Clarification on Aeroponics

[Mike Young]

Well put, sir. Your sig is hilarious. I tend to get wound up when someone claims to have locked down the "best" system to grow. Especially when it doesn't involve fine root hairs. Even if I think controlled atomization is the best thing to date, I'd never suggest its the end all, be all, or that my system is the best. I'm always thing of ways things can be improved. When one states they have the best growing system, it implies that I didn't do my homework. I guess time will tell.

 

[lordjin]

Well put, sir. Your sig is hilarious. I tend to get wound up when someone claims to have locked down the "best" system to grow. Especially when it doesn't involve fine root hairs. Even if I think controlled atomization is the best thing to date, I'd never suggest its the end all, be all, or that my system is the best. I'm always thing of ways things can be improved. When one states they have the best growing system, it implies that I didn't do my homework. I guess time will tell.

Who said I have the 'best' system? I've built a level of vigor into my system that's fuckin' tough to beat. That's all I'll say about my system.

I was simply asserting the point that with a little creative diy, you can acheive results that rival those of much more expensive setups.

I don't think "time will tell" is an adequate response. My challenge remains open to you and skunkdoc or anyone esle espousing that nothing beats the quality of 'fine white root hairs.'

And despite your explanation, I have to say that this argument still comes down to 'what is better' doesn't it?

Let me quote your companion if you don't mind:

"those fluffy white roots indicate that the plant is receiving the perfect oxygen/moisture mix without ever getting too wet

systems that drench the roots in a fine spray will never keep roots in this fluffy state
these fake aero systems may have some advantages over regular hydro systems but i wouldn't consider them aeroponics "

~~~~~~~~~~~~

So is this about who has the fluffiest, whitest roots? Or is this about whose plants grow faster and are more vigorous? Show me the difference in plant / final bud quality between a plant with fluffly white high pressure roots and a plant grown in more of a conventional hydro scenario. But then again, I'm offering RIU the opportunity to see that very comparison first hand in real time. I'm offering a direct comparison by issuing a friendly (get that mods?) challenge to you or anyone who uses hi-pressure. I'm starting up another grow very soon and will be documenting it in my second journal here. Why not start up an hp journal side by side?

This exchange got off on the wrong foot. I will humbly concede that high pressure atomizing is a truer form of aeroponics, but I would like to demonstrate also how a cheaply home-made contraption can compete.

We can continue our discussion on the benefits of 'true aeroponics' as our respective grows progress.

I'm willing to stick my neck out to back up my argument. Are any of you? My buds and my system suck... I admit it.

And I certainly hope that both you and skunkdoc have completed successful high-pressure aeroponics grows before posting all this great information.

 

[vespa8910]

hope my grow looks that good lordjin. We are using 1 min on / 4 min. off. We have no water pooling. I know that the high pressure systems do very short sprays, but we looked into it and it was just too involved, especially as the grow gets bigger. What variety is that in your picture? I would love to grow something that is that successful. You are in california? PM me.

 

[lordjin]

hope my grow looks that good lordjin. We are using 1 min on / 4 min. off. We have no water pooling. I know that the high pressure systems do very short sprays, but we looked into it and it was just too involved, especially as the grow gets bigger. What variety is that in your picture? I would love to grow something that is that successful. You are in california? PM me.

Well if it isn't the person who started this thread and got me into this mess in the first place! Lol.

Yeah, that space-age sprayer stuff looks really cool. But I haven't seen any proof that the final results in high pressure make mine look like shit. And so is that added expense and involvment worth it? That's my question.

Your setup and spray cycle are interesting, and I want you to succeed.

That's a Diablo OG Kush strain I picked up from a local collective.

 

[lordjin]

unless your plants are producing the white fluffy roots then i wouldn't consider the system to be working the way aeroponics was intended or to its full potential

those fluffy white roots indicate that the plant is receiving the perfect oxygen/moisture mix without ever getting too wet

systems that drench the roots in a fine spray will never keep roots in this fluffy state
these fake aero systems may have some advantages over regular hydro systems but i wouldn't consider them aeroponics

the low pressure spray systems that keep the roots constantly wet are sold as aeroponic systems because they use no medium .. defining aeroponics as any system that does not use a medium is open to abuse imo and results in revamped hydro systems sold at twice the price and labeled as "aeroponic"

they are free to call the system what they like
anyone that has done some research will know better and not fall for this marketing hype

similar thread here with some nice info ..
https://www.rollitup.org/aerogardeners/437684-true-hp-aero-2011-a-2.html

Let me see photos of these perfect 'fluffly white roots' you've grown with your micro spray system. then show me the mature plants close to finish and your roots that are still 'fluffy and white.'

Edit:

And what 'marketing hype' are you referring to? I made my system myself.

 

[skunkd0c]

lordjin > The fluffy white roots are the key ... why you fail to grasp this is beyond me

please post a picture of your fluffy aeroponic roots, those fluff's turn me on something rotten

those plants are ok looking, although nothing really to boast about
i award you a silver star ! for the 2nd best plants i have ever seen grown in a fake aeroponic system

 

[Mike Young]

There would be far too many variables to properly conduct an experiment in two completely different environments/strains. I only use a single 600 watt light for flower, no c02 enrichment, no enviro controller, etc... Also, how does one compare taste, quality, high, without trying each others product. I personally think that with lower nute concentrations, taste & smoke could be better. Speculation, yes. My system is very experimental, and I expect there will be some problems to work out in real time. Having said that, I am not afraid to compare notes & such with you. Not really a journaling type myself, as I don't like alot of evidenced hanging about on the net. I have two baby moms going in dirt currently that I hope to be able to cut some clones from soon. Honestly, I haven't had a ton of luck getting clones to root in my homemade cloners. Trying something different now, and keeping my fingers crossed. I believe this can remain civil. Perhaps even fun. It seems I have a mod monitoring my ass now, so I'm not really looking for any un-wanted attention.

 

[skunkd0c]

I do not grow aeroponic style plants, i grow NFT hydro plants
your plants in that picture above look pretty small compared to mine
maybe you could explain why that is ?
i would of thought your "aero" system would produce bigger plants

 

[lordjin]

lordjin > The fluffy white roots are the key ... why you fail to grasp this is beyond me

please post a picture of your fluffy aeroponic roots, those fluff's turn me on something rotten

those plants are ok looking, although nothing really to boast about
i award you a silver star ! for the 2nd best plants i have ever seen grown in a fake aeroponic system

Who's boasting? I think I've gotten stellar results and the pictures speak volumes.

And your analysis is that they are 'okay looking, but nothing to boast about?' Very indepth, very scientific.

I would offer an equally penetrating analysis of your work if you would post samples from your grow, but I don't see that. Post some of your best bud shots from your most recent grow if you want to read some indepth analysis on my part.

From beginners to intermediates to experts, no one cares about words and words and words without any pictures to back it up and real experience to back it up. So say what you want about my grow. No one takes you seriously anyway.

And keeping your roots in that 'baby fishbone state' when they first appear the same way throughout your entire grow sounds great, but how many small residential growers do you think have the money, space, time to grow 'space-age' roots? It's not a practical, cost-effective method for the small private grower. And most large commercial ops still stay with convential methods too because the real pros who do it as a business know better than anyone else that whatever improvement in result is not worth the added expense and maintenance. That's why there are no journals that document a cannabis grow in this fashion from beginning to end. There aren't any out there because real growers don't bother with shit like this.

I have no problem with RIU users tinkering and talking about this technology or that, but I'd rather grow.

 

[skunkd0c]

you are boasting and sidestepping by posting pics of your little plants when you should be posting pics of the fluffy aero root system to back up your claims of having a true aero system, until you do this you have zero credibility
anyone with some growing experience will see your "sidestepping", nice try though

i have posted many pictures of my grows here, and on various other forums .. mr nice etc , you may go find them if you wish

 

[Mike Young]

My pump was 100. Pressure tank, 150. Solenoids 70. Tubing & fittings 75. Leaf bins for my root chamber, 30. Amount saved on nutes in the long run? Likely pay for my system in a couple of grows.

Edit: timer, 100.

 

[lordjin]

you are boasting and sidestepping by posting pics of your little plants when you should be posting pics of the fluffy aero root system to back up your claims of having a true aero system, until you do this you have zero credibility
anyone with some growing experience will see your "sidestepping", nice try though

i have posted many pictures of my grows here, and on various other forums .. mr nice etc , you may go find them if you wish

No thanks, I've seen enough mediocrity here. I don't claim to have 'true anything,' but the 'true high' i get at the end of my harvest.

BTW- Mr. Nice, another of the beginner strains that goes for bottom shelf prices at all the dispensaries here in Los Angeles.

 

[lordjin]

My pump was 100. Pressure tank, 150. Solenoids 70. Tubing & fittings 75. Leaf bins for my root chamber, 30. Amount saved on nutes in the long run? Likely pay for my system in a couple of grows.

Edit: timer, 100.

8 160 degree cloner sprayers: 4.72
A lenght of pvc pipe to drill holes and screw them into: dirt cheap as well.

And you'll make your money back in two grows only with a best case scenario. But let's be real... we all know that actual grows are full of surprises, don't we? Especially when we are still experimenting with a technology we haven't fully mastered yet.

 

[skunkd0c]

i will add backpedaling to your list of personality traits
if i were as desperate as you are for approval i too would be posting pictures of my plants in this thread
but i am a nice guy and not a poser like you

you have embarrassed yourself enough with your lack of knowledge and those little plants

i do not wish to add to that by posting pictures of my haze trees
i will now depart from this thread as there is nothing here

goodbye and peace no hard feelings chump

 

[lordjin]

I do not grow aeroponic style plants, i grow NFT hydro plants
your plants in that picture above look pretty small compared to mine
maybe you could explain why that is ?
i would of thought your "aero" system would produce bigger plants

I don't see any pictures of your larger plants. And not surprising that you use NFT, the easiest hydro method that requires the least skill. I guess that makes you an authority on hi-pressure aero? Laughable.

Why do my plants look small compared to yours? Because the main stalks are trained to grow horizontally. It's called low stress training. Get a good grow manual.

Edit:

And that should be 'would have thought.' I thought you brits spoke good English. You must be one of the 'special-ed' brits.

 

[lordjin]

i will add backpedaling to your list of personality traits
if i were as desperate as you are for approval i too would be posting pictures of my plants in this thread
but i am a nice guy and not a poser like you

you have embarrassed yourself enough with your lack of knowledge and those little plants

i do not wish to add to that by posting pictures of my haze trees
i will now depart from this thread as there is nothing here

goodbye and peace no hard feelings chump

That's what I thought, you fucking Limey punk. You don't want to show your shitty haze, a strain a five year old can grow. Get out and stay out. And it's been my experience that only the worst people go around saying how nice they are.

Edit:

I know you're still reading this, bitch. So one last word for you. Stupidly tall stretched plants don't mean larger plants. It just means you don't know how to keep the canopy low.

Edit:

One more, shit head. You embarrass yourself simply by being on this site with your sorry NFT grows. And I hope you like those shitty UK genetics that try to be like California weed but never will.

 

[lordjin]

There would be far too many variables to properly conduct an experiment in two completely different environments/strains. I only use a single 600 watt light for flower, no c02 enrichment, no enviro controller, etc... Also, how does one compare taste, quality, high, without trying each others product. I personally think that with lower nute concentrations, taste & smoke could be better. Speculation, yes. My system is very experimental, and I expect there will be some problems to work out in real time. Having said that, I am not afraid to compare notes & such with you. Not really a journaling type myself, as I don't like alot of evidenced hanging about on the net. I have two baby moms going in dirt currently that I hope to be able to cut some clones from soon. Honestly, I haven't had a ton of luck getting clones to root in my homemade cloners. Trying something different now, and keeping my fingers crossed. I believe this can remain civil. Perhaps even fun. It seems I have a mod monitoring my ass now, so I'm not really looking for any un-wanted attention.

Now you're starting to sound like someone I can talk to.

I agree. There are too many variables to conduct an accurate control.

I also recently adopted the same thought that a milder nute will create a finer finished bud.

Now I wonder what else you and I agree upon?

Yes, civil and fun are better than flames, but I would be lying if I said I didn't enjoy lashing out at unskilled douchebags with big mouths from time to time... and I'm not talking about you.

Edit:

Let me preface this edit by saying my intention in this is constructive.

Something to add about a controlled comparison between our respective ops being impractical. I can tell you with all honesty right now, not trying to brag or boast, just presenting hard facts ...if you're running only a 600w light and you don't have environmental controls, a contest between us would be no contest at all. I run a 1000w light in a 4x2 space and I have intense environmental controls... which is the only thing that makes a 1000w light in a 4x2 space even possible. I would venture to guess that your smaller light is illuminating a larger space than 4x2. Which goes back to my original point that it's the overall setup that counts.

I really don't mean to offend, but in plain terms, if you had your entire system dialed in to optimum, you had many successful grows with your pressure sprayers with tons of root/plant photos, then I would regard you with much greater respect. Plain and simple. And so I would heed more what you have to say on the matter of this technology. But at least you use sprayers unlike the NFT expert.

So it turns out I was having an argument about 'true aero' with two people who do not have the experience of creating a scientifically dialed in system. One that utilizes 'true aero' or any other method, whether 'true' or not. I do feel silly now.

 

[RavenMochi]

you are boasting and sidestepping by posting pics of your little plants when you should be posting pics of the fluffy aero root system to back up your claims of having a true aero system, until you do this you have zero credibility
anyone with some growing experience will see your "sidestepping", nice try though

i have posted many pictures of my grows here, and on various other forums .. mr nice etc , you may go find them if you wish

Dude, seriously, enough with the pissing contest. Overcompensating much? how hard is it to be civil?

As far as root pics, Lordjin showed root pics, they were either to your satisfaction or not, unfortunately I'm guessing your the only one that cares that much. So, by all means, go talk to yourself and tell yourself what a good job your doing while stroking your ego. Or better yet, smoke a blunt and remember we're, at least in theory, here to help each other be better growers, not get all condescending.

Okay, here on out, I'm deleting flames. Continue with the helpful shit we can all learn from. Your friendly neighborhood mod ~ravenmochi

 

[Mike Young]

This was from my previous setup. I ran it once, and decided that it could be better. Half way through flower my pump died, starving my plants for 14-18 hrs or so. Lost about 50% of my fan leaves. Was forced to finish top feed/drip. This was a very primitive system, and I hope to at least double what I got from it. I originally planned on having 3 ladies in it, as you can see, one didn't quite take, and not being able to move the pots, I didn't utilize my space very well. These were the roots after 30 days of veg (total veg time). After this point I was unable to view them, as I put up a scrog net, and pulling the pots was no longer an option. In my new setup I'll be able to spy on the roots any time, reguardless. This was my first grow, ever. The strain was sensi star, and the smell/smoke was the best I've ever had, as well as everyone else who tried it. Beginners luck. Makes me wonder why I tossed that setup without ever giving it another go. Cheers.