God Proves his Non-Existence thru a Loop Hole

Dj1209

Well-Known Member
Does science have the answer??? From what I know there is not one scientist that has explained why cells split the way they do in the womb.
I am not being confrontive, just stated what I know.
Possibly at this point we may not know I'm not sure I'm not an scientist nor an all knowing being, but in the future it may be possible to figure it out just think a few years back all the technology and basic knowledge we have now. Over time we learn there are still many things we cannot explain simply because we are not advanced enough yet.
 

plantvision

Active Member
Possibly at this point we may not know I'm not sure I'm not an scientist nor an all knowing being, but in the future it may be possible to figure it out just think a few years back all the technology and basic knowledge we have now. Over time we learn there are still many things we cannot explain simply because we are not advanced enough yet.
Point well taken.
 

Dj1209

Well-Known Member
i know it's such a wierd thing to think about. what if there wasnt space, it would be nothing, but if there is nothing then what is nothing? human terms can never explain this.
Every time i think about it my mind gets blown again and again. i feel like im so close, but infinitely far away.
EDIT: ya know? lol
Yeah its a really mind boggling subject just to many variables we are unaware of, lol at points feel like I am close to the answer but then I concoct another possibility I just wish I could know to bad I don't see it happening in my lifetime or humanitys lifetime as well. As of this point in time I foresee a global economic crash and when it happens I will look like notradomas of check the spelling on that just ramblings of a stoner......forgive me
 

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
Your "loophole" is first year philosophy. This proof is also first year philosophy:

Premise 1: God is the greatest possible good.

Premise 2: Existence is better than non-existence.

Therefore, God Must exist.
And St. Anselm's ontological argument is refuted on day 2 of Philosphy 101.
 

Encomium

Active Member
And St. Anselm's ontological argument is refuted on day 2 of Philosphy 101.
Yes very much so. What was your answer to the proof? I chose to argue that existence cannot be compared to non-existence; I do not remember the proper refutation. It's been a while since phil 101.

What are your thoughts on the OP's paradox as an argument?
 

MrDank007

Well-Known Member
Irresistable force vs. immovable object paradox...both can not be true at once at least in logic although neither have been found to be true in science
 

i<3

Active Member
Without me I don't exist. I am my own god.

In fact without me nothing exists. Well at least to me it doesn't.
thats 100% true.. if your not there (me, you, he, they)who would know what exists or not ?without "us"nothing would be the way it is, because the "humans" perception would not exist, thus we dont know if things really are the way they are... if you look at a cup....you see roundness right ? well if you werent there to look at "the cup" what would it be or look like.. ?
ps i am in no way trying to say that men are the all powerful and im not trying to be egocentric... its just if we weren't there to perceive the object...would it even exist....? (i love personal philosophy)
 

RyanTheRhino

Well-Known Member
hahah. yea this is a intro philosophy argument just though i would share it to the people who have never heard it.
 

Beansly

RIU Bulldog
I don't think that someone can prove they're not real. And there are no loopholes with God, your just being cynical.
 

RyanTheRhino

Well-Known Member
Your "loophole" is first year philosophy. This proof is also first year philosophy:


EDIT. oh thats just a completely different argument

Premise 1: God is the greatest possible good.

Premise 2: Existence is better than non-existence.

Therefore, God Must exist.

EDIT: oh thats completely different argument

thats like saying its better to have no stress than to have stress.

non-existence means no stress which means its better to not exist.

the only thing that can be argued about my original posted argument is that my premise is wrong.

if my premise is wrong then god is not all-powerful ( which is the same if the premise is true)

so my argument still stands that since god cannot be all-powerful then our precipitation of god is wrong.

PS. I am not here to start a religious battle this is just a thought experiment
 

The Cryptkeeper

Well-Known Member
Okay. I know I'm just going to unsubscribe in a second, but how the fuck would god be limited to rules? Regardless of if he made them.
 

Dropastone

Well-Known Member
If god is the creator of all, then who created god? If we were created in gods image then couldn't god be a man? If god is a man did he create all with science that we don't understand? Since we don't understand the science would that make man a god?
 

Snow Crash

Well-Known Member
Something like this maybe?


The Egg
By: Andy Weir
You were on your way home when you died.
It was a car accident. Nothing particularly remarkable, but fatal nonetheless. You left behind a wife and two children. It was a painless death. The EMTs tried their best to save you, but to no avail. Your body was so utterly shattered you were better off, trust me.
And that&#8217;s when you met me.
&#8220;What&#8230; what happened?&#8221; You asked. &#8220;Where am I?&#8221;
&#8220;You died,&#8221; I said, matter-of-factly. No point in mincing words.
&#8220;There was a&#8230; a truck and it was skidding&#8230;&#8221;
&#8220;Yup,&#8221; I said.
&#8220;I&#8230; I died?&#8221;
&#8220;Yup. But don&#8217;t feel bad about it. Everyone dies,&#8221; I said.
You looked around. There was nothingness. Just you and me. &#8220;What is this place?&#8221; You asked. &#8220;Is this the afterlife?&#8221;
&#8220;More or less,&#8221; I said.
&#8220;Are you god?&#8221; You asked.
&#8220;Yup,&#8221; I replied. &#8220;I&#8217;m God.&#8221;
&#8220;My kids&#8230; my wife,&#8221; you said.
&#8220;What about them?&#8221;
&#8220;Will they be all right?&#8221;
&#8220;That&#8217;s what I like to see,&#8221; I said. &#8220;You just died and your main concern is for your family. That&#8217;s good stuff right there.&#8221;
You looked at me with fascination. To you, I didn&#8217;t look like God. I just looked like some man. Or possibly a woman. Some vague authority figure, maybe. More of a grammar school teacher than the almighty.
&#8220;Don&#8217;t worry,&#8221; I said. &#8220;They&#8217;ll be fine. Your kids will remember you as perfect in every way. They didn&#8217;t have time to grow contempt for you. Your wife will cry on the outside, but will be secretly relieved. To be fair, your marriage was falling apart. If it&#8217;s any consolation, she&#8217;ll feel very guilty for feeling relieved.&#8221;
&#8220;Oh,&#8221; you said. &#8220;So what happens now? Do I go to heaven or hell or something?&#8221;
&#8220;Neither,&#8221; I said. &#8220;You&#8217;ll be reincarnated.&#8221;
&#8220;Ah,&#8221; you said. &#8220;So the Hindus were right,&#8221;
&#8220;All religions are right in their own way,&#8221; I said. &#8220;Walk with me.&#8221;
You followed along as we strode through the void. &#8220;Where are we going?&#8221;
&#8220;Nowhere in particular,&#8221; I said. &#8220;It&#8217;s just nice to walk while we talk.&#8221;
&#8220;So what&#8217;s the point, then?&#8221; You asked. &#8220;When I get reborn, I&#8217;ll just be a blank slate, right? A baby. So all my experiences and everything I did in this life won&#8217;t matter.&#8221;
&#8220;Not so!&#8221; I said. &#8220;You have within you all the knowledge and experiences of all your past lives. You just don&#8217;t remember them right now.&#8221;
I stopped walking and took you by the shoulders. &#8220;Your soul is more magnificent, beautiful, and gigantic than you can possibly imagine. A human mind can only contain a tiny fraction of what you are. It&#8217;s like sticking your finger in a glass of water to see if it&#8217;s hot or cold. You put a tiny part of yourself into the vessel, and when you bring it back out, you&#8217;ve gained all the experiences it had.
&#8220;You&#8217;ve been in a human for the last 48 years, so you haven&#8217;t stretched out yet and felt the rest of your immense consciousness. If we hung out here for long enough, you&#8217;d start remembering everything. But there&#8217;s no point to doing that between each life.&#8221;
&#8220;How many times have I been reincarnated, then?&#8221;
&#8220;Oh lots. Lots and lots. An in to lots of different lives.&#8221; I said. &#8220;This time around, you&#8217;ll be a Chinese peasant girl in 540 AD.&#8221;
&#8220;Wait, what?&#8221; You stammered. &#8220;You&#8217;re sending me back in time?&#8221;
&#8220;Well, I guess technically. Time, as you know it, only exists in your universe. Things are different where I come from.&#8221;
&#8220;Where you come from?&#8221; You said.
&#8220;Oh sure,&#8221; I explained &#8220;I come from somewhere. Somewhere else. And there are others like me. I know you&#8217;ll want to know what it&#8217;s like there, but honestly you wouldn&#8217;t understand.&#8221;
&#8220;Oh,&#8221; you said, a little let down. &#8220;But wait. If I get reincarnated to other places in time, I could have interacted with myself at some point.&#8221;
&#8220;Sure. Happens all the time. And with both lives only aware of their own lifespan you don&#8217;t even know it&#8217;s happening.&#8221;
&#8220;So what&#8217;s the point of it all?&#8221;
&#8220;Seriously?&#8221; I asked. &#8220;Seriously? You&#8217;re asking me for the meaning of life? Isn&#8217;t that a little stereotypical?&#8221;
&#8220;Well it&#8217;s a reasonable question,&#8221; you persisted.
I looked you in the eye. &#8220;The meaning of life, the reason I made this whole universe, is for you to mature.&#8221;
&#8220;You mean mankind? You want us to mature?&#8221;
&#8220;No, just you. I made this whole universe for you. With each new life you grow and mature and become a larger and greater intellect.&#8221;
&#8220;Just me? What about everyone else?&#8221;
&#8220;There is no one else,&#8221; I said. &#8220;In this universe, there&#8217;s just you and me.&#8221;
You stared blankly at me. &#8220;But all the people on earth&#8230;&#8221;
&#8220;All you. Different incarnations of you.&#8221;
&#8220;Wait. I&#8217;m everyone!?&#8221;
&#8220;Now you&#8217;re getting it,&#8221; I said, with a congratulatory slap on the back.
&#8220;I&#8217;m every human being who ever lived?&#8221;
&#8220;Or who will ever live, yes.&#8221;
&#8220;I&#8217;m Abraham Lincoln?&#8221;
&#8220;And you&#8217;re John Wilkes Booth, too,&#8221; I added.
&#8220;I&#8217;m Hitler?&#8221; You said, appalled.
&#8220;And you&#8217;re the millions he killed.&#8221;
&#8220;I&#8217;m Jesus?&#8221;
&#8220;And you&#8217;re everyone who followed him.&#8221;
You fell silent.
&#8220;Every time you victimized someone,&#8221; I said, &#8220;you were victimizing yourself. Every act of kindness you&#8217;ve done, you&#8217;ve done to yourself. Every happy and sad moment ever experienced by any human was, or will be, experienced by you.&#8221;
You thought for a long time.
&#8220;Why?&#8221; You asked me. &#8220;Why do all this?&#8221;
&#8220;Because someday, you will become like me. Because that&#8217;s what you are. You&#8217;re one of my kind. You&#8217;re my child.&#8221;
&#8220;Whoa,&#8221; you said, incredulous. &#8220;You mean I&#8217;m a god?&#8221;
&#8220;No. Not yet. You&#8217;re a fetus. You&#8217;re still growing. Once you&#8217;ve lived every human life throughout all time, you will have grown enough to be born.&#8221;
&#8220;So the whole universe,&#8221; you said, &#8220;it&#8217;s just&#8230;&#8221;
&#8220;An egg.&#8221; I answered. &#8220;Now it&#8217;s time for you to move on to your next life.&#8221;
And I sent you on your way.
 

Total Head

Well-Known Member
the term "all-powerful" ends this whole discussion. no philo intro needed. all-powerful assumes all-knowingness.
if god is all-powerful/knowing, then surely he knows better than to create something more powerful than he. fucking duh. anyone who slips up like that was never "all-powerful" to begin with. /paradox.
 

The Cryptkeeper

Well-Known Member
All that is need to end this paradox, is the ability. If he CAN, then there is no need to. If there is no need to, then the loop hole is negated.

This is some Dogma shit.
 
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