Chopper fly overs?

[Undercover Cop]

it is very true my friend,
In helicopters they use infared cameras and other equipment that can detect cannabis by measuring the heat and reflective signature of the vegetation below. Cannabis has higher reflectivity at certain wavelengths than other rural crops, such as corn.

Yes I actually do agree with this, as this has to do with visually observing the cannabis foliage directly. Not seeing the lights through walls or hot air being vented. This is totally different technology than FLIR though, FLIR is registering the heat signatures of different objects and relies on an observer to differentiate one object from another based on its appearance. Cannabis itself gives off no heat nor retains heat anymore than other plants.

Think of FLIR as Thermal Imaging, The infrared in the name can throw people off. Most people hear FLIR and think of Image intensification, which is using light invisible to humans (UV or IR) to create the digital images on screen (starlight scope or NVG's)

This chart refers to the cannabis vegetation reflecting different wavelengths of light at different ratio's compared to other plants. This is done by using image intensification and filters that allow only certain wavelengths to show brighter on the screen as the spotter scans. Knowing that wavelengths over 750nm are reflected at a much higer rate than the surrounding foliage, you can use a filter that will block out the waves under 750nm, and the resulting picture will look very dull and washed out but the cannabis will stand out much brighter against the background. use some color correction and processing and the picture can look relatively normal except a cannabis patch will stand out. Fly a drone to do a large area survey then have some desk jockey examine the photos for anything that stands out. This is a reality, and is done, and doesnt need a warrant because its only observing what is in plain sight (doesnt look through walls or anything, only picks up the reflected sunlight wavelengths) but would be prohibitively expensive to do on a small scale or targeted at any one person. These are done over large open areas (National forrests/parks/cattle ranch lands etc) and wouldnt pick up your small garden in the back yard, but like I said, even from 10000ft+ a 10x10' plot would stand out enough to get noticed. BUUUUTTT.... there are under 500 DEA agents worldwide, they're not going to go after your small time grow, and if you're growing outside you shouldnt be growing on your own property to begin with... the far back corner of your neighbor's yard gets more sun anyway, right

 

[mountaingarden]

I live in a legal state, so my only worries from helicopters or planes are rippers. Last summer was my first legal grow, and because my house is very isolated, blithely had a lovely garden of 15 plants on my deck. Totally spaced the fact (and I should know better) that the flight path to our regional trauma center is right over my place. When the Life Flight is heading for the trauma center they're highballing trying to keep somebody alive, but deadheading home, they have lots of time to sightsee.

One beautiful afternoon in September I was out tending my plants and out of the south at treetop level (I live in the mountains) came Life Flight, and I didn't hear them coming until I could see their grins. New quiet helicopter you can't hear until it's right on top of you when it's throttled back. Those assholes!!!! Clearly ex-military, not getting shot at, and loving screwing with me. I smiled and gave them a big wave. Spent a couple of days expecting a visit from the sheriff, and then realized it was just a couple of bored rotorheads having fun.

Good lesson learned, however. I live in an area where there are lots of private planes. They're not trained to spot pot, but having a forest on my deck was pretty naive. Got away from it, but...lesson learned! It would be lousy to grow a crop, only to lose it right before harvest to a rich jerk who's been watching it grow.

 

[doublejj]

Here's a little video to show how they use FLIR to look for wet spots in vinyards.

The police fly over dry hillsides & valleys and use FLIR to look for wet spots.

When we water our plants the surrounding wet dirt stands out like a sore thumb on FLIR!

peace
doublejj

[video=youtube;ptKwkk2W-WM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptKwkk2W-WM[/video]

 

[XRagnorX]

The way I understand it marijuana has a very high U.V. reflectivity in a specific spectrum. This is actually due to the manner in which the plant resins absorb and reflect light energy. Supposedly this trait can be selectively targeted through specific light filtration equipment. It is effectively spectral imaging rather than thermal imaging. I think I read that on the old CC forums. Is it bullshit? Well maybe, but science is science. They could use a fuckin' satellite if they spent enough tax money on it.

 

[Undercover Cop]

The way I understand it marijuana has a very high U.V. reflectivity in a specific spectrum. This is actually due to the manner in which the plant resins absorb and reflect light energy. Supposedly this trait can be selectively targeted through specific light filtration equipment. It is effectively spectral imaging rather than thermal imaging. I think I read that on the old CC forums. Is it bullshit? Well maybe, but science is science. They could use a fuckin' satellite if they spent enough tax money on it.

uh, yeah we just covered that about 3-4 posts ago.

DoubleJJ brings up a very good point. The wet spots would be much cooler (or possibly warmer) than the surroundings, and most use water brought to the site by lines/hoses since a naturally wet area would have bad drainage and wouldnt be a very good place to grow at anyway. so a wet spot on a hillside or otherwise dry area would definately stand out, didnt consider that. Ive never grown outside before, but Ive been there a few times.

 

[mountaingarden]

Here's a little video to show how they use FLIR to look for wet spots in vinyards.

The police fly over dry hillsides & valleys and use FLIR to look for wet spots.

When we water our plants the surrounding wet dirt stands out like a sore thumb on FLIR!

peace
doublejj

[video=youtube;ptKwkk2W-WM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ptKwkk2W-WM[/video]

Thanks for this. For any high desert crops, this is a great tool. Cool technology. Grew up in irrigated high desert and this is Star Wars stuff! Wish the old orchardists could see this.

Still pretty sure the current economy doesn't let fly boys burn kerosene like they did in the old days. News tonight is how to keep cops and fire fighters on the streets, so not a lot of $ for $3,000+ hour aviation toys. Thank goddess. Satellites could do it, but same question....surely they have better things to do with that resource?

 

[potpimp]

@ Undercover Cop. That's some great info man and thanks for that. But I gotta ask you about the user name. Are you really a cop? And if so, why are you "helping" us? Inquiring minds want to know.

 

[Undercover Cop]

@ Undercover Cop. That's some great info man and thanks for that. But I gotta ask you about the user name. Are you really a cop? And if so, why are you "helping" us? Inquiring minds want to know.

Cant figure out how to change my name to Undercover CrOP lol... Im not quite a cop, but not your average dick either Ill just say that I only know 1 other person who even smokes, let alone grows! so I cant really talk to the "homies" about this kinda stuff lol

 

[woodsusa]

I've had choppers fly over at very low altitudes. The last one turned me into a newt.

 

[powerslide]

Great info guys one of the better discussions i have had on here appreciate all the responses. i have a question. Are most of you in states where this is legal? I feel like states that it is legal would have a bigger worry about choppers busting them. anyone care to agree or disagree and ellaborate? My plan is to do 5-10 plants spread out over 5acres. would this be easy to spot w/ the technology we are talking about or would they have to all be grouped together to be noticable?

 

[Undercover Cop]

@powerslide

5 acres is alot of land, you should be able to spread em out well enough, and the chances are slim, but remember that will be alot of ground to cover to water/feed etc. But most important, if its on your land it only takes ONE plant to be spotted, then their dog gets to run around and find the other plants at their leisure once they have the warrant. If they can spot it from the air, its in plain sight and they dont need a warrant to drop down and confirm their findings, then seeing it is all the probable cause they need to set foot on your land and seize it, then they'll hang on with you on your front porch and keep you at bay for an hour until they have the warrant to go find the rest. It might be better to grow in a remote green house on your property. They'd have to have proof of what was growing inside it before searching (if the glass is opaque and they can't ID the foliage directly throgh the top that is, there are opaque plastic sheets/panels that allow light to pass through) Then if they do a knock-and-talk, just tell em its tomatoes and veggies. They'd have to stake you out and prove that you're growing, like doing undercover buys and what not... dont sell out of your house and you'd be ok.
My state just passed Medical, but has no idea how to implement it... Im just trying to be self sufficient without having to support the cartels... brick weed with a slight essense of gasoline gets old quick.
Unless you're a LARGE commercial grow that is supplying dispensaries or the streets on a large scale, if you're in a legal state you should be ok. The feds wont bother spending time/money/manhours building a case against someone who may turn out to be a medical patient that would get sympathy in court. They'll go for those that are making LOTS of money, cuz they're not getting their cut (TAXES). They wont waste their time building a possible case when there are sooo many confirmed dispensaries that they know of that they havent shut down, that are being supplied from somewhere. They could bust you and find that you're state certified caregiver and the case could fall apart in court (yes it would be technically illegal in their jurisdiciton but the jury may be swayed by sympathy for your position as a caregiver) They wont pursue a case unless it would be a slam dunk, with state cooperation.



View attachment 1939405

 

[mountaingarden]

Great info guys one of the better discussions i have had on here appreciate all the responses. i have a question. Are most of you in states where this is legal? I feel like states that it is legal would have a bigger worry about choppers busting them. anyone care to agree or disagree and ellaborate? My plan is to do 5-10 plants spread out over 5acres. would this be easy to spot w/ the technology we are talking about or would they have to all be grouped together to be noticable?

I think you made a typo? In states where it's legal, virtually no worries about choppers if you stay within your legal plant limit. If you're legal in a legal state, your biggest worry is being ripped off, not somebody checking your card.

Spreading your plants out over 5 acres creates a lot of work for you. Undercover Cop is right. A hoop house or Costco frame greenhouse would be much easier. I will be doing one next year because of all the private aircraft traffic made me so paranoid last year, but it also will really extend the growing season.

Good luck!

 

[potpimp]

What is everyone's ideal parking arrangement?

Park at least 1/2 mile from where you're going to grow and preferably not always in the same spot or with the same vehicle. Take a bike sometimes, maybe stash it, drive your car and ride the bike a couple of miles, maybe put on a pair of those gay bicyclists shorts and jersey and have some cammies in a pack or stashed in a garbage bag..

 

[*BUDS]

they show up on FLiR cams....read up on it

Thats true bro but its outdoor for the plants sig, and indoor for the light's sig. They cant get a reading on the plant's heat inside 4 walls and a roof but can see the heat off the 1000w+ hid.

 

[*BUDS]

Park at least 1/2 mile from where you're going to grow and preferably not always in the same spot or with the same vehicle. Take a bike sometimes, maybe stash it, drive your car and ride the bike a couple of miles, maybe put on a pair of those gay bicyclists shorts and jersey and have some cammies in a pack or stashed in a garbage bag..

Good advice.Also only work at dawn i find after 3pm is high risk ,make sure car cant be seen from main track, if the missus can drop you off and pick you up then thats even better, and i hate mountainbike riders i see their tracks everywhere .

 

[Undercover Cop]

Thats true bro but its outdoor for the plants sig, and indoor for the light's sig. They cant get a reading on the plant's heat inside 4 walls and a roof but can see the heat off the 1000w+ hid.

They wont see the PLANTS heat no matter what they try, cuz plants dont create their own heat. If the air surrounding them is rapidly changing temp, they may be a few degrees different as they slowly adjust (they contain alot of water which will take abit longer to equal out to their surrounding air temps) but the surrounding vegetation would have the same issues (albeit slightly different rates between trees/bushes/grasses etc..) Thats not what they would look for. They look at the vegetation during the day time sunlight using filters that allow freq's in the 700-1000nm range to pass which cannabis reflects more than other plants, which causes it to stand out against other plants when veiwed using these cam filter.

They wont see the 1000w+ HID through 4 walls and a roof unless A) you live in a trailer and have very thin walls w/ no insulation, or B) are not lightproof/sealed.

What they will see, only if they have a warrant, which they were able to obtain because they already have evidence against you... is the heat escaping from your exhaust vent or windows or attic etc. The "hotspots" are viewable using thermal imaging and cannot be used as direct evidence, only supplemental. Why would someone have one window in their house that registers +20deg higher than other windows in a house. There could be LOTS of reasons, but if they already know you grow in a certain room, and that room has hot air pumping out the windows or an unusual vent out the side of the house that is no-where near the laundry room, then that just adds to their case and probable cause before they bust in.

remember, FLIR does not register heat, only Infrared light invisible to the human eye. Thermal Imaging is what is used to register heat signatures (can show a black and white or full color-like Predator- image depending on the unit) Technology similar to FLIR is used to locate plots during the daytime, because its the infrared wavelengths that cannabis reflects.

 

[puffnopassing]

I was in the armed Airforce service for 16 years And I worked with a few nice little instruments. A FLiR Camera can detect plant heat signatures as Dizzle Frost said. HOWEVER.... There is only 5 levels of heat signatures designated for plants. A neutral, A positive, A negative, B positive and B negative. Marijuana can show A positive A neutral and A negative. CHoppers do NOT use the FLiR camera because almost 80% of all living plants on the face of the earth show the exact same signatures as your average pot plant. Raspberrys, fireweed, every single plant with a stem and spindly leaves will read the exact same signature as pot, however.... here is where they can use their nifty difty little flir camera, IF you plant your crop in a forest containing pine trees (B negative) without any other vegitation, the camera will show a mass amount of A signature radiating from the marijuana plants surrounded by a large amount of B negative. Im not saying that any choppers will use these Flir Cameras, 1 because they are hella expensive and 2. its much easier to just spot with the naked eye a pot field in a Pine tree forest

 

[mountaingarden]

Here's some food for thought... Google Earth. At a Christmas gathering, we were looking at a new laptop and zooming in on our homes. Came my turn, it's a crystal clear shot taken last August, when I had the forest of green on my deck. And that's the shot people will see when they google my address until the next update. Couldn't believe my eyes!!!!

roflmao...but...This would be a lot less funny if I wasn't a self employed legal patient in a legal state.

 

[Undercover Cop]

Here's some food for thought... Google Earth. At a Christmas gathering, we were looking at a new laptop and zooming in on our homes. Came my turn, it's a crystal clear shot taken last August, when I had the forest of green on my deck. And that's the shot people will see when they google my address until the next update. Couldn't believe my eyes!!!!

roflmao...but...This would be a lot less funny if I wasn't a self employed legal patient in a legal state.

Damn! google street view, my car is parked in front of my friend's girlfriend's house... and you can tell from the angle of the sun that it was early in the morning... Im just waiting to hear what he says when he finally decides to check out his gf's house on the google lol

 

[Ringsixty]

In Hawaii...they have a program called Green Harvest. The choppers fly around in the mountain sides looking for plants @ night. I has been reported they do give off a signature.

Once, located...it will be gone.