Figure This Led Haters

FuZZyBUDz

Well-Known Member
JN811 I think the reason why you and others hate LEDs so much is because they are so expensive. That is understandable...It's not easy to support something when you don't have the money to buy it..and I agree they are SUPER expensive..

HID = cheap and effective
LED = expensive and effective

Of course people will take cheap and effective over expensive and effective any day.

But the reason I like LEDs is..
1.) because they use a lot less heat than HIDs...which means if you have a grow tent..you will spend at least an extra 300 to 400 dollars on exhaust fans in order to keep the temps down to a reasonable level..

Fans are still needed with LEDs because plants need ventilation and air flow. But I can meet those needs with a much cheaper fan. With HID, you will almost always need a powerful and expensive fan that moves a lot of air just to keep the tent cooled

Meaning, you don't just spend money on the HID system..you need to buy another expensive exhaust system just cool the damn thing down..EXTRA MONEY..

2.) LEDs use a lot less electricity than HIDs....again..EXTRA MONEY...for some people...having a high electric bill can cause other problems..add the exhaust system on and that electric bill can jump quite a bit..lol..A 600 watt HPS alone can cost an extra 30 to 40 dollars a month not including the exhaust to keep it cool..depending on the type of grow...
growing auto flowers means leaving the lights on for longer periods throughout the day..


3.) LEDs last longer than HIDs which is also a bonus...EXTRA MONEY on bulbs every year..lol..again depending on how much you grow, an HID will need to be replaced at least once a year if not more..

4.) Since LEDs give off less heat they can be hung closer to the plant. Since height is sometimes an issue, being able to hang lights closer to the plants gives extra added room without having to buy a taller Grow tent (if that's what you use)...again...EXTRA MONEY..for the extra grow space..

Now can you give me some reasons that HIDs are better??
I have given my reasons for LEDs..lets hear yours for HIDs...

OK, well if LED's r so effectivce then y do i keep having to see CFL's or MORE THAN 1 damn panel in with the mix???

i run a 400 watt digital ballist, i use 19.00 $$$$$$$ a month, expensive??? OH and i dont have an expensive fan neither NOR do i have a sealed air cooled hood. just a good old econowing.

my temps stay below 80 ALL day? HOT???

u talked about the same thing twice in that too man.

now i havent had my 400 very long, maybe a few months BUT 1 use a 150 watt FOR VEG, on a 18-6 schedule, that ive been using fer 2 YEARS....NEVER replaced a bulb. yea EVERY YEAR.

Closet!

My reasons.
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
ok im going to post this and I REALLY want you to read it.. and no I swear I would have no problem what so ever spending a bit more money for a superior product but LEDs are not superior by a long shot.. I really believe that led is a new technology that has plenty of uses, just not grow lights unless somehow they improve the technology and juristically reduce the cost.

I think LED users buy into the hype, they dont like factors like heat that HIDS produce, but heat is actually essential to plant growth, which is y i see led users buying space heaters.. Also, I think LED users dont like the fact that they are so bright.. but bright light is also essential as shown bellow... Read and then tell me whatever you want because Ive posted this for plenty of ppl like u who do not have a proper understanding of the sun..... Just read it to understand, then tell me how many lumens ur LEDs have..




Things to know about lighting
Things to know about lighting
Color rating- Measured in Kelvin (K). The higher the number, the more bluish the light. 4000K-7000K is mostly on the blue side of the spectrum, while 3000K and under goes from a white spectrum, to a redder spectrum.

How much light is needed?
The minimum amount of light required by marijuana plants is around 3000 lumens per square foot. However, it's not 100% accurate, since although you may have a 10,000 lumen light, the amount of light that reaches the plant varies with the distance between the light and plants, and reflectivity of the grow box. The ideal amount is somewhere around 7000-10,000 lumens/sqft, and as long as the plants do not burn, as much light can be used as you want.
(*note, the sun produces about 10,000 lumens/sqft, on a sunny summer day).

Determining lumens for your grow area:
Determine the square footage of your area (example in a 4 foot by 4 foot area, there is 16 square feet)
If you have a 1000 watt High Pressure Sodium, that produces (approx.) 107,000 lumens.
Divide this by 16 (your square footage) 107,000 / 16 = 6687 lumens per square foot.
So just divide the total amount of Lumens, by the total amount of Sq ft, and thats your lumens per square foot.

How far away from my plants do the lights go?
The lights in your grow room should be as close as possible to the plants without burning them. There is no such thing as too much, unless there is sufficient heat to dry out and burn the leaves. A good rule is to put your hand under the light, if its too hot for your hand, chances are that the plants will be too, so move the light up until your hand feels more comfortable. For seedlings and clones, I keep them a little further away from the light, because they are very susceptible to burning and drying out, at these stages.

Efficiency is very important when choosing a type of light. The wattage is not the most important thing, as you can see below, different types of light produce different amounts of lumens per watt. A 300 watt incandescent will produce about 5100 lumens. While a 300 watt Metal Halide (just an example, they do not come in 300 watts), will produce 27,000 lumens. Obviously far more efficient for growing, while still using the same amount of electricity.

Approximate light production:
Incandescents: 17 lumens/watt
Mercury vapor: 45-50 lumens/watt
Fluorescents: 60-70 lumens/watt
Metal halide: 90 lumens/watt
High pressure sodium: 107 lumens/watt

Incandescent lights: Incandescents are the most popular type of lights in the world. They may come advertised as incandescent, tungsten, quartz, halogen, or simply standard. The important thing about incandescents is this: they suck.
There are some incandescents which are sold as 'grow lights.' They usually have a blue coating and usually come in 60W and 120W sizes. While they may seem like a good choice to new growers, they are next to useless; they produce some light at a usable spectrum, but only have about a 5% efficiency and generate more heat than usable light. Most of us have these in our homes right now. Don't use them for growing, instead opt for a Compact Fluorescent as a cheaper but more efficient alternative.

Fluorescent lights: Fluorescents are a lot more useful than incandescents. Their efficient enough, and cheaper than HID lights. Compact fluorescent tubes are popular with growers because of their good output to size ratio. Compared to standard 4' tubes, compact fluorescent bulbs are smaller, and more can fit into a given area. Fluorescents are good for small grows on a tight budget, and for novice growers, since they do not require any special sort of wiring or understanding of the necessary bulbs for a given fixture, and are very widely available.
Fluorescent lights come in many different Kelvin ratings; often the spectrums are labeled on packaging as being 'cool white' or 'warm white.' Cool white is more blue, and is good for the vegetative stages of growth, and warm white light is more orange or reddish, and is best for the flowering stage.

High Intensity Discharge (HID) Lighting Systems:

Mercury Vapor (MV)
Mercury vapor lights are not the most efficient light for growing. They are very bright, and relatively cheap. They do emit light at the wavelengths necessary to support your plants growth, but not nearly as good as a MH or Hps light. Much of the light emitted by MV lights is bluish-white. Street lighting is what most MV lighting is used for.

Metal Halide (MH)
Metal halide lighting systems are optimal for use in the vegetative phase of growing. They emit mostly blue light, which encourages vigorous growth of foliage. They are very efficient, but can get rather expensive to start with; fluorescents may seem more appealing because of their lower price, and they are not much different when compared on a lumen-to-lumen cost level. These lights can be used through-out the grow, but will most likely result in light, fluffy buds.

High Pressure Sodium (HPS)
High pressure sodium lights emit mostly orange, yellow, and red spectrum light, which is perfect for the flowering stage of the plants growth. They are (in my opinion) the most efficient type of light available for any application. HPS lights can be used through-out the entire grow. They produce more dense and usually larger buds than any other light.
HPS lights are generally a little more expensive than MH systems of similar wattage. They are more commonly used by experienced growers because of their ability to produce tighter buds, higher lumen-output-per-watt, and will produce from start to finish.

I'll also add this graph below, i hope this post helps some of you out.
 

ToddFarcon

Active Member
LED are great i been wait to use them as a light source for more than 10 years im 24 now so yah im a nerd but it show how close minded we are (irony and if its gotta be explained take your feet out of your ass) look at LEDs on ebay a lot of 200 is less than 20 with free shippin then theres tons of site with schematics for free with all supplies accounted and time a slow person can build a decent beginer light for 10% of that $2000
:spew:
 

FuZZyBUDz

Well-Known Member
LED are great i been wait to use them as a light source for more than 10 years im 24 now so yah im a nerd but it show how close minded we are (irony and if its gotta be explained take your feet out of your ass) look at LEDs on ebay a lot of 200 is less than 20 with free shippin then theres tons of site with schematics for free with all supplies accounted and time a slow person can build a decent beginer light for 10% of that $2000
:spew:

Well do it! cuz you will be the first if u get a HEAVY good harvest! be one fer the record books!
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
Ive actually seen 1 decent led grow but it was fucking insane!! He must of spent a good 20k on everything, he has sooooo many LEDS its somewhere on here I have no idea where...It looked amazing, i will admitt, but completely pointless but id love to sit in their and watch my plants grow while smoking a bowl, fucking trippy how many colors there were..
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
LED are great i been wait to use them as a light source for more than 10 years im 24 now so yah im a nerd but it show how close minded we are (irony and if its gotta be explained take your feet out of your ass) look at LEDs on ebay a lot of 200 is less than 20 with free shippin then theres tons of site with schematics for free with all supplies accounted and time a slow person can build a decent beginer light for 10% of that $2000
:spew:
lol stop being silly.. its funny how everyone backing leds has under 100 posts and most are one there 1st grow.. just come back to us when it fails..
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
So todd id love to see some pics if this ever happens but for now it sounds like ur backing something u have faith in and loved as a kid which is no type of logic i care about..
 

SeanIzen

Active Member
In defense of LED's, well kind of, price should not be the issue unless your NOT concerned about the best possible weed. Because money does not directly translate to marijuana in any way it's about the dumbest point ever to say, "YAH? WELL ITS WAY MORE EXPENSIVE SO HA!!!" - you look stupid
In defense of HID/MH/CFL, they are tested and proven to work with great results!
THAT SHOULD BE THE END OF IT! ITS NOT ABOUT PROVING PEOPLE WRONG ITS ABOUT MAKING NEW GROWING DISCOVERY'S! OPEN YOUR MINDS TO NEW TECHNOLOGY FOLKS!! LEDS WILL BE THE WAY TO GROW WITHIN THE NEXT 5 YEARS!!
that is unless cold cathode takes off, (imagine changing your spectrum with the crank of a nob and not even touching your light system!!)
 
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chitownsmoking

Guest
In defense of LED's, well kind of, price should not be the issue unless your NOT concerned about the best possible weed. Because money does not directly translate to marijuana in any way it's about the dumbest point ever to say, "YAH? WELL ITS WAY MORE EXPENSIVE SO HA!!!" - you look stupid
In defense of HID/MH/CFL, they are tested and proven to work with great results!
THAT SHOULD BE THE END OF IT! ITS NOT ABOUT PROVING PEOPLE WRONG ITS ABOUT MAKING NEW GROWING DISCOVERY'S! OPEN YOUR MINDS TO NEW TECHNOLOGY FOLKS!! LEDS WILL BE THE WAY TO GROW WITHIN THE NEXT 5 YEARS!!
that is unless cold cathode takes off, (imagine changing your spectrum with the crank of a nob and not even touching your light system!!)

when i grew with a 250 watt hps i could easily get 6 sometimes 7 or closer to 8 ounces per harvest.. ... i wanna see that done with 250 watts of l.e.d.'s
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
In defense of LED's, well kind of, price should not be the issue unless your NOT concerned about the best possible weed. Because money does not directly translate to marijuana in any way it's about the dumbest point ever to say, "YAH? WELL ITS WAY MORE EXPENSIVE SO HA!!!" - you look stupid
In defense of HID/MH/CFL, they are tested and proven to work with great results!
THAT SHOULD BE THE END OF IT! ITS NOT ABOUT PROVING PEOPLE WRONG ITS ABOUT MAKING NEW GROWING DISCOVERY'S! OPEN YOUR MINDS TO NEW TECHNOLOGY FOLKS!! LEDS WILL BE THE WAY TO GROW WITHIN THE NEXT 5 YEARS!!
that is unless cold cathode takes off, (imagine changing your spectrum with the crank of a nob and not even touching your light system!!)
wanna bet ur soul on that?
 
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chitownsmoking

Guest
very nice grow... and really what i ment to say was very nice strains... but bet he didnt even pull 4 full oz
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
it looks good but the yield is lacking.. didnt see any buds the size of my avatar and i only spent $140 on a 400 watt and my shit looks just as good if not better..
 
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chitownsmoking

Guest
its still in progress, hes still drying right now. I am not sure his yield., maybe he will post when he finishes.

if he pulls more then 4 oz then i will admit there may be something to this led shit

but he needs to pull more like 6 plus to compare it to hps and i dont see that happening
 

SeanIzen

Active Member
after reading a shit ton about LED grow lights it seems to me that biggest problem is misinformation. Most of these grow lights DO NOT hit the chlorophyll sweet spots with their spectrums. after searching for LED's that are within the right spectrum I found that they do exist. Only problem was after ENDLESS searching for an LED grow light that had all the right spectrum's in it I came to the conclusion that you should buy your own LEDs with the right spectrum and get to soldiering...
And as someone pointed out, most LED defenders have 100 or less posts. I guess if your all such growing masters maybe you should be the ones to actually give this tech a try rather than let all these "rookies" do the growing and base your opinions off their shitty growing techniques....
 

fdd2blk

Well-Known Member
you guys are still all here? bongsmilie


once no one here could match this 007.jpg, which really isn't even that much, it was pretty much proven LED are bunk. :eyesmoke:
 

bigkuz68

Active Member
they work, just not how the led companies claim. it takes similar wattage to hps. after a week and a half flowering with half hps half led, these plants became too close to the hps. now they are week 3, 900 watts led.
DSC00403.jpg
 

JN811

Well-Known Member
they work, just not how the led companies claim. it takes similar wattage to hps. after a week and a half flowering with half hps half led, these plants became too close to the hps. now they are week 3, 900 watts led.
View attachment 732007
i dont even wanna ask how much that cost ya, but in ur sign. it says u have 2500 watts of hps.. so do you use both?
 
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