Well, I voted for obama so I'm guessing I can count myself among the unpatriotic lefties. So let me break it down for you. The world is not black and white. There is a lot of nuance and things are rarely as binary as 'america good vs. america bad'. I could turn your question around and ask why conservatives never question whether we are living up to our ideals or whether there are things that can be improved about the way we do business, but I'm not going to go there because we all know how that thread will end.
I love america and think that we have a lot of things going for us. Our ideals, institutions and traditions do make us unique among nations. I love that I can write to my congressman and actually be heard. I love that I can say anything and not fear any kind of persecution for any political views I might hold, no matter how outlandish they are. I love having a certain unalienable rights.
"And it BECAUSE -not despite - my love of this country that I speak out when I think we are not living up to our ideals. For example, when we deny people the right to habeus corpus, detain them indefinitely without access to the courts and subject them to harsh treatment (some might call it torture...) then we are not living up to the ideals outlined in the constitution. In fact, the bill of rights was designed specifically to prevent those kind of abuses so I don't think that speaking out against these kind of practices is hating america. I don't know about you, but abu gharib, gitmo, cia black sites and all the rest are an aberration to our values and ideals. Saying so is not hating on america, quite the opposite actually. We should stay true to our ideals, not just pay lip service to the constitution and then shit all over it when convenient...
America's hegemony in global affairs is a good thing as far as I'm concerned. I'm much happier having us run things than say napoleon, nazi germany, the soviet union etc. But it also means that we need to take that role seriously and try to display some leadership on the issues of our day (terrorism, global trade and finance, preventing conflict, climate change) rather than doing only things that are in our immediate self-interest and tell the world to fall in line or go fuck themselves. We tried the second approach and it basically destroyed our credibility as the 'leader of the free world' and made us look like hypocrites.
There are a lot of positions taken by some conservatives that don't really square with our ideals, like trying to force religion into the public sphere. And some of our founding fathers who wrote the right to liberty were denying their slaves that very right, so hypocrisy and cognitive dissonance in political speech are nothing new.
So rather than assuming that anyone who questions whether our actions are consistent with our fundamental values hates america (and by values I don't mean the ones that make conservatives hate gay people), you should might want to start looking at issues where our notions of freedom and whatnot are merely rhetoric. If you grow and smoke cannabis, that's probably the low hanging fruit right there...I think we can agree that there is at least one issue where liberty takes second place to stupidity or am I wrong?
I see a lot of uninformed political commentary on this thread. I hate blatant bleeding heart bias on either right or left. This is, of course, one of the many reason the age
old etiquette rule "never discuss religion or politics". Lots of emotions and heated debates ensue. That being said let me say this...America is like a police dept. for foreign countries. I belive when your
the most powerful country in the world thats more like a responsibility. Yes our foreign policy is a major reason for our negative report with other countries ( along with armorment sanctions & policies, but at the same time if those countries where under attack by way of war or natural disaster you can bet they wouldn't have a problem petitioning for help from us. And when you invade a country you don't give the enemy a detailed report on an EXIT STRATEGY!!!
"And it BECAUSE -not despite - my love of this country that I speak out when I think we are not living up to our ideals. For example, when we deny people the right to habus corpus, detain them indefinitely without access to the courts and subject them to harsh treatment (some might call it torture...)"
I believe your revering to terrorists that did give up valuable attack info that saved lives!!! I don't recall the constitution outlining how to treat a terrorist. Maybe that is something we as a country sould work on.
Also this does not happen unless a terrorist freely admits to or is caught in
his act or intentional act this is when they are not afforded rights, which is to say this does not apply to everyone at gitmo. Get the facts straight or do some research.
"There are a lot of positions taken by some conservatives that don't really square with our ideals, like trying to force religion into the public sphere. And some of our founding fathers who wrote the right to liberty were denying their slaves that very right, so hypocrisy and cognitive dissonance in political speech are nothing new. "
Obviously this can be said of liberals too... christians are constantly
attacked by liberals. Is not forcing it into the public sphere
it's defending rights to have christian ideals.
Within the last six months 5 preachers have
been arrested for preaching in there own forums/ churches
(for "disturbin the peace") and have lost tax exemption status for preaching the word of GOD!! Tell me thats not a liberal initiative.. I'm not a church go-er but shit this is america!!! Thats just plain wrong.
And on this whole medical bill come on!
Medicare & medicaid are available to people that need it
and are currently bankrupting the states that provide it.
A public option would mean the govt' would asses your policy & costs.
Guess what your health is effected by everything you consume & do.
You gunna tell me the govt isn't going to try & start controlling everything you do? IF the bill passes your going to be forced by way of monetary penalties to purchase ins. public or private.
Bill Clinton said it best. Just pass it even if it's not exactly what you want right now. when you try & fail the other guys (republicans) write history.
How blatantly political... This bill is not for america it's for a few dems to further political careers.
And anytime a govt program is started (ie. welfare, food stamps, medicare medacaid & the biggest one of all Social Security!) They are never stopped or much less fixed if there is a problem with the program.
I am however pro abortion & pro gay marriage.
I may agree with what you say but will defend with my life your right to say it.
