Wiring a 2nd outlet to existing breaker circuit/fuse ??? Need electrician advice

rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
Alright so I have a common issue when it comes to growing... The location of the grow box is rather unorthodox and has no outlets... I currently have a surge protector outlet strip running into the room supplying power for the veg room (400w mh plus fan)... This is fine but I need to add my 600w hps very soon and need an additional circuit to provide power for the flower room...

What I would like to know is if I can open up my breaker box and add wires to an existing breaker... For example my washing machine is on it's own circuit with a 20 amp fuse. I was hoping I could just open up the breaker box, take out the washing machine breaker/fuse, loosen the existing wires, add some additional wires, and run those new wires to the grow room and hook up to a new outlet?

Will this cause any issues with the circuit?

And before I get people telling me this, I know that my lights are only equivalent to 1000w (8.33 amps) which is quite reasonable for a 15amp circuit.. But I have my reasons for doing this and it's not really necessary to explain.. I'm just hoping someone can tell me if this is possible, and if anyone can explain how to do so, or give me a good link showing how to do this.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
Again, I want to wire the new outlet directly from the breaker box, and add on to an existing breaker. I've seen how to videos on adding outlets through a primary outlet, and that's not what I'm going for.... Hopefully someones got some know how their willing to share.
 
supchaka

supchaka

Well-Known Member
There are whats called dedicated circuits, and the laundry room is a dedicated circuit. Meaning that no other outlets are on that circuit. It would not be safe, nor to code to add wires to an existing breaker even if its not dedicated. If you're running new wire, thats 99% of the work right there. A new breaker is like $8 and you should be able to add it into your existing fusebox in 30 seconds.

If you live alone in the desert then by all means do as you please. If you have family members in the house or neighbors right next door then I'd advise against it. I don't think you want to deal with the possible repercussions with burning down the house.
 
SnapsProvolone

SnapsProvolone

Well-Known Member
Do not put more than one wire under the screw lug on the breaker. They arent rated for such. If you must split it do it with a wire nut and just one conductor on breaker screw terminal.

Use tandem (space saver) breakers on existing circuits to make space for additional circuit breaker.

What make panel / breaker style? Siemens QP? Square-D QO? Cutler Hammer? Pics?
 
K

kaloconnection

Well-Known Member
supchaka said:
If you're running new wire, thats 99% of the work right there. A new breaker is like $8 and you should be able to add it into your existing fusebox in 30 seconds.
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+1 on this. Running the wire is the hard part, once you have the wire in your breaker box connecting it to a new breaker is a piece of cake and much safer. Then you wont have to worry about tripping your 20amp breaker when you are doing laundry with your lights on.
 
SnapsProvolone

SnapsProvolone

Well-Known Member
If you can't consolidate enough space using space savers then its time for a licensed electrician to do a load assessment and determine if you need upsized service or just a subpanel.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
breaker box.jpgbreaker box 2.jpg

Here are two pictures... I live in a town house style apartment so I have no idea if this plays a role. I wouldn't think so.... But compared to other breaker boxes I've seen this one doesn't have a main breaker switch... Which seems really odd... The fuses added together are over 320 amps. I'm not sure what that means in terms of how much more I can add to the breaker box itself.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
Personally since this is an apartment id rather not add a new circuit.. If I can't add new wire to an existing circuit (that's in use) can I simply open up the breaker box, pick a circuit and take it out, remove the wires from the circuit, cover the wires with electrical tape, then add new wires running to the grow room? This way when It's time to move I can simply open the box back up, remove the wires I added for the grow room, and plug in the wires that were originally plugged into the circuit... I have a garbage disposal that's on it's own circuit, I can live without using that.. Also my smoke detectors have their own circuit which I could also live without (hopefully).
 
SnapsProvolone

SnapsProvolone

Well-Known Member
rickymac21 said:
Personally since this is an apartment id rather not add a new circuit.. If I can't add new wire to an existing circuit (that's in use) can I simply open up the breaker box, pick a circuit and take it out, remove the wires from the circuit, cover the wires with electrical tape, then add new wires running to the grow room? This way when It's time to move I can simply open the box back up, remove the wires I added for the grow room, and plug in the wires that were originally plugged into the circuit... I have a garbage disposal that's on it's own circuit, I can live without using that.. Also my smoke detectors have their own circuit which I could also live without (hopefully).
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Yes. Be sure its 12 gauge wire if on a 20 amp breaker.

Please do not disconnect the line feeding your smoke detectors. Instead pigtail off breaker, and tie both wires to pigtail. Its safe as long as wire gauge isnt undersized for breaker and you twist conductors tightly BEFORE wirenut to prevent arcing. Just can't put two wires under one terminal screw as one can end up being loose and arcing.
 
SnapsProvolone

SnapsProvolone

Well-Known Member
rickymac21 said:
View attachment 2900790View attachment 2900791

Here are two pictures... I live in a town house style apartment so I have no idea if this plays a role. I wouldn't think so.... But compared to other breaker boxes I've seen this one doesn't have a main breaker switch... Which seems really odd... The fuses added together are over 320 amps. I'm not sure what that means in terms of how much more I can add to the breaker box itself.
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Your panel is a subpanel. Your "main breaker" is just another breaker in the 400/320 panel.

Looks like you have open spaces for breakers. They make space fillers for when you move to fill the hole in the dead front cover.
 
SnapsProvolone

SnapsProvolone

Well-Known Member
Just grab a square-d QO breaker at lowes or home depot or the like. 20 amp if using 12 gauge wire or 15 amp if 14 gauge.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
SnapsProvolone said:
Just grab a square-d QO breaker at lowes or home depot or the like. 20 amp if using 12 gauge wire or 15 amp if 14 gauge.
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I know I can do that but I really don't want to add a new breaker/circuit. That's why I was asking if I can just use existing breakers.

Like I said, the garbage disposal is on a 15a breaker by itself. I could just undo the wires from the breaker, secure them with electrical tape to ensure no ground-outs, then add new 14 gauge wire running to the grow room where I'll install an outlet. Is this easily done and safe?
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
SnapsProvolone said:
Your panel is a subpanel. Your "main breaker" is just another breaker in the 400/320 panel.

Looks like you have open spaces for breakers. They make space fillers for when you move to fill the hole in the dead front cover.
Click to expand...

Didint read this right the first time. The filler would work I bet for when I move. I might just add my own breakers then.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
As it turns out, I don't have any extra space for another breaker. I took off the panal cover (where there are punch outs for more breakers) and saw no extra spaces for new breakers. It looks like there's a main power bar running down the middle of all the breakers, and that power bar stops at the bottom of the last breakers. I don't see how another breaker would connect to anything. I might be forced to disconnect my garbage disposal and use it as a breaker for a new outlet.
 
rickymac21

rickymac21

Well-Known Member
SnapsProvolone said:
What you see is common. You are correct its full.

Replace with a QO Tandem breaker
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Gotcha. It's not completely necessary to replace the breaker is it? I'm sure it wouldn't hurt, especially since I could upgrade it from 15amp to 20 amp. But I don't think I'll need that many extra amps. Plus when it comes time to move ill have to replace the 20 amp breaker back to the 15 amp since that's all the garbage disposal is wired for. I guess that wouldn't be a difficult task either.

Now as far as disconnecting my garbage disposal wiring from the breaker and the ground and neutral wires. Do I start by disconnecting the "hot" wire from the breaker? If so this would kill all power running through the garbage disposal wires correct? But then I have to disconnect the ground and neutral wires. I'm not sure which one of those comes next. But either way there are number outs wires surrounding each ground and neutral wire, making it kind of sketchy. I'm assuming this is why the main breaker should be shut off to kill all the power? I just don't want to reach in and try to pull out the ground wire since its bare copper, and get shocked by another wire, or cause major damage.

After I have everything disconnected though i can just bundle the 3 wires from the garbage disposal together and wrap in electrical tape right? The. Just tuck it in there in a nice spot until its time to reconnect ?
 
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