Thanks, will definitely read your post. I'm sure both of you have popped thousands more seeds than I ever will (at least cannabis seeds). I don't know that any particular method is "better" than direct planting (just like everything else). I personally think the only reason these methods exist with cannabis are prohibition based, and due to the fact that folks are hoping for a way to protect their few precious beans, when in reality it all, (shot glass, paper towel, etc.) probably do very little to increase germination when looked at on a commercial scale. I also think that being abrasive and unnecessarily rude are fuckin' stupid. My view is that all methods are at least worth some REAL scientific testing, like with lab coats and scientists and educations lol, so I'll keep an open mind until that day comes, but thank you Uncle Ben, and Soma, and everybody else who's every popped a seed, for contributing to the FOUNDATION of the science, I'm just not ballsy enough to call any of it fuckin' stupid until the real science gets here.That's fuckin' stupid.
Some of these people would fuck up a wet dream if given half the chance. READ my archive. I discussed the science (gravitropism) behind what's going on.
Germination rates and poll
- Thread starter kiwipaulie
- Start date
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
So I assume you plant in the ground only and never repot your seedlings? Or just plant directly into a 5 gallon as a seed? Because if not, then you're doing more harm to the seedlings than the paper towel method. Up potting isn't healthy or natural for a seedling.Well said...
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
I guess I don't get how with some people it's their way only and everyone else's method is dumb. As a matter of fact, MANY seed breeders reccomend using the paper towel method over direct planting. I like to save 4-10 days by sprouting in a paper towel and not in the soil. My direct plant STILL isn't up yet. Directly planting isn't STUPID to me, it's just not what I do. But damn, there are alot of stupid ignorant peeps on these forums trying to convert tthe world to their way of thinking. So many misled people out there, it's rather sad when people aren't willing to try anything just because they are afraid that the new way may break their theory apart, so they stay stagnant and never learn new things. I for one, like to learn and try new things. Because trying to things means you are willing to learn and willing to accept if something is better or is not better. And again, if you plant in a party cup or the like, and then up pot to 1 gallon, then 3 gallon, or however you do it, you are hurting your plant more than our method of simply using a folded moist paper towel. And how is a paper towel different than any other soilless medium? It's NOT. Smh. People these days.
If your asking me, I absolutely repot, but again more a function of prohibition and space than a preferred method. I do believe in transplanting as few times as necessary, but I also feel that as long as you transplant before the roots have ovee developed in the pot, your probably going to be fine, personally, 1 gallon into 7 gallon.
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
I was just referring to the bashers above hating on other peoples method to start a plant, they are way to closed minded. That's like saying I like a blue shirt, you wear a white shirt? That's stupid, you're never supposed to wear a white shirt. haha, oh well. That's life I guess.
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
I assume you mean cannabis seed pollen chuckers who are out to make a fast buck. They also probably recommend flushing. I know plenty of noobs that use a paper towel because it's popular, not because it's smart. These are the same numbnuts pissin' off their money on Advanced Shysters and conversion ballasts.
I am a commercial horticulturist, farmer, vineyard owner..... raising tropical fruit in greenhouse and I'm hear to tell you no one uses a paper towel whether they're starting one seed or a thousand....at least no one in their right mind.
If Soma were so smart he'd realize that the radicle will grow like it's supposed to in its natural environment. Using a paper towel is un-natural and an unnecessary step.
Some of you guys need to get out of cannabis lala land and rub elbows in a group of normal gardeners.
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Greenhouse;save
Well-Known Member
Sorry mate but does your plant that has been PAPER TOWELED not need potted up as it progresses (with bare root showing)wait could b simpler than placing a prepacked(wrapped) jiffy that gives it wot it needs for it as first few days in life into its next container.It's defo not science mate and yes I have tried the paper towel method but like stated before WHY add anouther step to the process.....
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Prohibition based?
I gave you the science, not jive. In all cannabis circles, jive and bro science takes precedence. It's the nature of this biz.
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
I have tried I think every method known to get a seed up and running with as little root damage as possible. The method that I use now requires the use of small peat pots, the ones that look like an ice cream cone with a flat bottom. Into these cubes I place GERMINATION mix, not potting soil. I do not soak seeds, I just moisten the mix and place the seed 1/4" down and place the cube in a garden tray (if you have a lot of cubes) or plate, and place on a seedling heat mat. You can cover the cube by just laying Saran wrap loosely on top, keep moist (spray) In 3 day's I should have my seeds up. Then I transplant the cube into my final pot or container, maybe 3 day's after the seed sprouts. This way the tap root is never obstructed in growth, it grows right through the peat pot. For soil I place the plant in my 3 gal pots and in my drip system I use 4x4x4 Rockwool blocks with holes, in which I place the cube. I never remove the seedling from the cube, and the roots just grow right through it. You probably could place the seedling in the cube directly in any medium you use, coco, perlite, Hydroton, as the roots grow thru the peat pot, it does not dissolve so the germination mix does not wash away. I'm a big believer in uninterrupted root growth, and with my method there really isn't any repotting, or actual contact with the roots at all. Other methods require contact with the roots, one way or the other, unless you directly plant the seed in it's final spot, which can be a pain in the ass. This works for me very well, as I found that seeds LOVE germinating mix, as it is light and airy, and does not inhibit the growth in any way. To each their own.
AlphaPhase
Well-Known Member
UB, from a commercial prospective, you're right, hell no to the paper towel method. I know plenty of farmers that don't sprout their totmato or peppers in paper towels, but they do sprout mj seeds in paper towels, especially if it's a strain they want the highest chance of survival. It's also a nice tool for a small indoor grower to use that is 100% sanitary (soil if not quality and perfect for germination can harm a seedling). It's also A LOT easier to manage the moisture AND temperature while using hardly any space, with the paper towel method. There's many good benefits of using the paper towel method is all I'm saying. I've done both, I'm no pro, but I'm not a noob. I've been growing plants since I was knee high. Well not really knee high, but you get the point. Next year will be 15 years, that's not that long, but it's long enough to get a feel for what I like to use but I in no way bash others choices of growing. I don't use AN or anything crazy, I think the most expensive stuff I've used is dyna. It's all the same. I use a powder nute at the moment, but that's kinda off topic. The reason I sprout in the paper towel is because I get a consistent 100% germ rate. I do not have the luck with direct planting and since seeds can be expensive I do what works the best and has the best success for me, I will not change the method because it's un natural and others don't like the idea.. That's all I'm saying. The sanitary factor and the ease to use the paper towel trumps direct plant, i've never had a plant not sprout from moving it to the medium of my choice, they aren't as fragile as you'd think, just don't rip off the tap root and you'll be fine 
And yes, it is a transplant from the towel to medium @greenhouse - that's what I'm saying, it's no different then starting them directly in a party cup and transplanting them to a bigger pot with tons of roots exposed to the light or whatever. When I transplant from the paper towel I do it in a room with little light and i'm gentle. Once my sprout is put into the next medium it usually stays there til harvest IE: hydroton or 2 gallon pot ( for mother plants) I only use soil for mother plants unless I grow outdoors.
EDIT: All indoor growing is unnatural. It's just the way it is. Everything is artificial indoors. So un-natural is not a valid argument.
And yes, it is a transplant from the towel to medium @greenhouse - that's what I'm saying, it's no different then starting them directly in a party cup and transplanting them to a bigger pot with tons of roots exposed to the light or whatever. When I transplant from the paper towel I do it in a room with little light and i'm gentle. Once my sprout is put into the next medium it usually stays there til harvest IE: hydroton or 2 gallon pot ( for mother plants) I only use soil for mother plants unless I grow outdoors.
EDIT: All indoor growing is unnatural. It's just the way it is. Everything is artificial indoors. So un-natural is not a valid argument.
If you think "jive and bro science" will take precedent, or be more accurate than REAL science a day after federal rescheduling your severely out of touch. Real science, if fact, already takes precedent in cannabis, it's just that the majority of the Cannabis Community chooses to pretend that the cannabis plant requires a custom scientific skill set to study, and therefore, the majority of "bro scientists", due at minimum to a basic lack of understanding in the realm of statistics and SCIENCE, think they're are somehow more qualified to study the plants. All of this thinking is prohibition based and leads to COUNTLESS wasted hours by Cannabis growers where they could have come to the same conclusion by spending 30 minutes reading, and understanding (...This is where the education part comes in), an article from scholarly journal. For a specific example, read everything you want on cannabis sites about terpene isolation, then read a few papers by real scientists about terpene isolation, and witness the ignorance of "bro science"....so....yeah....seed germination.
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Appears some are not capable of reading nor processing the points I scripted in my archives and notes. To each his own......
I've said it before which begins with the VERY simple start of growing - germinating a seed. Most of you guys are hell bent on making this as complicated and confusing as you can from the get-go to the end.
I'm a simple man....
I've said it before which begins with the VERY simple start of growing - germinating a seed. Most of you guys are hell bent on making this as complicated and confusing as you can from the get-go to the end.
I'm a simple man....
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Not true. Get some experience before making such statements. ALL plant material benefits from upcanning as reflected in renewed vigor within days. Ever thought there might be good reason why gardening professionals start with a small pot and then graduate to bigger ones?
http://puyallup.wsu.edu/~Linda Chalker-Scott/Horticultural Myths_files/Myths/Fragile roots.pdf
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
You're not smart enough to take me seriously, not that I care.
I have upcanned and transplanted at least 10,000 trees and other stuff during my ag career. Some of us know better not to fuck up a good thing based on experience and a formal education and training.
It's all about technique but that too went over the head of smart asses like you, witness the lack of response to my carefully thought out germination archive. Read the link in my previous post, ya fuckin' dumb ass.
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
yes