They can be used to treat individual plants, but long term control means changing the environment, including establishing a population of predators.

You must choose the right predator mite for your situation. There are several species available that are adapted to a particular climate. They have a rather narrow range of humidity and temperature requirements. Predator mites are available from several bio control companies

Predator mites can be expensive. At times, somewhere in the neighborhood of $500 a gram, or $50 to $80 per thousand mites.
Effective treatment is dependent on getting the proper predator mite. Green Methods lists about six, Nature's Control lists three. The most important parameters are temperature and humidity, but there are also other factors such as fast knockdown, early introduction, longevity, etc.
If you have ONE infested plant, I'd say forget it, the mites would cost as much as the plant, but if you have a good size collection and mites are a general problem, including your landscape, it might be a feasible method of control.
Additionally, yes the mites do stick around because bio controls do NOT eliminate the pest but simply set up a dynamic between the two species which keeps the pest from getting out of hand. If you want total control (read elimination) you must use chemicals.

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

Thats really good info. The key being "If you want total control (read elimination) you must use chemicals."
I'm a sand user too. I have it on most of my house plants and all of my special plants. Totally prevents bugs from nesting in the soil which most bugs want to do.

 

[jrp677]

Thats really good info. The key being "If you want total control (read elimination) you must use chemicals."
I'm a sand user too. I have it on most of my house plants and all of my special plants. Totally prevents bugs from nesting in the soil which most bugs want to do.

So just put a couple of inches of sand on top of the soil, simple as that?

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

A couple inches is too much (if there is such a thing). I probably have around 1/2 inch or less. I make sure its deepest around the edge of the pot and around the base of the stalk. I cant speak to the effectiveness of it against mites but it keeps most other bugs out. It makes watering a little tricky because the dirt wants to float up on top of the sand but you'll figure it out. I dig a hole in the sand, pour in the water then recover the hole. I HAD fungas gnats or some little annoying flying buggers like that. They came in with a plant I bought at home depot. They almost got out of control. Till I smothered their asses with the sand.
I did all but one plant. All the bugs then moved into that plant. pretty much... After about a week I covered that one too. That was the end of em.
Make sure you get cleaned sand from a garden center etc. so it does not fudge with your PH or contain contaminates. They have "decorative sand" for plants at home depot etc..

 

[jrp677]

Yesterday I bought a magnifying glass and took a close look at the clones I sprayed with Zero Tolerance. The WR and BJ showed no signs of infestation, the PF did however.... but they were all dead! So this morning I drenched all of my flowering plants from head to toe, over and under the leaves with the hope that I'll have the same results. Worst case it will kill off enough of the population to get the problem semi under control. To Be Continued.......

 

[jrp677]

DAY 28 OF FLOWERING

I think the spider mites are at bay for the moment. I did some undergrowth removal yesterday with the main focus being to remove all of the leaves that looked to be the most infested. The PF plants look healthier but everyday more leaves on the WW seem to be dying. The buds on the WW are still growing but I fear she may not make it to harvest. Can a flowering plant finish if the leaves are dying? The sprouts have made good progress over the last week but are still small for their age and have developed spotty discoloration on some of their leaves, any idea of what is causing it? If I followed my master plan I would be taking cuttings from my sprouts this week but as you can see they are not quite big enough yet. The sprouts are ready to be transplanted into the bigger pots which I’ll probably do this week. After I take cuttings from the sprouts my plan was to then move plants into the flowering room but I’m very hesitant to do that now. I really want to wait until the infested plants currently in the flower room finish before moving the new plants in. I don’t want to be fighting with spider mites the next go around but I’m also concerned that my current sprouts will be huge if I wait until after harvest to put them in the flower room. I need advice…

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

["Can a flowering plant finish if the leaves are dying?"]
Yes. It happend to me. I had a PH issue and all my fan leaves fell off before i got it straightened out. It went the last 4 weeks of flower without ANY fan leaves and it kept budding just fine. Obviously it would have been better, but it wasn't the end of the world (or the plant either lol)
["I really want to wait until the infested plants currently in the flower room finish before moving the new plants in."]
I hear that! An excellent idea. I would not introduce anything else untill the mites are gone.
["but I’m also concerned that my current sprouts will be huge if I wait until after harvest to put them in the flower room."]
Top them. This will reduce there size, increase yeild, and give you more clonable branches. Here is a really good thread for topping and general growing knowledge > https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/151706-uncle-bens-topping-technique-get.html
I'm not sure about your "spots". Could be some water (or something) splashed on them, or bug damage. PH fluctuation can make random spots appear too, but i dont think thats the case here. Just some ideas...

 

[jrp677]

["Can a flowering plant finish if the leaves are dying?"]
Yes. It happend to me. I had a PH issue and all my fan leaves fell off before i got it straightened out. It went the last 4 weeks of flower without ANY fan leaves and it kept budding just fine. Obviously it would have been better, but it wasn't the end of the world (or the plant either lol)
["I really want to wait until the infested plants currently in the flower room finish before moving the new plants in."]
I hear that! An excellent idea. I would not introduce anything else untill the mites are gone.
["but I’m also concerned that my current sprouts will be huge if I wait until after harvest to put them in the flower room."]
Top them. This will reduce there size, increase yeild, and give you more clonable branches. Here is a really good thread for topping and general growing knowledge > https://www.rollitup.org/advanced-marijuana-cultivation/151706-uncle-bens-topping-technique-get.html
I'm not sure about your "spots". Could be some water (or something) splashed on them, or bug damage. PH fluctuation can make random spots appear too, but i dont think thats the case here. Just some ideas...

Thanks IGLAW, I can always count on you for good advice. I considered topping but with the limited amount of space in the flower room I want to avoid the plants getting too bushy, however it looks like topping is my best option considering my circumstances. +Rep and thanks again.

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

I try. I'm glad if I helped. You are more than welcome.

 

[jrp677]

I like to see progressive pics in other people's grow journals so I thought I would do the same. The pics start from day 7 of flowering to present day. The first two sets are the Permafrost and the third set is the WW. Enjoy the trip down memory lane.

 

[jrp677]

Well, the little 6 inch tall sprouts have managed to stink up the entire bathroom so I decided that it was time they got moved out into the cabinet. I made a couple of adjustments to the cabinet. First I cut a section of tarp and velcroed it to area of the flower chamber that was exposed when the right door was opened. This will allow me to tend to the sprouts without concern of light leakage into the flower room. I also added a couple of circulation fans to the veg chambers. The conditions in the cabinet aren't as ideal as the bathroom so I'm anxious to see how the sprouts adjust to the temp change. I'm sure they'll be fine. The tips of the leaves on 1 of the flowering PF are browning. From what I've read, nutrient deficiency causes that problem? I've given them just plain water the last 2 times I've watered so I'm guessing that is the problem but I don't know for sure. I'll take pics when I feed them tomorrow. OUT!

 

[jrp677]

So now both of my PF plants are having the same problem, the tips and edges of the leaves are turning a dark brown, almost like they are burning. Is this a nutrient problem or could it be that I have the light too close to the plants. As I stated before, I have been giving the plants plain water the last two times I watered. The bulb is about 8 inches from the tops. What do you guys think the problem is?

 

[itsgrowinglikeaweed]

Looks like a Phosphorus Def. to me.
This is a phosphorus def.>

These are the best plant problem photos around > http://www.ganjaguerrilla.net/index.htm
MJ plants use a lot of P and K in flower. But before you go adding anything(fertilizers) to fix this you must make sure your PH is ok. Phosphorus gets locked out at PH under 6 and over 7 in soil. Nutrient availability.

 

[jrp677]

Looks like a Phosphorus Def. to me.
This is a phosphorus def.>

These are the best plant problem photos around > http://www.ganjaguerrilla.net/index.htm
MJ plants use a lot of P and K in flower. But before you go adding anything(fertilizers) to fix this you must make sure your PH is ok. Phosphorus gets locked out at PH under 6 and over 7 in soil. Nutrient availability.

Awesome! I've been searching for a website like that. Thanks a lot IGLAW! When you say to make sure my PH is OK do you mean the water going into the soil or the PH of the run-off? The PH of the water plain is just above 7 and around 6.5 after I add the nutes. I've never checked the run-off. This damn website cut me off from giving you +rep until I spread the love, otherwise I'd send another one your way. Thanks again.