Why should I respect your beliefs?

[Padawanbater2]

If I believe your beliefs, when practiced in the real world, are dangerous?

 

[Kaendar]

This is a bait thread and im running as fast as possible in the opposite direction. Im sure CWE will be here soon enuf tho..

 

[Zaehet Strife]

I don't think i understand.

 

[Chief Walkin Eagle]

This is a bait thread and im running as fast as possible in the opposite direction. Im sure CWE will be here soon enuf tho..

Dont forget to bring your bible! (Towley voice)

 

[Kaendar]

I will say one thing tho. You dont have to respect the belief, but you do have to respect the persons right to believe. Which means you cant prejudice their reason for believing at all.

 

[cannabineer]

I don't believe this. cn

 

[Hepheastus420]

Depends on who's beliefs you're following. If you voice kaendar's beliefs, you'll surely catch a swift kick in the ass. In that case, yes, it's dangerous.

 

[Cut.Throat.]

I will say one thing tho. You dont have to respect the belief, but you do have to respect the persons right to believe. Which means you cant prejudice their reason for believing at all.

So you respect the KKK's right to believe that black people are inferior?

 

[Kaendar]

Exceptions to the rule: Satanism, or any type of pagan worship that can endanger others health, any type of racist teachings, and also any cult (ya know, the lets all kill ourselves type, not Jehovahs witness or Scientology types).

 

[Padawanbater2]

I will say one thing tho. You dont have to respect the belief, but you do have to respect the persons right to believe. Which means you cant prejudice their reason for believing at all.

This isn't a bait thread, don't assume everything.

That's an honest question, and I'm trying to make a point. Beliefs shouldn't be respected just because somebody believes them. Do you agree, or disagree with that?

What makes a belief respectable, to you?


I can respect a person only so far as their beliefs carry them. Why would I respect a person if they believed that euthanizing the homeless was the right thing to do? Or that a person was less of a person because of the color of their skin?

Forgive me if you find this kind of conversation offensive..

 

[Chief Walkin Eagle]

Exceptions to the rule: Satanism, or any type of pagan worship that can endanger others health, any type of racist teachings, and also any cult (ya know, the lets all kill ourselves type, not Jehovahs witness or Scientology types).

Even in Satanism there is some truth! Everyone is their own god, or everyone is a god... Thats about all I know about Satanism besides some freaky sacrifices and stuff.

 

[Cut.Throat.]

Exceptions to the rule: Satanism, or any type of pagan worship that can endanger others health, any type of racist teachings, and also any cult (ya know, the lets all kill ourselves type, not Jehovahs witness or Scientology types).

Why does it have to be pagan worship? Endangering others health is ok if it's only one god?

 

[Heisenberg]

What do you mean by respect? I am not sure how you can respect a belief you do not believe in, even if it is non-harmful. The respect assigned to a belief comes from the answers or direction it provides, and rarely do people who's beliefs provide solid answers plead for respect. When people ask for respect, the respect they are demanding is respect for freedom of speech, respect for standards of conduct, respect for a person right not to have their own thoughts controlled. The only valid request for respect for a particular belief must be accompanied by solid information, knowledge or perspective.

 

[Padawanbater2]

Furthermore, I'd take it as far as arguing that respecting beliefs for the sake of... what, not being offensive? has actually harmed people.

That idea is just silly, when you actually think about it.

I think people should be called out on the stupid things they believe, this includes me! Why is it OK for people to believe things that aren't true? That we know aren't true?

[youtube]UkrkaH_V7fE[/youtube]

Believe it or not, ^^^ hurts people.

"is the world flat?... Idk Whoopie... I've never thought about it..."

Are. You. Serious?


Honest question, do you think people should be called out on beliefs like that? Should I respect that belief because that woman believes it?

I'm not saying stand up and call the woman an idiot, that's pretty mean, it would publicly humiliate her, why would I get any kind of pleasure in doing that? That isn't the goal. The goal is to have people understand that reality isn't something you can argue with, you don't get to pick and choose what's real and what's fake..

 

[Padawanbater2]

What do you mean by respect? I am not sure how you can respect a belief you do not believe in, even if it is non-harmful. The respect assigned to a belief comes from the answers or direction it provides, and rarely do people who's beliefs provide solid answers plead for respect. When people ask for respect, the respect they are demanding is respect for freedom of speech, respect for standards of conduct, respect for a person right not to have their own thoughts controlled. The only valid request for respect for a particular belief must be accompanied by solid information, knowledge or perspective.

Ah, so are you saying if you don't accept a belief as true, you can't/aren't under any obligation to respect it?

 

[Padawanbater2]

Even in Satanism there is some truth! Everyone is their own god, or everyone is a god... Thats about all I know about Satanism besides some freaky sacrifices and stuff.

I'm sure there's truth to every single religion, even Scientology.

But just because something has an element of truth to it doesn't mean it's true, right?

 

[Heisenberg]

Ah, so are you saying if you don't accept a belief as true, you can't/aren't under any obligation to respect it?

Exactly, though as you point out, it does not give us the right to silence beliefs, or demand they be abandoned. We allow people like Oprah to voice her beliefs because we respect free speech, and by that very same standard we must allow people who criticize Oprah to have a voice as well, nothing disrespectful about it. Spreading beliefs like most of the ones she does is demonstrably wrong, but we have ample tools to deal with that besides controlling her speech, and respecting her rights or the standards of conduct should not interfere with those tools at all.

 

[Padawanbater2]

Exactly, though as you point out, it does not give us the right to silence beliefs, or demand they be abandoned. We allow people like Oprah to voice her beliefs because we respect free speech, and by that very same standard we must allow people who criticize Oprah to have a voice as well, nothing disrespectful about it. Spreading beliefs like most of the ones she does is demonstrably wrong, but we have ample tools to deal with that besides controlling her speech, and respecting her rights or the standards of conduct should not interfere with those tools at all.

OK, I get what you're saying. She can have all the silly beliefs she wants, that's America, free speech, something I don't disagree with. But we should also have equal free speech to disagree, and voice our disagreement (any way we see fit?) accordingly. How far does this extend? Do you think I have the right to publicly say something like "She's [the woman saying she doesn't know if the world is round or flat..] an IDIOT!" (even though that's not what I would personally say, just an example)?

Do I have the right to my free speech, even though it may offend people who disagree with what I have to say?

 

[Kaendar]

This isn't a bait thread, don't assume everything.

That's an honest question, and I'm trying to make a point. Beliefs shouldn't be respected just because somebody believes them. Do you agree, or disagree with that?

What makes a belief respectable, to you?


I can respect a person only so far as their beliefs carry them. Why would I respect a person if they believed that euthanizing the homeless was the right thing to do? Or that a person was less of a person because of the color of their skin?

Forgive me if you find this kind of conversation offensive..

Ok you have a point. I assumed this was just gonna be another atheist propoganda thread. Well not all beliefs should be respected. Refer to my exceptions post.

 

[Heisenberg]

OK, I get what you're saying. She can have all the silly beliefs she wants, that's America, free speech, something I don't disagree with. But we should also have equal free speech to disagree, and voice our disagreement (any way we see fit?) accordingly. How far does this extend? Do you think I have the right to publicly say something like "She's [the woman saying she doesn't know if the world is round or flat..] an IDIOT!" (even though that's not what I would personally say, just an example)?

You have the right to say she is an idiot if you then support the right for people to backlash. That backlash might include criticism of your conduct, but something like that is a choice of expression, and therefore okay. Again even if you clean up your expression, to say something like "the woman is not with reality", you are still bowing to the pressure to respect conduct, and not the belief. How far does it extend? It extends as far as words allow. It stops at actions, which includes inciting action.

Do I have the right to my free speech, even though it may offend people who disagree with what I have to say?

That is the very idea behind free speech, because there is no one standard for what is offensive. Everything you do and everything you say offends someone somewhere. Any clothing you put on will be objectionable to someone, and if you take them all off you are offending people too. The only way we could guarantee no one offended anyone else is if we made everyone stay inside and never talk or look at one another.