Al-Qaeda, Our Allies

[Harrekin]

yes, i'm certain the video you saw on the internet gives you more intelligence to go on than the guy at the helm of the greatest intelligence network the world has ever known, the one that everyone has just recently discovered they were using to gain intelligence.



you've got it all figured out.

Greatest intelligence network ever?

Bitch please, just cos they can Ctrl-Z and copy/paste all American Internet traffic doesn't mean they're the greatest intelligence agency ever.

Also they were so sure about the whole Iraq thing, weapons ready to strike Europe within 47mins...?

Seriously?

 

[echelon1k1]

you've got nothing but fail today, as usual.

keep telling us about your conspiracy theories, we all want to hear about them.

"there were no American boots on Libyan soil pre-Benghazi"

"regime change is not the goal in Syria, the point is not even to oust assad"

"america has never gassed its own people"

"it is not in support of one faction or the other, it is a retaliatory action against the use of WMDs on one's own people"

 

[kpmarine]

"there were no American boots on Libyan soil pre-Benghazi"

"regime change is not the goal in Syria, the point is not even to oust assad"

"america has never gassed its own people"

"it is not in support of one faction or the other, it is a retaliatory action against the use of WMDs on one's own people"

The US military wasn't deploying it's general troops pre-Benghazi.

The point of the UN strike is supposed to be to prevent further use of chemical weapons; whether that will unseat Assad remains to be seen.

The US has not gassed it's own people in the same way that has occurred in Syria (Though there has been some dumb shit done with complete disregard to human rights in the past.).

For a response to the final quote; see response #2.

 

[schuylaar]

So you support military intervention against a sovereign nation in support of Al Queda?

That's just LOL...

unfortunately, harry, more like fucking world police..must maintain order at the children's table, yet again!

 

[kpmarine]

unfortunately, harry, more like fucking world police..must maintain order at the children's table, yet again!

God forbid we support preventing wholesale slaughter of people who aren't residents of out nation. Goodness knows the UN isn't backing this initiative or anything...

 

[ricky1lung]

God forbid we support preventing wholesale slaughter of people who aren't residents of out nation. Goodness knows the UN isn't backing this initiative or anything...

Not yet their not.

The U.N. Security Council’s five permanent members ended a meeting Wednesday fiercely divided over a British-proposed resolution to authorize the use of military force to punish Syria for its alleged use of chemical weapons, with Russia and China firmly opposed.
A tension-filled meeting ended with no indication of whether the resolution would ever be put to a Security Council vote. U.S. officials in Washington and the United Nations indicated the resolution appeared doomed, and any action against Syria would have to occur without the backing of the Security Council.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/un-security-council-deadlocked-over-syria/article14016547/

Russia has also moved a couple warships into the area.

 

[heckler73]

I was under the impression that targets would be military complexes that house chemical weapons; not factories that produce children's formula.

It's good to be optimistic, I suppose.
Of course, when the goal is more opaque or obfuscated, then these things have a way of bungling themselves up...conveniently.

As far as "Bathtub chemistry sets" go; can you demonstrate some documented instances of people making air-droppable or artillery deployable nerve gas agents in their home? This is not as simple as taping a bunch of shrapnel to a homemade bomb.

No... I can't say I can demonstrate someone making air-droppable nerve gas agents...
But if you would care to peruse the videos attached to the following link, you'll see what appears to be someone arming a blue "propane canister" rigged up to some hokey-looking wanna-be rocket that I could make from scrap metal.
I don't know... maybe they're lobbing those canisters to the big Pulled Pork BBQ competition in the mountains?
http://www.wnd.com/2013/08/video-shows-rebels-launching-gas-attack-in-syria/

Isn't this a bit OT though? I thought the issue was Syrian forces using chemical weapons against people; not the rebels cooking up Sarin gas in bathtubs..

Hey... I originally thought that's what it was about, too... I have a feeling I was wrong, now.
And the ramifications of that realization have me more concerned than before.

 

[kpmarine]

Not yet their not.


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/un-security-council-deadlocked-over-syria/article14016547/

Russia has also moved a couple warships into the area.

Russia (Which recently passed a law banning "gay propaganda.) and China (Which has a history lately of not giving a shit about the welfare of it's citizens.): Both known for their respect of civil rights... You got any countries that do give a fuck about the welfare of their citizens that object?

 

[ricky1lung]

Russia (Which recently passed a law banning "gay propaganda.) and China (Which has a history lately of not giving a shit about the welfare of it's citizens.): Both known for their respect of civil rights... You got any countries that do give a fuck about the welfare of their citizens that object?

Im just pointing out the UN has not yet shown support for military action.
The UN has not yet gained conclusive evidence Syria gassed it's own people, the US has said they have the evidence.

 

[echelon1k1]

The US military wasn't deploying it's general troops pre-Benghazi.

US forces, regardless of their operational capabilities, operate under the US flag... Apart from the people on the ground, the pilots flying the sorties are still considered troops in the broad definition of the term. US military personnel are also known to provide security to CIA people in country...

The point of the UN strike is supposed to be to prevent further use of chemical weapons; whether that will unseat Assad remains to be seen.

I'm still sceptical at this claim considering the people we're supporting over there... Will UN intervention be a half measure like Iraq v1, committing forces and resources to a decade long quagmire enforcing no fly zones?

The US has not gassed it's own people in the same way that has occurred in Syria (Though there has been some dumb shit done with complete disregard to human rights in the past.).For a response to the final quote; see response #2.

Not its own people in an offensive capacity, but certainly the US government has provided support to countries that have engage in chemical warfare in the past... Iraq is one that comes to mind...

 

[kpmarine]

Im just pointing out the UN has not yet shown support for military action.
The UN has not yet gained conclusive evidence Syria gassed it's own people, the US has said they have the evidence.

The UN security council gets final say in such matters. Any action can get vetoed by one of the 5 permanent members (US, China, Russia, France, and Britain). Two of which are China and Russia. Like I said, do you have evidence of countries that give a damn about human rights objecting?

 

[kpmarine]

US forces, regardless of their operational capabilities, operate under the US flag... Apart from the people on the ground, the pilots flying the sorties are still considered troops in the broad definition of the term. US military personnel are also known to provide security to CIA people in country...



I'm still sceptical at this claim considering the people we're supporting over there... Will UN intervention be a half measure like Iraq v1, committing forces and resources to a decade long quagmire enforcing no fly zones?



Not its own people in an offensive capacity, but certainly the US government has provided support to countries that have engage in chemical warfare in the past... Iraq is one that comes to mind...

So because our government supported wrongdoings in Iraq (Along with other countries who sold them the tech.); we should just overlook this one? Militarily, no fly zones are important; they ensure air superiority and control; it's unpleasant, but a fact of strategic military application. Also, since when was a pilot "boots on the ground"?

 

[ricky1lung]

The UN security council gets final say in such matters. Any action can get vetoed by one of the 5 permanent members (US, China, Russia, France, and Britain). Two of which are China and Russia. Like I said, do you have evidence of countries that give a damn about human rights objecting?

I dont have to, I replied to your post where you stated:

God forbid we support preventing wholesale slaughter of people who aren't residents of out nation. Goodness knows the UN isn't backing this initiative or anything...

The UN has not yet stated they support military intervention. So no, the UN is not yet backing any military intervention.

 

[echelon1k1]

So because our government supported wrongdoings in Iraq (Along with other countries who sold them the tech.); we should just overlook this one?

Consecutive admins. have been fostering sectarian violence for a number of years now; for your government to take the moral high ground is absurd. It's time to stay out and let the dominos fall where they may.

Militarily, no fly zones are important; they ensure air superiority and control; it's unpleasant, but a fact of strategic military application. Also, since when was a pilot "boots on the ground"?

I don't object to a NFZ when enforced for the duration of a conflict or operation but the way NATO continually bombed Iraq between wars, while serving a strategic purpose, also alienated the populaces of those nations. At the end of the day, it was civilians hardest hit by sanctions and continued military action.

 

[schuylaar]

Consecutive admins. have been fostering sectarian violence for a number of years now; for your government to take the moral high ground is absurd. It's time to stay out and let the dominos fall where they may.



I don't object to a NFZ when enforced for the duration of a conflict or operation but the way NATO continually bombed Iraq between wars, while serving a strategic purpose, also alienated the populaces of those nations. At the end of the day, it was civilians hardest hit by sanctions and continued military action.

americans don't get a vote on this, rather it's those who we elected and they just do whatever the fuck they want..imo..do you seriously think americans endorse war (other than the pubsters)?

 

[echelon1k1]

americans don't get a vote on this, rather it's those who we elected and they just do whatever the fuck they want..imo..do you seriously think americans endorse war (other than the pubsters)?

I remember you saying you'd like to fly drones, IMO that's a ringing endorsement for the GWOT and the conflicts that have since ensued... Gotta love Rockefeller Republicans...

 

[Doer]

The US fooked itself on this one.

By even suggesting arming the rebels they are now seen as supporting terrorists... Too funny
The big WMD fiasco in Iraq blew any credibility they had on the world stage so the declaration
of who did what is open to great scrutiny.

A limited strike would give the terrorist groups the upper hand so it would be seen as supporting them, as would
toppling the regime.

In order to get "the job done" they need to go in with allies and take out both sides.

Of course it's not some thing I want to see happen, but it is kind of funny thinking back a decade
and looking at today's blatant hypocrisy..... Sure, spy on me to protect me from those terrorists that you arm so you have a need
to protect me from them.......

We know Sadam had weapons. He used them. We know they were there. Powell showed pictures to the UN of them being moved from bunkers. He even said they probably would not be there. I watch this stuff more closely than most it seems.

To me they found so much and lost so much in the early stupidity they were forced to tell the world there was nothing but a mosquito truck and a model airplane. They could not say, what slipped their hands when Sadam would not fight and the Allies could not guard in that first 2 weeks. Entire warehouses of materials missing. Reported on day 1. Missing on day 6.

We even know where they went. Syria. We know they are in the Bakka Valley, (just like Iran still has the F4s.). And maybe we want to get that WMD. You guys will believe anything and it is all lies. Why would you choose to believe the Baathists don't use gas on civilians? They do and we hang them for it. Why expect the truth? The Anti-Bush are the biggest liars yet with all the 9/11 stuff.

Only idiots and kids think that one President is good and the other is bad. To most it is a domestic game. But the Presidency is not about the pastoral issues. He is the leader of the most powerful war cult and it is simple. You use it or you lose it. We want it and WE will keep it.

All the rest is silly croaking fantasy to me. In this case I will support what happens. Nothing has happened. There seems to be not even a bad option. All are horrible and have Turkey's and Jordan's name on them. But, if it get's that big, the conflict is coming to the USA.

It is why we have an unfettered Commander. His call. If he does nothing, fine. If he create the fog of war so Zion commandos can penetrate the Bakka and neutralize those weapons. Fine by me.

War is continuous. You don't declare it until it is an actual national emergency, like Pearl Harbor.

It is not a comic book, where we go from episode to episode, nicely stack, numbered and stand alone.

This is still the war against Jihad in Africa/Levant. Jefferson's war is still on. WW2 brought the Gestapo to the area.

 

[schuylaar]

I remember you saying you'd like to fly drones, IMO that's a ringing endorsement for the GWOT and the conflicts that have since ensued... Gotta love Rockefeller Republicans...

uh yaaaaaah, for the RIGHT enemy..although Assad seems to want to start something..as far as i'm concerned i put my money on the Obama..FTW!

 

[echelon1k1]

uh yaaaaaah, for the RIGHT enemy..although Assad seems to want to start something..as far as i'm concerned i put my money on the Obama..FTW!

The "right enemy" would include the Syrian "rebels"...

By assads following statement it would seem what you claim is just untrue...

This war targets Syria using a handful of Syrians and many foreigners. Thus, this is a war to defend the nation.
There are those who seek to partition Syria and weaken it. But Syria is stronger… and will remain sovereign… and this is what upsets the West.
The first part of a political solution would require regional powers to stop funding and arming [the rebels], an end to terrorism and controlling the borders.
We never rejected a political solution … but with whom should we talk? With those who have extremist ideology who only understand the language of terrorism?

Your money on Obama is just a thumbs ups via proxy for Al Qaeda... Not cool...

 

[blacksun]

this is gonna be another in and out military action like libya.

Nice time machine.

Can you get me tomorrow's lottery numbers?

No? Because you're full of shit?

Oh, okay.