Epic 4x4 Flowering Smackdown : 96 Elites vs 288s

Good morning, OG. Your girls are looking exceptional as usual this morning!

I checked on mine before work and the JH and MHM both exploded with growth overnight. A ton of growth. PYC and the freak LHZ both were mainlined on Saturday.

I'll try to get a thread started in Rio soon.

StickyBudHound said:

Good morning, OG. Your girls are looking exceptional as usual this morning!

I checked on mine before work and the JH and MHM both exploded with growth overnight. A ton of growth. PYC and the freak LHZ both were mainlined on Saturday.

I'll try to get a thread started in Rio soon.

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Snowday dude!

Or_Gro said:

Snowday dude!

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Lol, I know. It was coming down pretty good in my area but wasn't sticking at all...

Thought of you when the news showed your area is getting hammered and mine isn't. Just a tiny bit jealous but I'll get over it.

StickyBudHound said:

Lol, I know. It was coming down pretty good in my area but wasn't sticking at all...

Thought of you when the news showed your area is getting hammered and mine isn't. Just a tiny bit jealous but I'll get over it.

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Drive carefully man,...heavy, wet, sticky... if this shit freezes up, it’ll be a frighin mess, with trees/lines down....

StickyBudHound said:

Good morning, OG. Your girls are looking exceptional as usual this morning!

I checked on mine before work and the JH and MHM both exploded with growth overnight. A ton of growth. PYC and the freak LHZ both were mainlined on Saturday.

I'll try to get a thread started in Rio soon.

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Thanks man, lookin forward to seein yours..

Hope this weather doesn’t impact your pending delivery...

Brock_Fawkin_Samson said:

I currently use reptile bulbs which barely get into UVB (on all the time) but think I am switching to the agromax bulbs. Ill be watching your thread but if you're asking, would begin my dosage (unless determinate data was provided) measured in μmol/m2/s of UVB correlating to any measurements available of the suns relative intensity (and corresponding UVB intensity) at the location to the species I'm growing. Like in the distribution you posted, there were different UVB readings at different parts of the year, I'd use the max level during summer or June and start there. Is MJ native to the UK?

I didn't mean to come off as a know it all and am enjoying your grow/test!

With respect I disagree about mimicking the sun, but I have no clue! IMO, the plant that we know has been naturally selected to produce the best under the suns conditions and its native environment. We add WV to LED because we found plants have evolved to like certain WV, due to what the sun produces.

I do see your point though, that you're not looking to reproduce the sun, rather measure and test to figure what's best or optimal, not attempt to make an artificial sun. I'm completely on board and am excited to see what you find. Idk randomblame and am a new member so not familiar with all the history and testing and who did it but am enjoying the site so far. Ill be watching

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Sorry for the late reply. I've done the same like you and have use 12% UVB reptile bulbs all day long with not a single issues other than a bit heatstress. But reptile bulbs try to mimic the sun .. at least the better ones. But they all have only verly little output in the range below 300nm. Zhats the same with sunlight cause the closer it gets to the UVC range the more is filtered by the atmosphere.
Agromax bulbs are totally different. They have not only another UVB : UVA ratio, if you look at that video one the last page in the 1st minute you can see the bulb spectrum and you can see it starts with 250nm. Thats deep in the UVC range and far from being naturally.
And if you look at 285nm where you see the highest reponse of the UBR8 receptor and cpompare that to your good old reptile bulbs Agromax is more than 20 times stronger in these area. Actually we need some kind of UVC filter with these bulbs.

I've used two 2ft bulbs above a 2x 4' area and believe me 4x 15 min. per day woith a minimum distance of 20-24" is already the maximum for the most strains. In week 7 I've tried to reduce the distance to 16" and within 2 days I've burned them girls their asses off. And I've used selfmade "superspreaders" to reduce center intensity by throwing a part of the light back into the reflector for better distribution.


2 of them stopped growing completely and were completely focussed on protecting them self. I've lost almost all the upper fans leaves too; only the parts of the plants covered in trichomes were unaffected from damage.
No need to mention the run finished with a loss of 3-4 zips compared to my usual results in this area.
I've already a dimmable ballast cause this seems the only way to use them without causing damage. When I can get 24" intensity with my desired hanging heights of 14-16" I'm already happy. Maybe one hour per day with 15w each bulb is already enough!

But the biggest downside is in the same time the biggest benefit of the pureUV bulbs. When you need only 1h to get the same results like from 12h reptile bulb you can save a lot of energy! That's the main reason for me to further work them and invest in a dimmable ballast.
Maybe I can find a coating we could use for these bulbs removing the UVC part completely. We could simply paint the bulbs with it. I'm pretty sure the UVC light has the most damaging effect and without it would be much easier to work with them.
Unfortunately we need a UVC meter to prove my suspicion.

Try them out but do yourself a favor and start with a pretty low dose. These bulbs can destroy the whole crop in only one day!!! 12h at 20" and the whole tent is dead! 100%!!!

Or_Gro said:

Thanks man, lookin forward to seein yours..

Hope this weather doesn’t impact your pending delivery...

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I hope it won't either... Lol, I hadn't thought about that.

lol... It’s a busy reading day somewhere in germany, 40 alerts and counting...,

Or_Gro said:

Makin progress on the smackdown tents:

96elite tent is currently being used to flower the sisters of the smackdown girls; they’ll trade tents soon.

This tent still needs two additional 96s, far red bar, uvb light, co2 dispersal hose, and circulation fans. Light, environmental, and co2 controllers are ready to go.

View attachment 4288935

288 tent is in similar condition, controllers ready; 288s and 35s are up, as well as co2 dispersal hose; still to install are far red bar, uvb light, and circulation fans:
View attachment 4288936


Gettin there...

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288 tent

Let there be...

Far Red Bar, initiator effect:


QB 35 afterburners, emerson effect:


The whole shebang, 2 Timber 48sams (8x288, emerson, initiator):


(max ht with exhaust filter/fan ~70”, 54” above res lid)

Light Controllers set and ready for 12:12...

Next up: environmental and co2 controllers...

Will move airpump and install circulation fans when plants move in...

Starting to get fired up for some flower action...

About those far red initiators and emerson effect lights. I remember when you started using them but, I don't think I ever read any reports about the differences you observed that they made to your grow.

BTW, the emerson effect is interesting stuff to read about.

I'd "like" some posts.... If only I were worthy. Can't even start a journal yet.

StickyBudHound said:

I'd "like" some posts.... If only I were worthy. Can't even start a journal yet.

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Same as real life...Keep telling the girls how pretty they are...you’ll get worthy fast!

StickyBudHound said:

About those far red initiators and emerson effect lights. I remember when you started using them but, I don't think I ever read any reports about the differences you observed that they made to your grow.

BTW, the emerson effect is interesting stuff to read about.

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Can’t honestly compare them on and off, cuz i haven’t done the comparisons...

just don’t have the labrat patience for evaluating tiny steps...so i did 1000ppfd+emerson+initiator+co2 all at once...worked goodlike..

3.8lbs, 2.2g/w, 3.8 oz/sqft worth...

So, I’m stickin with em...

Others can tease out the incremental gains...

Or_Gro said:

Same as real life...Keep telling the girls how pretty they are...you’ll get worthy fast!

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Help me OG Wan Kenobi.

Or_Gro said:

Can’t honestly compare them on and off, cuz i haven’t done the comparisons...

just don’t have the labrat patience for evaluating tiny steps...so i did 1000ppfd+emerson+initiator+co2 all at once...worked goodlike..

3.8lbs, 2.2g/w, 3.8 oz/sqft worth...

So, I’m stickin with em...

Others can tease out the incremental gains...

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I hear ya. I get an idea going and I can barely take the time to do step pics, let alone just a little of the project at a time to test small changes.

StickyBudHound said:

Help me OG Wan Kenobi.
I hear ya. I get an idea going and I can barely take the time to do step pics, let alone just a little of the project at a time to test small changes.

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Just keep posting until you hit the open sesame amount...feel free to do whatever it takes here man!

How’s the vortex barrel?

Or_Gro said:

Trichporn, beginning 2nd flush of pistils, mother plants, 6 weeks:

View attachment 4287806 View attachment 4287814 View attachment 4287807 View attachment 4287809 View attachment 4287808 View attachment 4287810

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Here these girls are today, 47 days since 12:12



The stickyness to calyx ratio is way high!

Or_Gro said:

5 new drivers wired, 2 96s fully wired 3 more arriving later this week. Put these 2 in with the sisters:

View attachment 4281233 View attachment 4281234

4x4, 8 plants, pair of 2-main same strain/bucket, four 96elites, each on a 240h-54a, runnin 180w/light @ 22”, layin down ~1000ppfd on those tops.

2 more 96s will be in this tent for smackdown, the 3rd 96 will go into the 4x4 gorilla with the mainlines....gettin there.

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And the sisters of the smackdown girls, today, 32 days since 12:12

Two tents have prayin nuns, the third and fourth will have rockin montresses....



12:12 early next week?

Harvest time is gonna be a marathon!

StickyBudHound said:

Harvest time is gonna be a marathon!

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Gonna try to do an airdry vs freeze dry comparison on the mothers see if i can get a freeze dry tek worked out for bud & rosin.

If so, i’ll then do a deep freeze vs freeze dry for bubble hash yield comparison, using the sisters.