List of Flip Flops from Romney

Dr Kynes

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
ChesusRice said:
I finally found the black guy with the toungue out

So that's 2 i have seen in a crowd of thousands

Just Like a RNC convention
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funny my old euyes spotted 5 blacks, at least two chicanos and an asian.

that image contains maybe 100 people at most, not thousands and since blacks make up 11% of the population and i can only make out about 60 people clearly enough to wager on their race, they are actually over-represented.

chicanos are under-represented in that image, but many chicanos look enough like honkeys to pass, so some of them may be sliding under my radar. i only got a dead cert on ONE asiann, and since asians are around 6% of the population (like homosexuals) the asians are right on point. he's holding it down for the east like a pro.

the guido and douche content of that image is startlingly high though. where is that crowd? a personal apperance by snooki? the opening of a new aeropostale outlet in cherry hill?

next time somebody posts a crowd shot gif, it better be from the source awards or the BET vision awards. otherwise it's racist.
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Carne Seca said:
Oh fucking NO we don't.

http://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/2011/11/07/what-do-mormons-believe-about-african-americans/

http://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/2012/10/15/what-do-mormons-believe-about-african-americans-election-year-update/

http://www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/racial-remarks-in-washington-post-article
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Proposed scriptural basisThe Church leadership began using the newly canonized Pearl of Great Price, which has the following verse:
Pharaoh, being a righteous man, established his kingdom and judged his people wisely and justly all his days, seeking earnestly to imitate that order established by the fathers in the first generations, in the days of the first patriarchal reign, even in the reign of Adam, and also of Noah, his father, who blessed him with the blessing of the earth, and with the blessing of wisdom, but cursed him as pertaining the priesthood. Now, Pharaoh being of that lineage by which he could not have the right of the priesthood, notwithstanding the Pharaohs would fain claim it from Noah, through Ham, therefore my father was led away by their idolatry. (Abraham 1:26-27, emphasis added)
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C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Influence of Brigham YoungAn early statement by Young about a priesthood ban in the LDS Church was made on February 13, 1849. The statement — which refers to the Curse of Cain as the reason for the policy — was given in response to the question, "What chance is there for the redemption of the Negro?" Young responded, "The Lord had cursed Cain's seed with blackness and prohibited them the Priesthood."[SUP][1][/SUP]
In 1852, while addressing the Utah Territorial Legislature, Young stated, "Any man having one drop of the seed of [Cain] ... in him cannot hold the Priesthood and if no other Prophet ever spoke it before I will say it now in the name of Jesus Christ I know it is true and others know it."[SUP][1][/SUP]
When asked "if the spirits of Negroes were neutral in Heaven," Young responded, "No, they were not, there were no neutral [spirits] in Heaven at the time of the rebellion, all took sides …. All spirits are pure that came from the presence of God."[SUP][2][/SUP] Learning about Enoch Lewis's marriage to a woman of European descent (December 1847) and subsequently enacting a ban on Negroes in the priesthood, he considered Walker Lewis "one of the best Elders."[SUP][3][/SUP]
On another occasion, Young said, "You see some classes of the human family that are black, uncouth, uncomely, disagreeable and low in their habits, wild, and seemingly deprived of nearly all the blessings of the intelligence that is generally bestowed upon mankind …. Cain slew his brother. Cain might have been killed, and that would have put a termination to that line of human beings. This was not to be, and the Lord put a mark upon him, which is the flat nose and black skin. Trace mankind down to after the flood, and then another curse is pronounced upon the same race—that they should be the ‘servant of servants’; and they will be, until that curse is removed; and the Abolitionists cannot help it, nor in the least alter that decree."[SUP][4][/SUP]
Brigham Young said this despite the LDS scripture verses that state people may be cursed unto the 3rd and 4th generation, but if any were to repent and make restitution they would be forgiven and the curse lifted.[SUP][5][/SUP] This is reiterated in D&C 124:50&52 as well as Mosiah 13:13,14 and Deut 5:9,10.
Under John Taylor's presidency, there was confusion regarding the origin of the racial policy. Elijah Abel was living, breathing proof that an African American was ordained to the Priesthood in the days of Joseph Smith. At least two of Abel's descendants — his son Enoch and Enoch's son Elijah — were ordained to the priesthood, in 1900 and 1935, respectively.[SUP][6][/SUP] Joseph Fielding Smith said that Abel's Priesthood had been declared null and void by Joseph Smith himself, though this seems to conflict with Joseph F. Smith's teachings that the Priesthood could not be removed from any man without removing that man from the church.[SUP][7][/SUP] From this point on Joseph Smith was repeatedly referred to as the author of many statements, which had actually been made by Brigham Young, on the subject of Priesthood restriction.[SUP][7][/SUP]
 
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ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
[SUP]Relation to "curse of Cain" and/or "curse of Ham"
Some members of the church used the curse of Cain to justify the racial restriction policy. In the book of Genesis,[SUP][28][/SUP] God puts a mark on Cain after he kills his brother Abel. Church leader Bruce R. McConkie wrote in his 1966 edition of Mormon Doctrine:
Of the two-thirds who followed Christ, however, some were more valiant than others ....Those who were less valiant in pre-existence and who thereby had certain spiritual restrictions imposed upon them during mortality are known to us as the negroes. Such spirits are sent to earth through the lineage of Cain, the mark put upon him for his rebellion against God and his murder of Abel being a black skin (Moses 5:16-41; 12:22). Noah's son Ham married Egyptus, a descendant of Cain, thus preserving the negro lineage through the flood (Abraham 1:20-27). Negroes in this life are denied the priesthood; under no circumstances can they hold this delegation of authority from the Almighty. (Abra. 1:20-27.) The gospel message of salvation is not carried affirmatively to them (Moses 7:8, 12, 22), although sometimes negroes search out the truth, join the Church, and become by righteous living heirs of the celestial kingdom of heaven. President Brigham Young and others have taught that in the future eternity worthy and qualified negroes will receive the priesthood and every gospel blessing available to any man. The present status of the negro rests purely and simply on the foundation of pre-existence. Along with all races and peoples he is receiving here what he merits as a result of the long pre-mortal probation in the presence of the Lord....The negroes are not equal with other races where the receipt of certain spiritual blessings are concerned, particularly the priesthood and the temple blessings that flow therefrom, but this inequality is not of man's origin. It is the Lord's doing.[SUP][29][/SUP]
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In 1881, church president John Taylor said "And after the flood we are told that the curse that had been pronounced upon Cain was continued through Ham's wife, as he had married a wife of that seed. And why did it pass through the flood? Because it was necessary that the devil should have a representation upon the earth as well as God; and that man should be a free agent to act for himself, and that all men might have the opportunity of receiving or rejecting the truth, and be governed by it or not according to their wishes and abide the result; and that those who would be able to maintain correct principles under all circumstances, might be able to associate with the Gods in the eternal worlds." (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 22 page 304).
Black journalist and church member Darius Aidan Gray, in 2007, commented "I think the most damning statement came from one of the presidents of the church, the third president of the church, John Taylor. Basically, he said that the reason that black people had been allowed to come through the flood, the flood of Noah, was so that Satan would have representation upon the earth, that black folks were here to represent Satan and to have a balance against white folks, who were here to represent Jesus Christ, the savior. How do you damn a people more than to say that their existence upon the earth is to represent Satan?"[SUP][30][/SUP][SUP][31][/SUP]
LDS scholar W. John Walsh disagrees. He reads the quote as saying the devil must have a representation so that all men, including black people, may have ability to choose to receive or reject the truth, not that black people were that representation.[SUP][/SUP]
[/SUP]
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
The "Negro Question" DeclarationIn 1949, the First Presidency under the direction of George Albert Smith made a declaration which included the statement that the priesthood restriction was divinely commanded and not a matter of church policy.[SUP][36][/SUP] It stated:
The attitude of the Church with reference to the Negroes remains as it has always stood. It is not a matter of the declaration of a policy but of direct commandment from the Lord, on which is founded the doctrine of the Church from the days of its organization, to the effect that Negroes may become members of the Church but that they are not entitled to the Priesthood at the present time. The prophets of the Lord have made several statements as to the operation of the principle. President Brigham Young said: "Why are so many of the inhabitants of the earth cursed with a skin of blackness? It comes in consequence of their fathers rejecting the power of the holy priesthood, and the law of God. They will go down to death. And when all the rest of the children have received their blessings in the holy priesthood, then that curse will be removed from the seed of Cain, and they will then come up and possess the priesthood, and receive all the blessings which we now are entitled to."
​
The declaration goes on to state that the conditions in which people are born are affected by their conduct in a premortal existence, although the details of the principle are said not to be known. It then says that the privilege of mortal existence is so great that spirits were willing to come to earth even though they would not be able to possess the priesthood. It concludes by stating, "Under this principle there is no injustice whatsoever involved in this deprivation as to the holding of the priesthood by the Negroes." [SUP][37][/SUP]
 
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ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Belief that pre-1978 church was not ready for black priestsSince the Revelation on the Priesthood in 1978, the church has made no distinctions in policy for black people, but it remains an issue for many black members of the church. Alvin Jackson, a black Bishop, puts his focus on "moving forward rather than looking back."[SUP][48][/SUP] In an interview with Mormon Century, Jason Smith expresses his viewpoint that the membership of the church was not ready for black people to have the Priesthood at the time of the Restoration, because of prejudice and slavery. He draws analogies to the Bible where only the Israelites have the gospel.[SUP][49][/SUP] Officially the church also uses Biblical history to justify the prior ban:
Ever since biblical times, the Lord has designated through His prophets who could receive the priesthood and other blessings of the gospel. Among the tribes of Israel, for example, only men of the tribe of Levi were given the priesthood and allowed to officiate in certain ordinances. Likewise, during the Savior's earthly ministry, gospel blessings were restricted to the Jews. Only after a revelation to the Apostle Peter were the gospel and priesthood extended to others (see Acts 10:1–33; 14:23; 15:6–8).[SUP][50][/SUP]
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Doctrines about black people in Mormon fundamentalismIn 2005, the Intelligence Report published the following statements made by Warren Jeffs, President of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints:

  • "The black race is the people through which the devil has always been able to bring evil unto the earth."
  • "[Cain was] cursed with a black skin and he is the father of the Negro people. He has great power, can appear and disappear. He is used by the devil, as a mortal man, to do great evils."
  • "Today you can see a black man with a white woman, et cetera. A great evil has happened on this land because the devil knows that if all the people have Negro blood, there will be nobody worthy to have the priesthood."
  • "If you marry a person who has connections with a Negro, you would become cursed."[SUP][56][/SUP]
 
C

ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Doctrines about black people in Mormon fundamentalismIn 2005, the Intelligence Report published the following statements made by Warren Jeffs, President of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints:

  • "The black race is the people through which the devil has always been able to bring evil unto the earth."
  • "[Cain was] cursed with a black skin and he is the father of the Negro people. He has great power, can appear and disappear. He is used by the devil, as a mortal man, to do great evils."
  • "Today you can see a black man with a white woman, et cetera. A great evil has happened on this land because the devil knows that if all the people have Negro blood, there will be nobody worthy to have the priesthood."
  • "If you marry a person who has connections with a Negro, you would become cursed."[SUP][56][/SUP]
[h=2][/h]
 
Carne Seca

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
ChesusRice said:
Doctrines about black people in Mormon fundamentalismIn 2005, the Intelligence Report published the following statements made by Warren Jeffs, President of the Fundamentalist Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints:

  • "The black race is the people through which the devil has always been able to bring evil unto the earth."
  • "[Cain was] cursed with a black skin and he is the father of the Negro people. He has great power, can appear and disappear. He is used by the devil, as a mortal man, to do great evils."
  • "Today you can see a black man with a white woman, et cetera. A great evil has happened on this land because the devil knows that if all the people have Negro blood, there will be nobody worthy to have the priesthood."
  • "If you marry a person who has connections with a Negro, you would become cursed."[SUP][56][/SUP]
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As I stated in the other thread. The FLDS has no affiliation with the LDS church and consists of excommunicated members who were kicked out because of their views and actions. I've lost all respect for you.
 
Carne Seca

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
Since were trotting out racist policies. Let's take a gander at Baptist past policies:

[h=3]Formation and alienation of black Baptists[/h]African Americans had gathered in their own churches early on, in 1774 in Petersburg, Virginia[SUP][29][/SUP] and in Savannah, Georgia in 1788.[SUP][30][/SUP] Some were established after 1800 on the frontier, such as the First African Baptist Church of Lexington, Kentucky. In 1824, it was accepted by the Elkhorn Association of Kentucky, which was white-dominated. By 1850 First African had 1,820 members, the largest of any Baptist church in the state.[SUP][31][/SUP] In 1861 it had 2,223 members.[SUP][32][/SUP]
Generally whites in the South required that black churches be under the supervision of white ministers and associations. In practice, as noted above, in churches with mixed congregations, blacks were made to sit in segregated seating, and white preaching supported Biblical interpretations that slaves should accept their places and try to behave well toward their masters.
After the Civil War and emancipation, blacks wanted to practice their form of American Christianity away from racial discrimination and attempts by whites at control. They had interpreted the Bible as offering hope for deliverance, for their own Exodus out of slavery. They quickly left white-dominated churches and associations. In the late 1860s, they rapidly set up several separate state Baptist conventions. In 1866, black Baptists of the South and West combined to form the Consolidated American Baptist Convention. In 1895 they merged three national conventions to create the National Baptist Convention, USA, Inc..[SUP][33][/SUP] With 8 million members, it is the largest African-American religious organization and is second in size to the Southern Baptist Convention.
Free blacks in the North had founded churches and denominations in the early nineteenth century that were independent of white-dominated organizations. In the Reconstruction Era, missionaries both black and white from several northern denominations worked in the South; they quickly attracted tens and hundreds of thousands of new members from among the millions offreedmen. The African Methodist Episcopal Church attracted the most new members of any denomination.[SUP][33][/SUP] White Southern Baptist churches lost black members to the new denominations, as well as to independent congregations organized by freedmen.
After Reconstruction, SBC members were among the southern legislators who voted for disfranchising laws and constitutions that, by the turn of the twentieth century, essentially eliminated blacks as voters, reducing them to second-class status. They also had passed Jim Crow laws establishing racial segregation. During the following half century, into the 1960s and the Civil Rights era, most Southern Baptist pastors and most members of their flocks rejected integration and defended white supremacy, further alienating African Americans
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Carne Seca

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
How about the Lutheran Church?

This is in 1974:

[h=1]Racism in the Church[/h][h=4]A Statement of The American Lutheran Church, 1974[/h]
(A statement of the Seventh General Convention of The American Lutheran Church, adopted October 14, 1974, paragraphs 1-6 by action GC74.14.105 as comment and counsel to the members of the congregations of The American Lutheran Church to aid them in their decisions and actions, paragraphs 7-10 by action GC74.14.106 as the policy and practice of this church.)
1. Racism is one of the most destructive sins in today's world. It refuses to honor God's mighty acts in creation, redemption, and sanctification. Racism simply does not trust the gospel. It builds on human pride and prejudice, abusing power for selfish advantage. Racism dishonors God, neighbor, and self. It rejects the meaning in God's becoming incarnate in Jesus Christ, because in rejecting another person one rejects Jesus Christ.
2. The sin of racism expresses itself in many ways in American culture. White persons individually, and their institutions, are racist. Their attitudes and their behavior betray their racism. Perhaps their racism is harsh and blatant; perhaps it is patronizing or perfumed in euphemisms. It may be so open and exposed that no one can miss that racism; it may be so subtle and so covered over that only the victims feel its destructiveness. However it expresses itself, racism denies love for God, neighbor, and for self.
3. Pride in the presumed superiority of members of one race over those of another race provides one foundation for racism. Power exerted by the dominant group through its control of the institutions, systems, resources, and customs of that society enforces its prejudices and reinforces the structures of racism. Members of the subordinate group are assumed to have neither the full humanity, the wisdom, nor the good judgment to make decisions affecting their lives. It is assumed that important decisions must be made for them, not by them. Their dependency grows as their freedom and responsibility are denied. Racism destroys the dignity, the integrity, and the positive self-image of human beings created in the image of the living God. Racism spawns fear, guilt, frustration, hostility, and violence.
4. America's racism is white racism. Whites feel superior to black, brown, red, or yellow persons. Whites use every channel of power to enforce and to reinforce their prejudices and to maintain their dominance over nonwhites. The American Lutheran Church is shot through with America's white racism. The image it conveys is that of a white church in a white society, a church fearful of entrusting nonwhite persons with leadership and policy-making powers, authority, and responsibility. Its congregations often refuse to continue their ministry to a community undergoing racial transition.
5. In its own self-interest The American Lutheran Church must wake up to and correct its white racism. Black, brown, red, or yellow persons may not need The American Lutheran Church. The American Lutheran Church, however, needs nonwhite persons within its membership and its leadership. It needs all people, to give public witness to the sincerity of its commitment to its mission, its Lord, and His ministry. It needs all kinds of people, to keep its members human, sensitive, open to repentance, and open to the gospel. People see in the world a struggle between "conscienceless power and powerless conscience." The American Lutheran Church can show that power and conscience can be integrated to the glory of God and the advancement of love, justice, and mercy for all human beings.
6. In the past Americans assumed the rightness of segregation-of separate but equal facilities, reservations, restrictive covenants, and limited opportunities for separate development by members of the subordinate racial groups in their own ethnic communities. Later, integration became the legal key word. In its practical effects, however, integration meant that nonwhite persons were expected to take on the values, goals, life styles, and culture of the dominant whites. This, too, was a denial of the humanity of black, brown, red, or yellow persons who took pride in their own ethnic identity and integrity. Now, in response to the gospel, the emphasis must shift. The gospel requires us to recognize and rejoice in the diversity and variety of experiences among human beings; it requires us to respect the integrity and aspirations of black, brown, red, and yellow people as persons and as members of an honored ethnic group; it requires us to foster the development of the members of each race in association with and in mutual dependence on members of other races. Therefore it behooves the church, above all institutions, to incorporate into the entire fabric of its life this variety and diversity, this respect for integrity and aspirations, this development of mutual helpfulness and mutual dependence.
7. The American Lutheran Church is aware that the time for study and for statements on racism largely has passed. The time for action is at hand. It therefore requests the general president, as the spiritual leader of this church, the symbol of its hopes and unity, and its chief executive officer, to give his continuing personal endorsement, leadership, and commitment to the elimination of white racism from The American Lutheran Church. It requests all entities of this church to address themselves in depth to the question, "How can we be and become what we are?"; redeemed children of God, able with His power to trust the gospel, to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, and to show our faith in "good works which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them" (Eph. 2:10).
8. The American Lutheran Church, as a human organization comprising sinful people, needs to repent of its complicity in the sin of white racism. It needs to see that many of its racist myths and stereotypes are part and parcel also of its sexist myths and stereotypes. White males do not relish challenges to their power and supremacy either from females or from nonwhite males. In any depth discussion of its racist attitudes and behavior The American Lutheran Church also must explore its understanding of female/male roles and relationships, dominance and submissiveness, as mandated by the 1972 General Convention action on Women and Men in Church and Society.
9. The American Lutheran Church should explore earnestly, in depth of honesty and courage, how it can make amends to its nonwhite brothers and sisters for the exploitation, injustice, and dehumanization they have suffered under its white racism. It needs to come up with something fresh, new, and creative by which it corporately and symbolically can express its repentance. It needs practical avenues for channeling the fruits of its repentance. The Father graciously offers his reconciliation; one reconciled with the Father seeks therefore to be reconciled with fellow human beings. Such reconciliation means living in mutual repentance, mutual forgiveness, often in disagreement, certainly in divergence. Such reconciliation means recognizing and accepting divergencies, differences, even disagreements. Out of mutual trust in the gospel, and the mutual commitment of changed lives, reconciliation will mobilize and channel distinctive gifts and resources into the total mission and ministry of the church.
10. In the present climate of white racism in America, The American Lutheran Church has an opportunity for leadership. It can let its feathers grow, unfetter its wings, and fly where needed to do battle with the demonic forces that perpetuate racism. Risks are great. The powers of the demonic do not repel, but rather attract the oppressors who thrive on racism. Yet, an understanding of "liberation theology" frees us for the fray. We ask, not "what will it cost" but "will it communicate the gospel?" Remembering our Lord's experience in the temple, after he read from the prophet Isaiah (Luke 4:16-30), we have the answer of faith that dares the impossible possibility.
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Carne Seca

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
Catholics anyone?


NEW ORLEANS, La. (Catholic Online) – Racism is present in the hearts of some Catholics and institutionally in the Catholic Church which the faithful must work to purge in thought and in action, said a U.S. archbishop in a comprehensive pastoral letter.
In the document, “’Made in the Image and Likeness of God’: A Pastoral Letter on Racial Harmony,” released Dec. 15, New Orleans Archbishop Alfred C. Hughes begged forgiveness for acts the church committed that were racially insensitive or did not promote racial harmony, and committed the church to action.
The pastoral was made available in its entirety in the Dec. 16 issue of the Clarion Herald (www.clarionherald.org).
“I want to express an apology for the way in which I or other members of the church have acted or failed to act,” he said. “I want to acknowledge the past in truth, seek forgiveness and recommit myself and our church in New Orleans to realizing the gospel message in our relations with one another.”
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ChesusRice

Well-Known Member
Calls for official repudiation of past doctrinesIn 1995, black church member A. David Jackson asked church leaders to issue a declaration repudiating past doctrines that treated black people as inferior. In particular, Jackson asked the church to disavow the 1949 "Negro Question" declaration from the church Presidency which stated "The attitude of the church with reference to negroes ... is not a matter of the declaration of a policy but of direct commandment from the Lord ... to the effect that negroes ... are not entitled to the priesthood...".[SUP][51][/SUP]
The church leadership did not issue a repudiation, and so in 1997 Jackson, aided by other church members including Armand Mauss, sent a second request to church leaders, which stated that white Mormons felt that the 1978 revelation resolved everything, but that black Mormons react differently when they learn the details. He said that many black Mormons become discouraged and leave the church or become inactive. "When they find out about this, they exit... You end up with the passive African Americans in the church".[SUP][52][/SUP]
Other black church members think giving an apology would be a "detriment" to church work and a catalyst to further racial misunderstanding. African-American church member Bryan E. Powell says "There is no pleasure in old news, and this news is old." Gladys Newkirk agrees, stating "I've never experienced any problems in this church. I don't need an apology. . . . We're the result of an apology."[SUP][53][/SUP] The large majority of black Mormons say they are willing to look beyond the racist teachings and cleave to the church in part because of its powerful, detailed teachings on life after death.[SUP][54][/SUP]
Hinckley, then church president, told the Los Angeles Times "The 1978 declaration speaks for itself ... I don't see anything further that we need to do". Church leadership did not issue a repudiation.[SUP][51][/SUP] Church apostle Dallin H. Oaks said: "It's not the pattern of the Lord to give reasons. We can put reasons to commandments. When we do we're on our own. Some people put reasons to [the ban] and they turned out to be spectacularly wrong. There is a lesson in that.... The lesson I've drawn from that, I decided a long time ago that I had faith in the command and I had no faith in the reasons that had been suggested for it... I'm referring to reasons given by general authorities and reasons elaborated upon [those reasons] by others. The whole set of reasons seemed to me to be unnecessary risk taking... Let's [not] make the mistake that's been made in the past, here and in other areas, trying to put reasons to revelation. The reasons turn out to be man-made to a great extent. The revelations are what we sustain as the will of the Lord and that's where safety lies."[SUP][55][/SUP]
 
Carne Seca

Carne Seca

Well-Known Member
ChesusRice said:
So when exactly did the catholics deny full membership to the church and call blacks in league with lucifer?
Definatly racist catholics
But as a church when exactly did they do what I am asking?
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When has the LDS church ever denied membership to anyone? You need to get you facts right before you start spewing your bile.
 
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