Best grow method for sog?

George2324

Well-Known Member
Really have to dial the sog to the strain. Sounds like youre pretty close if youre getting that yield. I always liked the strains that really popped after flip as they game me the yields. You have an exceptional strain if you can take 3 inch rooted clones and flower them getting 19g dry per plant. Good job!
Unfortunately don’t have that one anymore.

On my normal grows though when I harvest I can have a 21g bud only 8 inches long. Don’t know if that’s a fair comparison but those bigger plants have more than one cola. If I can get a 21g bud on 8 inches of stem I hope I can replicate that in a sog
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
all depends on the strain. some strains are so dense they make buds like rocks, others not so much. Either way, as long as the mass is there.
What’s your opinion on those wick systems where water flows to a tray with a float valve and hydro ton wicks it up?
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
Right im home now.

This is what I’m working with. A side profile of the room.

I’d like to cram the entire room with plants atleast 4 per sqft.

This is just one section I have an extension off the other side which is used for a clone room/ mother room.

To optimise the space I originally designed a vertical system with pipes but I feel like I can get more space if I stay horizontal and use the entire floor area even the 60cm height bits with a sog operation.

I just need a design that can be moveable and low profile.

Opinions welcome
 

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George2324

Well-Known Member
I’ve also considered shelving with horizontal plants on shelves in the middle 2m I could have a max height of 1.4m so possibly 2 tables one on floor and one above. But I’d still need them to be moveable
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
Sounds like a recipe for salt buildups to me. But I have never used such a system personally.
In regards to the flood and drain you recommend... I’ve just seen the IWS system. That looks possible? The pots are literally only an inch or so off the floor?
 

Renfro

Well-Known Member
In regards to the flood and drain you recommend... I’ve just seen the IWS system. That looks possible? The pots are literally only an inch or so off the floor?
I haven't used these type systems but a buddy had an ebb and grow thats very similar. He found the system to be unreliable as the controller kept failing on his and it wouldn't drain the system. Had to do with faulty float switches I think. Even replacing them didn't fix it long.
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
I haven't used these type systems but a buddy had an ebb and grow thats very similar. He found the system to be unreliable as the controller kept failing on his and it wouldn't drain the system. Had to do with faulty float switches I think. Even replacing them didn't fix it long.
I’m going to look into building my own with huge flood trays

I think that’s the only way I will be able to use flood and drain with this low profile.

If I switch to strip lights how many strips do you reckon I should use per m2 then? And you say 40w/sqft max?

I’d probably make my own controller with arduino and relays for the pumps.

Setup the sequence so that I do a few test runs work out the exact flood time I need and hard code that time into the ardunio.

Loop
Feed pump on (delay however long required)
Feed pump off
Drain pump on (delay however long required)
Feed pump off
Delay (time between feedings)
End loop

A 2 inch overflow straight to a 2 inch drain for emergency if a system ever fails the water drains to waste rather than a flood

This should reduce float switch drain issues and have plenty of fail safe in place to be safe I think
 
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Renfro

Well-Known Member
You might pop in the LED section under grow room design and see what you can find there on the LED strip builds. I haven't built one myself.
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
You might pop in the LED section under grow room design and see what you can find there on the LED strip builds. I haven't built one myself.
I’ll get over there after I figure out this grow system issue first then.

How does res size work for flood and drain? At first I worked out my tray size and thought i was screwed as that would be over 2000l but I guess the clay balls take up a lot of space inside the tray?

Is there a rule of thumb as to how much space is water vs clay so it can be worked out for res size?
 

Renfro

Well-Known Member
Well another factor in res size is keeping the pumps intake submerged so it doesn't suck air. I prefer my flood and drain capacity be on the larger side so I can run the res the whole cycle without changing.

So if your res is low and wide you will need more water to keep the pump submerged than if it's tall and skinny like a drum.

For the setups I have done I use 5 gallons per sqft of tray as my guide for minimum reservoir capacity, mine were always low and wide, under the tray. 2x12 box with pond liner and cross braces for the tray to sit on.
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
How about a DWC SoG rig?

View attachment 4498660
I currently use a dwc/nft combo type setup and I just feel it uses way too much water and it’s hard to insulate the water from ambient temps in each individual bucket.

I can insulate a 500l barrel to completely separate it from the room air. And put a cooling tube in it for flood and drain and it’s less water
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
Well another factor in res size is keeping the pumps intake submerged so it doesn't suck air. I prefer my flood and drain capacity be on the larger side so I can run the res the whole cycle without changing.

So if your res is low and wide you will need more water to keep the pump submerged than if it's tall and skinny like a drum.

For the setups I have done I use 5 gallons per sqft of tray as my guide for minimum reservoir capacity, mine were always low and wide, under the tray. 2x12 box with pond liner and cross braces for the tray to sit on.

Yeah that’s the main reason I don’t want my res below the tray. It would be so shallow that I’d have to refill it constantly.

I’d be looking at using a tall barrel . I would have around 130 sqft of tray that I could fit in there.
Based on your 5 gal per sq ft that would be a 650 gal res which is definitely out of the question for me. But I have no issue refilling once every 2 weeks or so.

Issue I have is I don’t even know if a 500l res would even have enough water in it to fill the trays?
 

Renfro

Well-Known Member
well you can do the math, 130 sqft * say 0.5 ft deep = 65 cuft = 486 gallons. How much is filled with rocks, well that depends on some factors but say 50% because you are packing them in tight, so maybe 240 gallons to flood? Thats just a guesstimate of course, one would want to take a measuring cup, fill it with LECA and then add water to a known volume. Measure the water input and you can see what percentage of the space is free without roots of course, they will pack them spaces up lol.
 

George2324

Well-Known Member
well you can do the math, 130 sqft * say 0.5 ft deep = 65 cuft = 486 gallons. How much is filled with rocks, well that depends on some factors but say 50% because you are packing them in tight, so maybe 240 gallons to flood? Thats just a guesstimate of course, one would want to take a measuring cup, fill it with LECA and then add water to a known volume. Measure the water input and you can see what percentage of the space is free without roots of course, they will pack them spaces up lol.
Yeah I’ll do that test good call.

Just realised my all my netpots are 4 inches so I’d need to have 9 per sqft to fill the trays with pebbles.

Wonder if 9 per sqft would be too dense. Otherwise I’ll have to go out and buy 520 new pots too
 

OzyM8

Well-Known Member
Hi George, to be honest attic grows are difficult, in terms of load, water up, water down, adequate hight for a uniform grow with lighting, space to move around, work flow, etc etc.
I’ve read the previous pages since posting re F&D best for SOG as I didn’t have the specific run down on your situation, and will throw this into the mix for consideration since you have a drain sorted. It’s what a mate of mine did when challenged with a similar scenario to you. I’ll try and explain what he did.
Build a low profile frame on the floor to have a very slight slope to which you mount corrugated roof sheet, at the lower end (water catchment and drain end) mount roof guttering on the end to collect the run off, slope, and plumb it into your drain. You’d want it so you have just enough length ways access to plants, i.e rows, however the catchment gutter as a single length., it will be low enough that you’d be able to step over it anyway.
That’s the “table” and run off sorted.
He used a single res, pump, solenoid, timer, piping and netafim system to feed fabric pots with coco that sat on the sheeting. You may consider 2x res’s. Think he had two stakes per pot, and one pot per sq foot, 5 gal pots. He manifolded his plants to keep them low, and flipped not long after the base manifold was finished. I.e vertical facing plants about 6” high, effectively had a hybrid SOG.
Just another way to consider, and it’s simple. He got outstanding yields and was an easy clean down between runs.
I’d also consider @Renfro idea of rockwool slabs.
I’d throw the idea of a single huge F&D table in your situation, it’s fought with complexity and issues. You’d be looking at something like 2 or more large boat bilge pumps and float switches in a catchment pan/s under the table/s to pump back into the res/s. Just a recipe for disaster in my mind. Just as an example, I run a 200ltr res under each 4x4ft table.
Best of luck with it all
Cheers
Ozy :peace:
 
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Renfro

Well-Known Member
I’ve read the previous pages since posting re F&D best for SOG as I didn’t have the specific run down on your situation, and will throw this into the mix for consideration since you have a drain sorted. It’s what a mate of mine did when challenged with a similar scenario to you. I’ll try and explain what he did.
Build a low profile frame on the floor to have a very slight slope to which you mount corrugated roof sheet, at the lower end (water catchment and drain end) mount roof guttering on the end to collect the run off, slope, and plumb it into your drain. You’d want it so you have just enough length ways access to plants, i.e rows, however the catchment gutter as a single length., it will be low enough that you’d be able to step over it anyway.
I think what you are describing is a DTW NFT system. That could work really well for him seeing as he plans to grow small plants and thats what NFT is best suited for.
 

OzyM8

Well-Known Member
I think what you are describing is a DTW NFT system. That could work really well for him seeing as he plans to grow small plants and thats what NFT is best suited for.
After re reading I can see how that could be read.
It’s a top feed to coco filled fabric pots, using the corrugated sheet as a low table and to handle the run off, DTW.
 
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