Coco with advanced nutrients. PH???

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jonnynobody

Well-Known Member
Advanced nutrients is overpriced garbage marketed by a predatory company preying on new gardeners that know nothing about growing plants and enjoy child like cartoon pictures on their fertilizer containers. General hydroponics flora series is fantastic. Affordable too. Jack's is another great professional grade fertilizer. No childish cartoon pictures on the containers is the first indicator you might be dealing with a professional company that manufactures fertilizer. Don't feel bad though. I have a retard of a friend I grew up with that lives in another state. He literally was gloating about how much he spent on his AN line and a semi truck pulled up to his house to make the delivery. I told him when you get fucked that hard on a sale for plant fertilizer you get the red carpet service my friend :) Love the guy, but he's a fucking idiot who got bad advice from another idiot. You're welcome :)
 
J

jonnynobody

Well-Known Member
By the way if you are running coco (which I would not recommend) you need a coco specific fertilizer. I don't have the energy or will to explain why. Research on your own. But if you choose to run coco (please don't) use a coco specific fertilizer.
 
Rurumo

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
jonnynobody said:
Advanced nutrients is overpriced garbage marketed by a predatory company preying on new gardeners that know nothing about growing plants and enjoy child like cartoon pictures on their fertilizer containers. General hydroponics flora series is fantastic. Affordable too. Jack's is another great professional grade fertilizer. No childish cartoon pictures on the containers is the first indicator you might be dealing with a professional company that manufactures fertilizer. Don't feel bad though. I have a retard of a friend I grew up with that lives in another state. He literally was gloating about how much he spent on his AN line and a semi truck pulled up to his house to make the delivery. I told him when you get fucked that hard on a sale for plant fertilizer you get the red carpet service my friend :) Love the guy, but he's a fucking idiot who got bad advice from another idiot. You're welcome :)
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Totally agree, GH is good stuff. Their Flora, Floranova, and Maxi series all test "below detectable limits" for arsenic and cadmium in third party tests, and GH doesn't even advertise it...maybe they should. If more new growers started with Flora or Maxibloom, the number of problem threads would plummet and the number of beautiful bud shots would skyrocket!! OP if you ever want to try something else that is cheaper and works great, try the Flora "lucas formula" or keep it simple with Maxibloom https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=191645. And here is where you can see how much arsenic and cadmium is in your nutes https://apps1.cdfa.ca.gov/fertilizerproducts/. I'm not saying Advanced is high, but it's there.
 
G

GyppedGypsy

Member
jonnynobody said:
Advanced nutrients is overpriced garbage marketed by a predatory company preying on new gardeners that know nothing about growing plants and enjoy child like cartoon pictures on their fertilizer containers. General hydroponics flora series is fantastic. Affordable too. Jack's is another great professional grade fertilizer. No childish cartoon pictures on the containers is the first indicator you might be dealing with a professional company that manufactures fertilizer. Don't feel bad though. I have a retard of a friend I grew up with that lives in another state. He literally was gloating about how much he spent on his AN line and a semi truck pulled up to his house to make the delivery. I told him when you get fucked that hard on a sale for plant fertilizer you get the red carpet service my friend :) Love the guy, but he's a fucking idiot who got bad advice from another idiot. You're welcome :)
Click to expand...
Rurumo said:
Totally agree, GH is good stuff. Their Flora, Floranova, and Maxi series all test "below detectable limits" for arsenic and cadmium in third party tests, and GH doesn't even advertise it...maybe they should. If more new growers started with Flora or Maxibloom, the number of problem threads would plummet and the number of beautiful bud shots would skyrocket!! OP if you ever want to try something else that is cheaper and works great, try the Flora "lucas formula" or keep it simple with Maxibloom https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=191645. And here is where you can see how much arsenic and cadmium is in your nutes https://apps1.cdfa.ca.gov/fertilizerproducts/. I'm not saying Advanced is high, but it's there.
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Thanks for the info. Now that my garden has grown a bit, I've been thinking about making a switch in nutes. I'll definitely look into GH. TBH, I was just a bit hesitant and worried about pH issues if I switch but the plus side of having multiple plants will be trying it out on just one or two without risking f'ing up my whole garden lol
 
Rurumo

Rurumo

Well-Known Member
GyppedGypsy said:
Thanks for the info. Now that my garden has grown a bit, I've been thinking about making a switch in nutes. I'll definitely look into GH. TBH, I was just a bit hesitant and worried about pH issues if I switch but the plus side of having multiple plants will be trying it out on just one or two without risking f'ing up my whole garden lol
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PH is something all indoor growers need to get a handle on at some point. You can even get away with using a test kit and just aim for 6.0 for most situations. It all depends on your water source-just a heads up, Maxibloom will drop the ph of your water quite a bit. I still need to use a little PH down, but I know people who need to use PH up when they use it. It has a lot of sulfur in it, which is one of the reasons I like it so much, it's amazing how a dry mineral salt fertilizer can grow such dank, resinous buds. Good luck!
 
J

jonnynobody

Well-Known Member
GyppedGypsy said:
Thanks for the info. Now that my garden has grown a bit, I've been thinking about making a switch in nutes. I'll definitely look into GH. TBH, I was just a bit hesitant and worried about pH issues if I switch but the plus side of having multiple plants will be trying it out on just one or two without risking f'ing up my whole garden lol
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Cheap digital PH meters can be had on amazon for under $15. Buy 2. One serves as a backup for the other in the event of a failure. Grab 4.0 calibration solution. That way you can verify your meter is within specification once per month. Under $50 total investment. Your girls will thank you :) Down the road you can upgrade to a fancier PH meter, but I used the cheap digital ones for years. They work. They just don't last longer than a single grow cycle typically.
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
jonnynobody said:
By the way if you are running coco (which I would not recommend) you need a coco specific fertilizer. I don't have the energy or will to explain why. Research on your own. But if you choose to run coco (please don't) use a coco specific fertilizer.
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many people grow in cocos with non specific fertilizer.
cocos is high in K and eats a lot calcium and magnesium, so cocos ferts are often higher in this and i seldon saw a cocos fert high in K, thats about it.
nothing you cant adapt to a jacks formula f.e
youre so right on your view regarding nutes and AN.
 
J

jonnynobody

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
many people grow in cocos with non specific fertilizer.
cocos is high in K and eats a lot calcium and magnesium, so cocos ferts are often higher in this and i seldon saw a cocos fert high in K, thats about it.
nothing you cant adapt to a jacks formula f.e
youre so right on your view regarding nutes and AN.
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You're right. Many people use coco with success. Hempy, the inventor of the hempy bucket (which I use), now uses coco exclusively in his buckets instead of the old perlite / vermiculite mix he once recommended. I tried coco once with poor results. To be fair it was home depot's "black magic" brand that I'm sure was of low quality. The plants just seemed inhibited throughout that particular grow. Yield suffered slightly. Not horrible, but enough to take notice. I've been using #4 perlite since. I recently decided to start my first soil plant in 10 years yesterday. Godfather OG in some fox farm ocean forest and happy frog mixed at 50/50 in a 5 gallon pot. I also picked up a block of canna brand coco. I want to give the medium another shot. I think buying my coco from home depot was my first mistake. Using it was my second mistake. Canna brand has a great reputation so I figure if anyone can get me some good quality coco it's them. I'll be clipping clones in the next week. As soon as they're rooted 1 of them will go in the coco for another experiment. I really hope that it does go well, because I want to be able to recommend it. My hope is that this will prove I simply got a bad batch of coco last time and nothing more. I do not buy anything fertilizer or medium related for my garden at home depot. They just had a bunch of stuff on clearance and it seemed like too good of a deal to pass up. Half off if I remember right. I think they were shelving their in-store-hydroponics products for good and liquidating their product due to poor sales. Maybe the poor sales were a symptom of poor product? :)
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
there is so much to experiment, i hope you share your findings.
i did used perlite/vermi in hempies, with good results, or nothing to blame the meidum for.
its easy to handle EC and PH wise, the vermi may let my PH skyrocket a bit but its all well.
i had poor runs in coco too.
there are many thing i changed in the meantime.
basically cocos do well for me in cheap fabric pots automatically watered.
preparing the cocos is important, most bricks are sh..., canna is prob one of the few doing better.
cocos chips are of higher quality, lower EC, but need more watering (they did well in hempies for me too btw.).
anyway, wash it like crazy first in the shower, the fabric bags are quite handy for this.
wash it let it sit, wash it, repeat.
you want to let the cocos see a high mg and or ca ppm, 2 times at least.
calcium nitrate and epsom salt are really your friends there.
you can go mad, np, just flush the mix with your jacks afterwards to your wish EC.
dont go too high with the overall EC, lots room to play, but around EC 1.3 is quite good.
increase epsom when you see problem, soemtimes the cocos eat this stuff.
otherwise it works quite good, had a explosive growth, better then in the hempies.
my 2 cent on cocos after hating this stuff too.

cheap dry nutes on cocos.
P1040873.JPG

2 things i like about cocos, is root development and that it regulates the PH quite good itself.
i go in with 5.8-6.2, last time i checked, which is longer ago sadly, it was 6.2, i expect it to become lower in later flower.
 
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GyppedGypsy

Member
jonnynobody said:
You're right. Many people use coco with success. Hempy, the inventor of the hempy bucket (which I use), now uses coco exclusively in his buckets instead of the old perlite / vermiculite mix he once recommended. I tried coco once with poor results. To be fair it was home depot's "black magic" brand that I'm sure was of low quality. The plants just seemed inhibited throughout that particular grow. Yield suffered slightly. Not horrible, but enough to take notice. I've been using #4 perlite since. I recently decided to start my first soil plant in 10 years yesterday. Godfather OG in some fox farm ocean forest and happy frog mixed at 50/50 in a 5 gallon pot. I also picked up a block of canna brand coco. I want to give the medium another shot. I think buying my coco from home depot was my first mistake. Using it was my second mistake. Canna brand has a great reputation so I figure if anyone can get me some good quality coco it's them. I'll be clipping clones in the next week. As soon as they're rooted 1 of them will go in the coco for another experiment. I really hope that it does go well, because I want to be able to recommend it. My hope is that this will prove I simply got a bad batch of coco last time and nothing more. I do not buy anything fertilizer or medium related for my garden at home depot. They just had a bunch of stuff on clearance and it seemed like too good of a deal to pass up. Half off if I remember right. I think they were shelving their in-store-hydroponics products for good and liquidating their product due to poor sales. Maybe the poor sales were a symptom of poor product? :)
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I've never used only coco coir but my plants love Fox Farm's Coco Loco. It has "aged forest products, coco coir, perlite, earthworm castings, fossilized bat guano, Norwegian kelp meal, oyster shell and dolomite lime (for pH adjustment)." The nutes included only last a week, two tops and then I feed every watering which is about every 4-5 days in 3 gallon fabric pots. Not sure if it's the medium or the fabric pots or a combination of both but my root growth is always great. Here's a pic of a previous grow of 3... I let them get way too big for my 4'x2' space and should have defoliated a bit more before flipping... But lesson learned. And ignore the obvious nute issue. I was still figuring out my flower feeding schedule
IMG_20201212_162237684_HDR.jpg
 
A

Apalchen

Well-Known Member
GyppedGypsy said:
I've never used only coco coir but my plants love Fox Farm's Coco Loco. It has "aged forest products, coco coir, perlite, earthworm castings, fossilized bat guano, Norwegian kelp meal, oyster shell and dolomite lime (for pH adjustment)." The nutes included only last a week, two tops and then I feed every watering which is about every 4-5 days in 3 gallon fabric pots. Not sure if it's the medium or the fabric pots or a combination of both but my root growth is always great. Here's a pic of a previous grow of 3... I let them get way too big for my 4'x2' space and should have defoliated a bit more before flipping... But lesson learned. And ignore the obvious nute issue. I was still figuring out my flower feeding schedule
View attachment 4834352
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I actually mix one bag coco loco with one bag of mother’s earth coco+perilite as my medium and have for years. I treat it the same way I did regular coco as far as feeding, but don’t get stalled out after transplant(guessing I never buffered my plain coco well enough). Anyways I used to just keep coco loco around for babies and mothers, but ran short on coco once and mixed some with coco to finish repotting and those plants took off faster. Been doing it ever since and I doubt I’ll be switching any time soon.

As far as advanced nutrients goes if you buy the big bottles at a high volume store the price isn’t bad at all. I guess it might be if you bought all kinda additives. I mix 3 Rez’s every night and never have to adjust anything just add nutes and water.

Im not sure that advanced is any better than any other nutrients, I haven’t tried anything else since doing dwc years ago. But I can say for me I won’t be doing any changes in medium or nutrients any time soon. I’ve got this dialed in for me, on a bad run I’m hitting 2.5# a light and on my biggest run yetI hit 4 lbs per light(didn’t even think was possible).

Here is some recent pics. C0F863D9-A2BA-4F4A-9FE4-32A511D81C75.jpegB40BE5CE-FE7D-4B6E-8C64-E6F4CEF22675.jpeg0ECFB1F5-2AE8-4BDE-B506-99A6EE411B08.jpegDBBAD695-7409-4226-904C-0403F9DE17BB.jpegEF5D68CD-5DEF-4B65-95A5-EB1F51E438B3.jpeg
 
J

jonnynobody

Well-Known Member
Apalchen said:
I actually mix one bag coco loco with one bag of mother’s earth coco+perilite as my medium and have for years. I treat it the same way I did regular coco as far as feeding, but don’t get stalled out after transplant(guessing I never buffered my plain coco well enough). Anyways I used to just keep coco loco around for babies and mothers, but ran short on coco once and mixed some with coco to finish repotting and those plants took off faster. Been doing it ever since and I doubt I’ll be switching any time soon.

As far as advanced nutrients goes if you buy the big bottles at a high volume store the price isn’t bad at all. I guess it might be if you bought all kinda additives. I mix 3 Rez’s every night and never have to adjust anything just add nutes and water.

Im not sure that advanced is any better than any other nutrients, I haven’t tried anything else since doing dwc years ago. But I can say for me I won’t be doing any changes in medium or nutrients any time soon. I’ve got this dialed in for me, on a bad run I’m hitting 2.5# a light and on my biggest run yetI hit 4 lbs per light(didn’t even think was possible).

Here is some recent pics. View attachment 4836612View attachment 4836613View attachment 4836614View attachment 4836616View attachment 4836615
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Beautiful room sir. Why did you opt for a non air cooled ballast / light setup with your DE lamps? Your mini split has to be working some serious overtime to cool that baby with no HVAC system to pipe the heat away. My room runs at about 5000w total draw during lights on with all lights at 100% output including fans. Electric is around $650 every month with my setup. With 6 DE 1000's, a mini, and no HVAC system to dump the heat your bill has to be absolutely viscous :)
The yield always pays for it and then some, but the monthly sticker shock would make my eyeballs pop out.
 
A

Apalchen

Well-Known Member
jonnynobody said:
Beautiful room sir. Why did you opt for a non air cooled ballast / light setup with your DE lamps? Your mini split has to be working some serious overtime to cool that baby with no HVAC system to pipe the heat away. My room runs at about 5000w total draw during lights on with all lights at 100% output including fans. Electric is around $650 every month with my setup. With 6 DE 1000's, a mini, and no HVAC system to dump the heat your bill has to be absolutely viscous :)
The yield always pays for it and then some, but the monthly sticker shock would make my eyeballs pop out.
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When I just had this room and a veg room going it was around 700 a month(thats just the grow have a separate meter for house). I have since added another flower room the same size and so far the highest it’s been is 1000. I suspect if I have both rooms in peak flower at once it could be maybe 1200-1400.

I ran air cooled hid for years, and it works great but I feel a lot of the reflectors make for more of a flash light effect as far as light spread. Where as the gavita reflectors have a nice wide overlapping footprint. And I’ve always heard you lose 10% to glass. If 10% loss in light equals 10% loss in yield then the open reflectors more than cover the electric cost of the mini split.

since it’s winter I’ve been able to air cool my other room like this until I get another ac this spring(hopefully bigger so can add a couple more lights).
 
Leon727272

Leon727272

Active Member
Apalchen said:
I hear when running led you should run higher temps. Do you know how many actual watts it is?

The sensi has a set of 2 grow bottles and a set of 2 bloom bottles. So only use grow for veg and bloom for flower.

Genetics do play a big role, but light intensity is also a big factor in dense flowers.
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Hi........I use Advanced Nutrients also but I am switching my base nuts on my next grow from Micro/Grow/Bloom to Sensi Coco Grow A&B and Sensi Coco Bloom A&B........(I am using Coco as my grow medium). Reason for this is nut burn issues in flower stage with Micro/Grow/Bloom

My question is......... Do you use the full strength of the Sensi Coco nutrients as recommended by the Nutrient Calculator on the AN website?
 
A

Apalchen

Well-Known Member
Leon727272 said:
Hi........I use Advanced Nutrients also but I am switching my base nuts on my next grow from Micro/Grow/Bloom to Sensi Coco Grow A&B and Sensi Coco Bloom A&B........(I am using Coco as my grow medium). Reason for this is nut burn issues in flower stage with Micro/Grow/Bloom

My question is......... Do you use the full strength of the Sensi Coco nutrients as recommended by the Nutrient Calculator on the AN website?
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No I use a ppm meter and keep between 500-800 ppm in veg and 700-1200 ppm in flower.
 
Leon727272

Leon727272

Active Member
GyppedGypsy said:
I had this issue using AN Micro, Grow, Bloom in flower. They loved it while I'm veg but I was forced to lower it gradually after the switch. AN has another called Sensi that is also pH perfect that's a user here told me about. There's 2 types, one just for coco coir that have a differ formula for veg and bloom. Just picked up the bloom for my next grow and my girls are seeming to like it much better for the flowering stage. Hope this helps!
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Just wanted to drop you a quick note and say thank you. I took your advice and switched to the Sensi Coco Bloom & Grow (was using Micro/Grow/Bloom) & reduced the AN recommended feed schedule concentrations by 25% which gave me a EC range of 2.0-2.4. All through Veg & flower stages and I had zero issues :-) . I grew a high % CBD strain & a Purple Kush.......... both will be harvested next week and they look very frosty.

Your direction was bang on and very much appreciated........Cheers
 
G

GyppedGypsy

Member
Leon727272 said:
Just wanted to drop you a quick note and say thank you. I took your advice and switched to the Sensi Coco Bloom & Grow (was using Micro/Grow/Bloom) & reduced the AN recommended feed schedule concentrations by 25% which gave me a EC range of 2.0-2.4. All through Veg & flower stages and I had zero issues :-) . I grew a high % CBD strain & a Purple Kush.......... both will be harvested next week and they look very frosty.

Your direction was bang on and very much appreciated........Cheers
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Thats awesome! So glad it helped!
 
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A

Apalchen

Well-Known Member
HaitianPe said:
I’m thinking about doing this loco/earth mix you speak of. Does the mothers earth cut the starting strength of the loco?
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Yeah i kinda think of it the other way around. It add just enough nutrients to the coco that I can just start feeding with my normal schedule without running a bunch of extra nutrient solution or additives like cal mag to get started or buffered.
 
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