The "OFFICIAL" cast your VOTE on PROP 19 thread

PROP 19 - tax and regulate cannabis in California

  • YES

    Votes: 152 66.1%
  • NO

    Votes: 78 33.9%

  • Total voters
    230

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
It is not a felony to drink in front of your kids...It is not even a felony to supply alcohol to minors...and here is the big one...COPS DRINK...A LOT!!!! They are not losing probable cause to search...they are GAINING probable cause.
So because cops drink a lot that means prop 19 grants them additional probable cause to search a place? That makes absolutely no sense.

Since possession/growing will no longer be illegal, cops lose the "i smell marijuana" probable cause to search a house.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
I'm pretty sure most of those general insults were directed at fdd??? Or at least that's how I took it...I think maybe profane insults are what do it...but I really don't know...I just try not to poke the bear.

:leaf::peace::leaf:
But him calling me a snitch and a cop is fair game of course....
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
but if it becomes legal wont the government mass produce the shit out of it? if you can buy 20 joints for 6 bucks, doesnt that make it impossible for a grower as we know now to clear a profit?
There have been absolutely no signs that the government will be start growing marijuana commercially. There have also been no signs that you will be able to buy 20 joints for $6 dollars. If you can, they are likely to be filled with shitty weed.

I don't think everyone in Cali will all of a sudden be ok with smoking shitty weed. I had a plant get fucked up, had to pick it early. It turned out to be basically schwag. I had a hard time giving it away. I actually had someone get mad at for trying to give them the schwag for free. It's not likely that everyone in Cali is going to stop smoking all that A grade they are used to and want massed produced ditch weed because it's cheap.
 

miteubhi?

Active Member
Except for the thousands of acres that phillip morris and rj reynolds have purchased in northern california.
And what about Richard Lee's weed warehouses in Oakland?
Do some research, it'll scare you.
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
Except for the thousands of acres that phillip morris and rj reynolds have purchased in northern california.
As far as I'm concerned that is just a rumor. I've been unable to find any credible information to suggest that is true. Can you?

And what about Richard Lee's weed warehouses in Oakland?
Richard Lee with all the publicity he gets is still getting killed in the Oakland market by the other clubs. Richard Lee grows schwag. He can grow all the schwag he wants but that doesn't mean Californians are going to choose to buy it over some A grade.

Would you rather pay full price and get some top shelf shit or get a good deal on some schwagg?

Do some research, it'll scare you.
Rumors about Phillip Morris and thousands of acres of property is not "research". If you have some proof that they've done this I'd love to see it. I've looked and was unable to find anything credible.
 

fruitrollup

New Member
the gov does stuff to make money isnt it the only reason its becoming legal? because they want to tax it? what makes you think they arent going to turn it into cigs? seems like thats what they would do probably poison it like the cigs too itd be so cheap people would have that it would undermine everything about the stoner economy. my fantasy is to get rich on weed so dont spoil my stoner dreams cali!
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Cops hate Mj and those who consume it!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_19#Support



judges, state attorneys, police chiefs, law enforcement groups.....

i wish those who oppose prop 19 would at least argue honestly instead of making up a bunch of false info and hypotheticals. just argue based on its merits and its actual verbiage, don't argue dishonestly. arguing dishonestly is an insult to all of us
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
the gov does stuff to make money isnt it the only reason its becoming legal?
The government has nothing to do with it becoming legal. Any citizen of California can get a proposition put on the ballot if they gather enough signatures from private citizens of the state. That is exactly what happened here. Volunteers gathered enough signatures to get it put on the ballot.

However it will only pass because it's called "tax and regulate". When put on the ballot as "marijuana legalization" it doesn't get enough votes according to polling. When put on the ballot as "taxing and regulating cannabis", polling has it passing.

because they want to tax it?
Prop 19's label of "tax and regulate" is intentionally misleading to the general public. They can tax it now without prop 19. They do in certain cities/counties. Prop 19 doesn't add any specific tax. The only reason they call it "tax and regulate" is because it is supported by more voters if it's called that.

what makes you think they arent going to turn it into cigs?
Who's "they"? I run a collective and have all my corporate paperwork filed so when prop 19 passes I'll be able to open a cannabis business. I'm not planning on turning it into cigs. The only prerolled erb I sell is individual prerolls that I make from leftover shake.

Corporations will sell what people want to buy. If people want to buy regular buds, then there will be regular buds for sale. If there is a demand for pre-rolled weed, then they'll sell that.

seems like thats what they would do probably poison it like the cigs too itd be so cheap people would have that it would undermine everything about the stoner economy.
No one will buy weed with additives regardless of the price.

my fantasy is to get rich on weed so dont spoil my stoner dreams cali!
prop 19 allows anyone to do that. Not just big corporations. There is nothing stopping you from doing it too.
 

Hayduke

Well-Known Member
So because cops drink a lot that means prop 19 grants them additional probable cause to search a place? That makes absolutely no sense.

Since possession/growing will no longer be illegal, cops lose the "i smell marijuana" probable cause to search a house.
The context was Alcohol being legal and cops not raiding your liquor cabinet...Again drinking in front of children is not only not illegal...it's down right American and the prop includes felony charges for smoking in front of children...If there is reasonable suspicion that such a felony is being committed, pigs are bound by oath to investigate...The SDPD and the DEA have been busting collectives, dispensaries and large grows as recently as 2010...not everywhere is Alameda County...this place is West Oklahoma.

But him calling me a snitch and a cop is fair game of course....
Huh...had not heard that one...I always thought I was walking a thin line with him as a mod when I have pulled that Sh!t...where is that Small airplane wannabe cop anyway!! Usually my pig talk draws them out of the truffle hole
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Proposition_19#Support





[FORMER]judges, state attorneys, police chiefs, law enforcement groups.....

i wish those who oppose prop 19 would at least argue honestly instead of making up a bunch of false info and hypotheticals. just argue based on its merits and its actual verbiage [which lays out the new felonies], don't argue dishonestly. arguing dishonestly is an insult to all of us
A long time ago I had to take some BS class on Philosophy...I do not remember which one...but this is one of those Fallacies...Of course L.E.A.P. is for the bill...Hell I am too...just that for some reason which I do not know, MAKES ME A FELON FOR SMOKING IN FRONT OF MY KID!!!!!!! What I am doing is NOT WRONG! Having to hide from your children sends a bad message and encourages kids to do the same...IT IS NOT SOUND PARENTING! SO now I go from no crime to criminal HOW THE FOOK IS THAT LEGALIZATION??? Just so you can buy crappy weed from a store.

Now my script is for 18 flowering plants...not that I grow that much, but 5x5 would not be possible...hell outdoors which is where I eventually want to be would limit me to one plant! Now sure my med stuff would trump the prop 19, but the law becomes aware of that after the fact.

Remember I am for legalization! I do not care if it makes it tougher on those who sell.

In California...and this is important...once the people vote on legislation, it is near impossible to revoke or change the law! prop 215 did not restrict any #'s...then SB420 enacted those restrictions...but the CA supreme court has overturned SB420 because it attempts to circumvent the will of the people...Once the prop 19 is passed changing it to fix the "little" problems will be near impossible...Anyone who thinks that the majority of cops who are against this (and please do not kid yourself on this one as they choose when and where to look the other way) will not be super cop making the streets safer for tweekers to stay up and cause mayhem securing more bond measure to en-debt our grandchildren with so there is a pig at every donut store by enforcing 2 shiny new felonies both of which I will be violating with my 15 year old who does not smoke and my 20 year old who does...

I understand the significance that this law has on the 36 states that do not allow MMJ...I get that this is much better than many states where a couple of stems over a zip is a felony and simple misdemeanor possession often comes with jail time...but in Cali smoking and possessing is damn near legal already regardless of med status...as a matter of fact the fine for driving in the carpool lane alone is dramatically more than possession of an ounce...growing is another story...The local sheriff's air unit is not pulling plants all day in Avocado groves because they love guacamole...but because they hate MJ and enforcing MJ laws is much safer than fighting real crime...

:leaf::peace::leaf:
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
just that for some reason which I do not know, MAKES ME A FELON FOR SMOKING IN FRONT OF MY KID!!!!!!! What I am doing is NOT WRONG!
how hard is it to get up and go into the next room? you don't have to hide it from them, just say 'hey kids, dad is going into his office to smoke some pot'. not a good enough reason to send the message to the rest of the country that even california does not want legalization.

HOW THE FOOK IS THAT LEGALIZATION???
because it gives everyone the right to grow their own weed, that's how.

Just so you can buy crappy weed from a store.
or grow some bomb at home for less, and without taxes.

:hump:
 

Hayduke

Well-Known Member
how hard is it to get up and go into the next room? you don't have to hide it from them, just say 'hey kids, dad is going into his office to smoke some pot'. not a good enough reason to send the message to the rest of the country that even california does not want legalization.



because it gives everyone the right to grow their own weed, that's how.



or grow some bomb at home for less, and without taxes.

:hump:
Because it is legislating what I can do in my home...It is not only not a felony, it is not even illegal for me to buy cigarettes and give them to my 15 year old (of course I don't!)

And, no it does not!

And I already do...legally...sort of

Once again, I am for legalization...I voted yes in the poll...I am undecided as to my vote on Nov 2...I agree with those who point out the serious problems with prop 19 and I am concerned...that's it.

I think the space is a bit restrictive for some who may not be able to grow indoors, and the 2 new felonies has me baffled as to why this verbiage is even included??

Of the 60 members who have voted "Yes"...please post if your vote would change to "No" if these three bad ideas were NOT written into the law!!!!

It is not like they are trying to get the vote of the fence sitters on this (there really are very few)...and THIS BILL DID NOT GO TO THE ASSEMBLY so what would ordinarily be legislative concessions to get the bill on the floor for a vote did not need to be included in this prop

:leaf::peace::leaf:
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Because it is legislating what I can do in my home...It is not only not a felony, it is not even illegal for me to buy cigarettes and give them to my 15 year old (of course I don't!)
California Penal Code Section 308(a)
SCOPE: It is unlawful for any person, firm, or corporation to sell, give, or in any way furnish to
a minor any tobacco product or paraphernalia if that person, firm, or corporation knows or
has grounds to know that the recipient is a minor.



seeing how successfully that argument worked out for you, i would like to see your argument as to why this law does not give everyone over 21 the right to grow their own weed. i will eagerly await your reply.
 

Hayduke

Well-Known Member
Well I stand corrected...I guess it just isn't illegal for minors to possess or use tobacco...

You said "everyone" not everyone over 21...just like Ca penal code whatever and prop 19...details matter.

:leaf::peace::leaf:
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
I guess it just isn't illegal for minors to possess or use tobacco...
California Penal Code Section 308(b)
SCOPE: It is unlawful for any person under the age of 18 years to purchase, receive, or possess
any tobacco product or paraphernalia. Penal Code section 308(e) states that no city or county
shall adopt any law or regulation inconsistent with this law.
ENFORCEMENT: Local law enforcement agencies have the general authority to enforce this law
under California Penal Code section 830.1.
PENALTY: Violators are subject to a fine of $75 or 30 hours of community service.

of course, they could forgo this law and give up fema funding, but it's not like california needs fema funding. it's not like they are prone to earthquakes or anything like that...

You said "everyone" not everyone over 21.
that would entail you having the honest belief that i meant 7 year olds could grow weed. otherwise it is just another example of the type of dishonest arguing that goes on around prop 19.
 

Attachments

Hayduke

Well-Known Member
This is every pimple faced rookie university pigs wet dream...

(c) Every person 21 years of age or over who knowingly furnishes, administers, or gives, or offers to furnish, administer or give, any marijuana to a person aged 18 years or older, but younger than 21 years of age, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a period of up to six months and be fined up to $1,000 for each offense.

It also makes smoking in public, like a concert, park, beach, mountain trail against the law.

It also stipulates that growing on rented or leased property may be subject to the approval of landlord

I just read the prop...basically good except for a few really bad parts...

And I found Richard Lee's true motivation behind this proposition...
B. Purposes


5. Put dangerous, underground street dealers out of business, so their influence in our communities will fade.

I sure wish this had been around years ago to protect me from more than a few dangerous stay-at-home mom's that I have bought pot from over the years;)

:leaf::peace::leaf:
 

Dan Kone

Well-Known Member
This is every pimple faced rookie university pigs wet dream...

(c) Every person 21 years of age or over who knowingly furnishes, administers, or gives, or offers to furnish, administer or give, any marijuana to a person aged 18 years or older, but younger than 21 years of age, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a period of up to six months and be fined up to $1,000 for each offense.
It is almost impossible to prove that you knowingly gave pot to a 20 year old. How do you know they are twenty? The cops have to prove you knew they were twenty ahead of time.

It also makes smoking in public, like a concert, park, beach, mountain trail against the law.
Yet it doesn't add any specific penalty for those things. Concerts aren't necessarily public property. No reason those a smoking section couldn't be made. Also, those things are illegal now.

The idea that allowing very citizen to possess and grow cannabis is taking our freedoms away isn't a great argument.
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
This is every pimple faced rookie university pigs wet dream...

(c) Every person 21 years of age or over who knowingly furnishes, administers, or gives, or offers to furnish, administer or give, any marijuana to a person aged 18 years or older, but younger than 21 years of age, shall be punished by imprisonment in the county jail for a period of up to six months and be fined up to $1,000 for each offense.
you have two options:
1) don't give pot to minors
2) create reasonable doubt that the 18-20 year old may have appeared to be 21. reasonable doubt gets you out if some dick cop wants to take it to a court of law.

It also makes smoking in public, like a concert, park, beach, mountain trail against the law.
same law applies in any non-medical state, yet people smoke at concerts, on mountain trails, at the beach, or in parks all the time. just be smart about it.

It also stipulates that growing on rented or leased property may be subject to the approval of landlord
that is already how it is in cali, otherwise people would not advertise 'sb420 friendly'



And I found Richard Lee's true motivation behind this proposition...
B. Purposes

5. Put dangerous, underground street dealers out of business, so their influence in our communities will fade.
the thing would stand no chance of passing if that statement advocated for the exaltation of street dealers. that should be obvious to anyone
 

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
It is almost impossible to prove that you knowingly gave pot to a 20 year old. How do you know they are twenty? The cops have to prove you knew they were twenty ahead of time.



Yet it doesn't add any specific penalty for those things. Concerts aren't necessarily public property. No reason those a smoking section couldn't be made. Also, those things are illegal now.

The idea that allowing very citizen to possess and grow cannabis is taking our freedoms away isn't a great argument.
so i can go fuck me some 17 year olds? she said she was 20. :roll: :dunce:
 

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
The Statutory rape law doesn't include the word "knowingly" genius.

What is it about the word knowingly that is so confusing for you? :dunce:
so it's ok as long as you don't "knowingly" know how old they are?

i still wonder, why the need to throw insults? :neutral:
 
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