Uncle Ben's Topping Technique to Get 2 or 4 Main Colas

[Uncle Ben]

Hey I have been reading this thread and I am really interested in trying this. I don't know if you already answered this, but is yield increased a lot by having 4 main colas, or 2, or do you just get 4 colas that produce the same amount of bud as a really large single cola?

I think it is, or I wouldn't do it.

It would really be cool to be able to sow the seeds and with relative confidence know your limited space would be filled with girls....and then I would be able to top for 4 colas starting from seed every cycle.....

Any help would be appreciated....Your opinion is highly regarded by us all....

12bonsai....

It's been said that if you have a plant with just a few male flowers that all the plants will turn out female. That can also be a stress flag after flowering a plant for a long time. They usually produce a few "bananas" or incomplete male flower parts. It's nature's way of giving it up. I'd just buy feminized seeds or deal with it.

Tio

 

[DannyGreenEyes]

Dear Uncle Ben,

I just started my first grow. 7 of my plants will be 2 weeks old tommorow (from clones) and I'd like to use the 4 cola technique if it's possible, especially since I'll probably have to put them in flower in about 3 weeks or so.

I read the first 6 pages then went to check my plants for "true nodes" and I noticed that these plants don't have many true nodes, at least I don't think. The plant with the most true nodes as I understand them is about 5.5" tall and only has 2 true nodes.

When I checked my plants I saw some weird stuff, like one plant somehow grew a branch beneath the dirt level and that branch is now sticking out of the ground right next to the plant.

Another weird thing that I saw were nodes with 2 branches coming from the same spot both heading in the same general direction (see pic). Is this considered a true node, or do the branches have to be opposite one another?

Also, is there any way to help your plants grow true nodes faster? (any way to promote true node formation)

One more, if the branches are opposite one another but not exactly level (a fraction of a cm off), is that still a true node?

BTW, great thread. +rep even though you don't really need it.

 

[Dr.RR]

If you don't mind Uncle Ben, I would like to show my results of topping my babies. They have been topped for almost a month. I want to thank you for writing such an informative post and helping out so many people with your expertise!

 

[doitinthewoods]

I did this to my red dragon mother, and somehow I ended up with 5 main tops, haha. It works. True story

 

[Uncle Ben]

When I checked my plants I saw some weird stuff, like one plant somehow grew a branch beneath the dirt level and that branch is now sticking out of the ground right next to the plant.

I'd say you have a challenge there, hah! Nodes are the points where the leaf petiole attaches. They are either opposing or alternating. There are dormant buds in the axis. That's what you have to work with.

Good luck,
UB

 

[Uncle Ben]

If you don't mind Uncle Ben, I would like to show my results of topping my babies. They have been topped for almost a month. I want to thank you for writing such an informative post and helping out so many people with your expertise!

They look great, especially the last shot.

Keep 'em green.......

 

[southern homegrower]

Uncle Ben. how was your thanksgiving? wanted to say thanks for the advice on the books you told me to get. i am understanding these plants much better now. wish i would have got them a long time ago. keep them green and clean

 

[cappeeler09]

thanks for yur thread on topping uncle

i couldnt wait to try it

its cheese

have i done this right?

JUST BEEN TOPPED

4 DAYS AFTER I TOPPED

11 DAYS AFTER I TOPPED IT

 

[Snak]

thanks for yur thread on topping uncle

i couldnt wait to try it

its cheese

have i done this right?

It looks like that plant was grown from a clone, with alternating nodes... If you read the thread you'll see there is some discussion about how the results will be much less predictable when you top a plant with alternating nodes.

 

[cappeeler09]

yer it was from a clone

when i topped it i expected the bit i cut (topped) would of formed 2 shoots coming off it so ther would of been 2 heads

but its just stopped growing wer i cut it and its just going bushy and opened up

is that what its meant to do

its my 1st time so i dont know m8

 

[DannyGreenEyes]

I'd say you have a challenge there, hah! Nodes are the points where the leaf petiole attaches. They are either opposing or alternating. There are dormant buds in the axis. That's what you have to work with.

Good luck,
UB

So then a "site" with 2 branches growing from the same point and heading in the same direction (instead of being on the other side of the plant) isn't considered a true node?

I noticed something else this morning, that same plant has a low branch which itself has several branches growing from it. There's a chance that this plant has been topped before but I'm not sure. Is there any way a branch can grow from a branch or is this a 2nd main stem? (or do I just have some sort of genetic freak on my hands?)

Also, the plants with 2 true nodes have a decent ammount of plant material. Is clipping 5 true nodes important or is it only important to cut above the 2nd true node?

 

[plaguedog]

So then a "site" with 2 branches growing from the same point and heading in the same direction (instead of being on the other side of the plant) isn't considered a true node?

I noticed something else this morning, that same plant has a low branch which itself has several branches growing from it. There's a chance that this plant has been topped before but I'm not sure. Is there any way a branch can grow from a branch or is this a 2nd main stem? (or do I just have some sort of genetic freak on my hands?)

Also, the plants with 2 true nodes have a decent ammount of plant material. Is clipping 5 true nodes important or is it only important to cut above the 2nd true node?

I believe that is just the natural growth of the plant, it's normal for growth between the nodes as these produce more bud sites, clones, etc. Topping after the second true node gives four tops, it's been explained over and over again. The reason you wait for 5 or 6 nodes to top is to ensure good plant/root growth before the topping.

 

[Jack in the Bud]

Snak,

Yesterday was day 21 from SID (seed in dirt). All seedlings had at least 3 true opposing nodes with several showing 4. All had nice tight node spacing. Did an upcan yesterday to 8" diameter pots and moved them out from under the fluoros to the main space under the big lights. Still on the 20/4 light cycle. Started giving them some supplemental CO2. A 15 minute low flow squirt every 2 hours. Temps in the 75 to 80 range. Hopefully with in the next week I'll begin pinching them. I plan on waiting until I can see the beginnings of the sixth node before clipping them above the second.

During upcanning yesterday I noticed significantly better root development than I was getting in the past under a 24/0 light cycle. Of course some of this may also be due to using the soil mix UB recommended to me. I had just been using straight from the bag MG potting mix.

So far, so good. I think I'm well on my way to making a significant improvement over what I had been doing.

Jack

 

[Snak]

Snak,

Yesterday was day 21 from SID (seed in dirt). All seedlings had at least 3 true alternating nodes with several showing 4. All had nice tight node spacing.

I think you mean opposing nodes? Alternating nodes do not protrude from the same area, they are staggered and occur after the plant has grown to maturity. A seed starts off growing opposing nodes.

Glad to hear things are going smoother than last round. Im one week away from harvesting my 2nd grow, and things look so much more spectacular than the first try. I'm literally in awe of these plants. I learned a lot this time too.

I'm going to try avoid transplants next round- I'd prefer to let the plant just grow, so I may stick to feminized seeds planted directly into 3 gallon pots. I had some issues with my transplant last time, and I really don't have any good space where I live to perform such an operation without creating a huge mess.

I prefer to look at all these mistakes I made in the buddhist sense, that they are not negatives but positives- they point me in the correct direction and teach me what and what not to do in order to create the stickiest of the icky

 

[DannyGreenEyes]

I believe that is just the natural growth of the plant, it's normal for growth between the nodes as these produce more bud sites, clones, etc. Topping after the second true node gives four tops, it's been explained over and over again. The reason you wait for 5 or 6 nodes to top is to ensure good plant/root growth before the topping.

Thanks for confirming that the main issues are plant development & topping above the 2nd node. That's the way I understood what I read but I needed to make sure.

I think you misunderstood the other 2 question though. When I said there were 2 stems coming from the same site, what I meant was there's a stem with a second stem coming from where you would expect to see a bud site. I circled it in red in the pic.

And the last question is important since this plant may have been topped before. I haven't taken a pic yet, but let me know if you need to see one. The plant has a low lying branch, when you start to follow that branch you notice other branches coming from that branch. I need to know if a branch can grow a whole new branch, like trees do. I've never seen this in any other plant besides trees. But if a branch can't grow a branch then this plants already been topped and I already have 2 main stems.

Thanks again for the help +rep

 

[Jack in the Bud]

I think you mean opposing nodes? Alternating nodes do not protrude from the same area, they are staggered and occur after the plant has grown to maturity. A seed starts off growing opposing nodes.

Glad to hear things are going smoother than last round. Im one week away from harvesting my 2nd grow, and things look so much more spectacular than the first try. I'm literally in awe of these plants. I learned a lot this time too.

I'm going to try avoid transplants next round- I'd prefer to let the plant just grow, so I may stick to feminized seeds planted directly into 3 gallon pots. I had some issues with my transplant last time, and I really don't have any good space where I live to perform such an operation without creating a huge mess.

I prefer to look at all these mistakes I made in the buddhist sense, that they are not negatives but positives- they point me in the correct direction and teach me what and what not to do in order to create the stickiest of the icky

Snak,

You're right, I meant to say "opposing nodes". My bad. I better go edit that if I can.

Jack

 

[DannyGreenEyes]

I think you mean opposing nodes? Alternating nodes do not protrude from the same area, they are staggered and occur after the plant has grown to maturity. A seed starts off growing opposing nodes.

Glad to hear things are going smoother than last round. Im one week away from harvesting my 2nd grow, and things look so much more spectacular than the first try. I'm literally in awe of these plants. I learned a lot this time too.

I'm going to try avoid transplants next round- I'd prefer to let the plant just grow, so I may stick to feminized seeds planted directly into 3 gallon pots. I had some issues with my transplant last time, and I really don't have any good space where I live to perform such an operation without creating a huge mess.

I prefer to look at all these mistakes I made in the buddhist sense, that they are not negatives but positives- they point me in the correct direction and teach me what and what not to do in order to create the stickiest of the icky

Hi, I'm a newbie and I have a quick question about plant maturity. I just bought some clones and they have alternating nodes all over, does this mean the plant is mature? And if it is mature, what does that mean exactly? (reached a certain age, already flowered at least once, has been regenerated, etc...)

 

[Dirtyboy]

I do not top mine and get way,way more yield. But what do i know ive only been growing for years and years.

 

[DaveCoulier]

Danny, check out the fim thread by Mblaze. Your plant looks similar to what happens when you fim. They end up branching out crazy like a tree does.

As for what alternating nodes means, it typically means its ready for flowering aka mature. Look it over and see if you can see any tiny pistils. They'll be hard to spot, so look close.

 

[DannyGreenEyes]

Danny, check out the fim thread by Mblaze. Your plant looks similar to what happens when you fim. They end up branching out crazy like a tree does.

As for what alternating nodes means, it typically means its ready for flowering aka mature. Look it over and see if you can see any tiny pistils. They'll be hard to spot, so look close.

Thanks, I'll check that thread out. I have no idea what fiming is...... yet

Will topping still work on a plant that's been fimed?

I noticed that there was "growth" at the bud sites, not sure if pistils is a term for fem or both fem & male. I have a book that shows the difference in pics, I was gonna check them today to be sure.

Thank god the plant hasn't been regenerated, last think I want is schwag.

Thanks for the help, I appreciate it. +rep