Timewasmoney1
New Member
back at the '11 cannabis cup they mentioned that. Would be killer to grow some thai stick 
Wasnt GHS going to sell land race beans?
- Thread starter Timewasmoney1
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stoned cockatoo
New Member
landrace x all the church seeds he threw around the place.
cannabis is dead
cannabis is dead
You can get thai from much better breeders. Be ready for a real pain in the ass to grow though.back at the '11 cannabis cup they mentioned that. Would be killer to grow some thai stick
Timewasmoney1
New Member
Through who? Why is it difficult? Alltitude i assume?
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
I personally hate when people bitch about GHS and Arjan making money off his business. If you don't like their genetics don't buy them, but there is no reason to bad mouth people you don't know. GHS has been around for along time and I feel very strongly that they would have gone out of business if they weren't decent breeders. I've done searchs to try to find out why people hate on them so much, and all I ever find is hearsay and conjecture about the company and about Arjan. I wish I could do what he does for a living, growing, and traveling around collecting genetics is literally my dream job, but I'm not gonna hate on him cus he gets to do it.
Now anyway here is some thai that was recommended to be by a friend http://www.aceseeds.org/doublethaistdeng.php. I've grown some 100% sativas, and the biggest key is using some LST and or topping to control the growth so they don't get overgrown on you. If you do it right you can grow some real nice sativas indoors, if you don't you'll have a jungle on your hands.
Now anyway here is some thai that was recommended to be by a friend http://www.aceseeds.org/doublethaistdeng.php. I've grown some 100% sativas, and the biggest key is using some LST and or topping to control the growth so they don't get overgrown on you. If you do it right you can grow some real nice sativas indoors, if you don't you'll have a jungle on your hands.
Jogro
Well-Known Member
There are a lot of reasons GHS gets slagged.
At least of it has to do with the behavior of the owner.
For one thing Arjan Roskam refers to himself as the "King of cannabis", which, at best, "should" be a title given to you by OTHER people, not yourself. That's a little bit of clue into his attitude/mentality. His personal ethics have been widely questioned; reportedly he enjoys a poor reputation locally in Amsterdam for unethical business practices, and the locals see his coffeehouses mostly as tourist traps. As another he's posted what can only be described as an "unprofessional" rant on a competitor on the internet.
I don't need to know him personally to know that this sort of rant is full of BS and highly unprofessional. If he's doing that publically, what is he doing privately? If he really has the better genetics, why does he have to launch this sort of public personal attack?
Another big issue with GHS is that Roskam was caught red-handed bribing judges in the 2003 High Times Cannabis cup, and had two cup wins that year reversed. This was widely reported in the Dutch press at the time. Needless to say, this sort of thing casts a great deal of doubt on his various cup wins after and especially before that point in time. So when one of his big marketing "sticks" is his number of cup wins, you have to sort of roll your eyes.
GHS has a lot of puffery out there on his ceeds and genetics (websites with questionable numbers, coatings of questionable value, etc), but when it comes down to it, by most accounts I've seen from growers I respect, the actual genetics are largely mediocre.
Which isn't to say that none of his lines are good, and to the contrary, he probaby does have a few good ones, just that chances for disappointment are high.
With so many excellent lines out there by respected breeders, I don't see much reason to take chances with those with questionable ethics or genetic quality.
Bigtacofarmer
Well-Known Member
You could have just linked to any of Arjans youtube videos and let him explain it himself. Having payed attention since Shanti was with greenhouse its easy to see why Arjan takes a lot of shit, he's mostly full of it.
I do like watching the strain hunters movies, right up until you see GHS plant grown where only landraced had before. Thats fucked up and no cannabis fan should appreciated him fucking the future possiblities like that. Not to mention I'm sure he got a fat bag of beans before letting his pollen fly. Sound intentional once I type it!
I do like watching the strain hunters movies, right up until you see GHS plant grown where only landraced had before. Thats fucked up and no cannabis fan should appreciated him fucking the future possiblities like that. Not to mention I'm sure he got a fat bag of beans before letting his pollen fly. Sound intentional once I type it!
colocowboy
Well-Known Member
I bought my last bed from the "Mattress King", should I have checked to make sure he was endowed this title by his peers to be assured that he wasn't just another asshole trying to sell beds?
**I don't buy GH, I don't like GH.... I have a problem with GMO and feminized seeds.... lol
**troll away..... lol
jessica d
Well-Known Member
he was a d.bag to shanti "the unspoken king". i got some afghan kush landrace and loving the growth but cant recommend cuz i havent had the chance to smoke it or see the shelf life of the bud. dj short is my thai man cuz u get a good % of thai without the bitch to grow. i have thrown plants in ground first yr and harvest for 2yr without planting watering or any care. no ferts or anything and grape krush was 8ft by 6ft wide.
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
I do appreciate the actual info, I would also like to say I'm not specifically defending him or GHS. I try not to bad mouth anyone, though some of the stories may be true, I still don't think the company would still be around if they were so terrible. That being said, I've never ran any GHS genetics, I got a single seed last year that sadly didn't germ but I wasn't gonna begin to blame that on them it was one seed. I look forward to running some of DJ shorts gear in the future like Jessica mentioned. Right now I have a bunch of Dinafem in my room, and I'm starting to work with some strains from Sincity Seeds. Just got my hands on some pre-release "Sinmint Cookies" GSC (forum cut) x Bluepower, hoping for a nice minty pheno.
ThirstyRoss
Well-Known Member
I don't know both sides of the story but from reading that it sounds like he was attacked first and is trying to set the record straight. *shrugs*
Citation needed!
Questionable coatings? They use this stuff on like, Scott's commercial grass seed that you can buy at Home Depot. That prob means it has some value.
This last part I agree with, there are supposedly quite a few good breeders so why not stick with them first.
Thundercat
Well-Known Member
Well put Ross, I really tend to agree.
Bigtacofarmer
Well-Known Member
Have you ate at McDonalds or drank a Budweiser? Why are they still around?
Greenhouse spends tons on advertising, full page color ads in every pot magazine for years. A few years ago I saw one with Arjan holding up a glass of wine thanking americans for the first 500,000 packs of beans sold that year. Fuck, if he only makes $10 a pack thats still a ton of cash.
Then on to the strain hunting thing. At first glance he seems to be doing something good. He like to buy stuff for the poor villages and then leave them feminized seeds to mistakenly herm out on there 1000 year old strains. Arjan knows damn well that he is potentially fucking up some of the most unique strains on earth. Once a hermie ass GHS strain floats across the right valley many strains will be destroyed from then on. I doubt many of these poor farmers know enough about genetics to be aware of what will be lost. Makes me sick. Strain hunters....... just like poachers! IMO
'ome Grown
Well-Known Member
Anyone notice the fully seeded 'the church' in the strain Hunters India edition? It hermied right next to all the other strains growing there...
Most seed dealers are unethical and scumbags...but arjan really takes 1st prize, and he didn't even need to bribe anyone.
Most seed dealers are unethical and scumbags...but arjan really takes 1st prize, and he didn't even need to bribe anyone.
Jogro
Well-Known Member
Well, I haven't actually watched any of them so I wouldn't know.
IMO, life is really too short to waste time with BS artists and poseurs.
Reputations aren't ALWAYS correct, but they OFTEN are, and in this case, the guy is self-damning. Honestly, the guy might have some of the greatest genetics in the world; I'm never going to know because I'm not doing business with the guy. There are plenty of other established and/or up-and-coming breeders with world-class genetics, I'd rather support.
Even if that were true, he can do that without over the top personal attacks or eye-rolling tall tales. Its not THAT he responded , its HOW. I don't need to know the other "side of the story" (although I actually *DO* know it) to know that his behavior is competely unprofessional and reflects badly on him as a person and businessman.
How Arjan was caught red handed rigging the High Times Cannabis cup in 1999? (sorry, it wasn't '93 as I think I mentioned above). No problem; here's a contemporaneous account from a Dutch 'zine. For obvious reasons, both Roskam and High Times have tried to pretend that this never happened:
Coatings are useful if you're going to broadcast seeds through an automated planter because they can ensure dispensable size and seed uniformity. They can have value in reducing fungal growth with some slow-growing ceeds. With cannabis drug strains? Not unless you're planting a whole field of them!
Even commercial hemp farmers don't use coated ceeds, and that should tell you something.
Jogro
Well-Known Member
OK, here is Shantibaba (aka Scott Blakely, Mr Nice Seeds) side of the story. This is taken from Matt Rize's website; he's a known hash-maker and expert, and actually one of the mods on this board for concentrates. Now, bluntly, this was 20+ years ago, I wasn't there, and I really don't know what happened. Each of the participants in this story have their own "take" on what happened, and the versions don't all agree. But regardless, it seems plain that the "tone" coming from Shantibaba here is totally different than from Roskam:
http://medicalmarijuana.com/experts/expert/title.cfm?artID=78
Define "so terrible". There is definitely worse out there.
To my mind, the fact that they're around speaks mostly to the outfits skill at business, and not to the quality of the actual product at all. As another poster put it, these guys are like the "McDonalds" of cannabis ceeds. If you want something shiny, cheap, and fast, McD will give it to you, but I don't think anyone thinks the food quality there is really the best. For GHS, mostly by dint of being one of the earliest of the big commercial sellers still standing, and lots of money/energy put into marketing, they've got big market presence. That doesn't speak to the quality of the actual genetics AT ALL, many/most of which reportedly are mediocre.
If you buy a pack, the GHS ceeds will germinate, and in most cases, the plants will at least resemble their descriptions somewhat. If you're a fairly inexperienced grower used to smoking schwagg (and bluntly most are), that's probably all you really need.
On High Times cannabis cup wins, sure, Greenhouse has the most of those, but you do have to look a bit closely at what's going on there. Roughly half or more of their wins aren't for actual STRAINS, just things like "best coffeehouse", "best booth", "best product", and a lot of wins for hash (which they don't actually make themselves).
"Best coffeehouse" (and a few other contests) isn't judges by a panel of disinterested/blinded experts; its a pure popular vote where the "judges" are whomever buys a ticket, and for obvious reasons these contests are heavily skewed towards the house with the biggest budget for promotion. In this particular case, the GHS coffeehouse is known to cater to foreign tourists. . .who who comprise most of the HTCC judges! The locals (who you'd think would really have the best sense of the "the best" local houses) see the places as "tourist traps" and won't go in there.
Even assuming bribery isn't at work here (and again, the fact that they were caught one year strongly suggests that they were doing it other years), best IMPORT hash just means that they've got the best connections for good foreign hash and ability to smuggle it in once a year for contests. That says something, I guess, though not necessarily anything about the quality of their own genetics or even what's on the menu in their coffeehouses.
If you look at their strain wins, most are with "old school" Dutch genetics from when Shanti and Neville were still there. In particular, Super Lemon haze has won a lot of cups recently, and from a distance that one looks interesting, though most reports I've seen of people actually growing it from ceed have been disappointing (ie it went hermie and/or product just didn't live up to the hype).
Jogro
Well-Known Member
I think there was a formal High Times video documentary of its 1999 cup produced, though I haven't seen it, and can't answer.
I've seen enough separate reports of Roskam bribing judges in the '99 cup from different sources to believe it actually happened.
There was a different documentary video of this cup in the past few years, where the HT Staff members effectively admitted on tape that some of the cup categories are effectively "for sale" to whomever does the most marketing to visiting "judges", (inevitably Barney's farm and Greenhouse se-eds).