Help! Potency Sux!

schuylaar said:

how do you get that fire on the fan? please share your secret with me..you just totally blew me away.

EDIT: PM me if you don't want to share.

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The secret is there's no secret. Just genetics+environment (and I just have a standard typical dutch-style grow closet, real philips hps, gavita hood, proper reflection and extraction). It's really mostly genetics (not that I don't get similar frost with other strains), the seasons vary a lot here, going from dry cold to warm wet climate and my environment is certainly not always ideal.

The influence of genetics is easily illustrated by my seedlings (just water in coco, soil, sponge, etc under T8 18watt tubes)


Those are partly a result of realizing the function of a plant in the universe (), which very simply put comes down to that plants don't eat. They are immobile essentially because they don't have to go out and look for food like animals, they create food from basic elements. They are chemical factories that use basic building blocks, and don't need anything else than the type and amount of building blocks they can genetically process. To improve a species, one has to breed a better variety. Thats why for example corn is so much bigger than hundreds of years ago, not because we started pushing more essential elements in them.

Sativied said:

The secret is there's no secret. Just genetics+environment (and I just have a standard typical dutch-style grow closet, real philips hps, gavita hood, proper reflection and extraction). It's really mostly genetics (not that I don't get similar frost with other strains), the seasons vary a lot here, going from dry cold to warm wet climate and my environment is certainly not always ideal.

The influence of genetics is easily illustrated by my seedlings (just water in coco, soil, sponge, etc under T8 18watt tubes)

View attachment 3335761 View attachment 3335762
Those are partly a result of realizing the function of a plant in the universe (), which very simply put comes down to that plants don't eat. They are immobile essentially because they don't have to go out and look for food like animals, they create food from basic elements. They are chemical factories that use basic building blocks, and don't need anything else than the type and amount of building blocks they can genetically process. To improve a species, one has to breed a better variety. Thats why for example corn is so much bigger than hundreds of years ago, not because we started pushing more essential elements in them.

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ya i love how those hydro plants stay so green all the way through. good looking grow. and your right. you'll never convince me to do ant type of grow with 350 ppm and half that being the tap water. looks like it works good for you though. one more thing, when i said the plant is feeding i wasn't meaning the plant was really eating stuff. thats silly, but thanks for clarifying that lol.

Sativied said:

The secret is there's no secret. Just genetics+environment (and I just have a standard typical dutch-style grow closet, real philips hps, gavita hood, proper reflection and extraction). It's really mostly genetics (not that I don't get similar frost with other strains), the seasons vary a lot here, going from dry cold to warm wet climate and my environment is certainly not always ideal.

The influence of genetics is easily illustrated by my seedlings (just water in coco, soil, sponge, etc under T8 18watt tubes)

View attachment 3335761 View attachment 3335762
Those are partly a result of realizing the function of a plant in the universe (), which very simply put comes down to that plants don't eat. They are immobile essentially because they don't have to go out and look for food like animals, they create food from basic elements. They are chemical factories that use basic building blocks, and don't need anything else than the type and amount of building blocks they can genetically process. To improve a species, one has to breed a better variety. Thats why for example corn is so much bigger than hundreds of years ago, not because we started pushing more essential elements in them.

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i'm of the "more is less" thought process, and had a "simplicity = results" in my blog. i find i'm constantly suggesting that they stop touching their plants.

saw this on T-8's:

http://www.hoveyelectric.com/hovey-electric-power-blog/bid/83731/T5-vs-T8-How-Do-You-Know-If-You-Really-Need-T5-Lighting

any thoughts? i use a T-5.

Alienwidow said:

ya i love how those hydro plants stay so green all the way through. good looking grow. and your right. you'll never convince me to do ant type of grow with 350 ppm and half that being the tap water. looks like it works good for you though. one more thing, when i said the plant is feeding i wasn't meaning the plant was really eating stuff. thats silly, but thanks for clarifying that lol.

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sativied is correct..my last grow for the majority of the time was in 350-500 range, 100 of which was tap.. and green all the way through!

maybe it's mind-set? are you a positive person around your plants?

Sativied said:

Looks great, lush, dark green. Leaves look very similar to my high ppm runs.

View attachment 3335722
The best bud site in the pic above is chocolate fondue, the rest is skywalker kush.

Same grow:
View attachment 3335725
Color and plastic gloss look great perhaps but really is taking it too far (N in this case). That was 1000+ppm with several additives.

If you keep it up you will likely get rusty brown spots on fans later in the cycle even if you don't burn them. Leaves will likely get harder and crispier too.

The thriving force for plants is water potential, the air pulls water out of leaves, leaves suck water through plants pulling ions close enough to its roots for uptake. Typical argument in defoliation threads is that leaves shouldn't be removed because they are the solar panels, while in fact they are so much more. Keep the leaves happy, and the plant will thrive (hence the phrase reading leaves). Not saying 1000ppm leads to crappy shwag, but when it comes to pushing the plant to max yield and potency, just as the darkness of the green of leaves, more is not more.

This is what 350-380ppm (in NFT...) mid-flower looks like, and that's just a fan leaf:
View attachment 3335726
I described its potency as not suitable for operating heavy machinery or vehicles.

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Noobs take notes!
Outstandin!

schuylaar said:

i'm of the "more is less" thought process, and had a "simplicity = results" in my blog. i find i'm constantly suggesting that they stop touching their plants.

saw this on T-8's:

http://www.hoveyelectric.com/hovey-electric-power-blog/bid/83731/T5-vs-T8-How-Do-You-Know-If-You-Really-Need-T5-Lighting

any thoughts? i use a T-5.

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I got T8 because I knew that's what many other growers in my area use, almost tradition (germinate and veg a week or two under T8 ), and I just haven't had the need for T5. The 18w itself is low but 3 of them create a nice even spread. Last round I had 18 plants under 3x18w T8.The plants are so small at that stage that the light from the T8s is plenty to bombard and saturate their little leaves with photons. I doubt I'd gain even more than a day (on the first 10-14 days) with T5 instead of T8 even with double the wattage. I use the same lights for cloning but at a larger distance from the plants.

The thing with such articles making comparisons is that they usually compare typical/simple versions of the lights, rather than the best of each. I think there are types of T5s that blow any T8 out of the water, efficiency-wise anyway.

If I had T5 in a veg space I would maybe consider moving to T8 for the first week or two, but only if the T5 uses a lot more wattage. At least one of my 2 veg boxes run nearly 365 days a year so even a 50w difference adds up.

RM3 flowers under T5 but, if I remember correctly, uses T8 initially too. He'd really be the guy to ask about T8 vs T5. @RM3, "any thoughts?"

Sativied said:

I got T8 because I knew that's what many other growers in my area use, almost tradition (germinate and veg a week or two under T8 ), and I just haven't had the need for T5. The 18w itself is low but 3 of them create a nice even spread. Last round I had 18 plants under 3x18w T8.The plants are so small at that stage that the light from the T8s is plenty to bombard and saturate their little leaves with photons. I doubt I'd gain even more than a day (on the first 10-14 days) with T5 instead of T8 even with double the wattage. I use the same lights for cloning but at a larger distance from the plants.

The thing with such articles making comparisons is that they usually compare typical/simple versions of the lights, rather than the best of each. I think there are types of T5s that blow any T8 out of the water, efficiency-wise anyway.

If I had T5 in a veg space I would maybe consider moving to T8 for the first week or two, but only if the T5 uses a lot more wattage. At least one of my 2 veg boxes run nearly 365 days a year so even a 50w difference adds up.

RM3 flowers under T5 but, if I remember correctly, uses T8 initially too. He'd really be the guy to ask about T8 vs T5. @RM3, "any thoughts?"

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I clone and do seedlings under a T8 (15 watt) but I veg & flower under T5's

I know a few growers that run over amped T8's as side lights seems there is a youtube that explains how to add a ballast to make em run hotter, I've not done it though

schuylaar said:

sativied is correct..my last grow for the majority of the time was in 350-500 range, 100 of which was tap.. and green all the way through!

maybe it's mind-set? are you a positive person around your plants?

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fuck ya, i have a stereo for them and everything. two spectrums, de lights. i sweep once a day and dance down the aisles. very positive around them. i don't dwc any more, I'm in soiless right now and run about 4-600 in flower. the cost of nutrients just really doesn't make much of a difference to me so i don't really get into the whole evil nutrient company hype that you guys throw around. i mean i always want to save a buck but the risk of running 150 ppm of nutrients and having a shitty turn out kinda makes it not worth trying so i listen to the plants (not really with my ear, and they don't really talk sativied ) but i just watch them and see what they seem to like the best. thats what led me to 600 ppm in soiless. i didn't even read up on soiless, just got it cause someone told me to get it from riu and i ran with it. if the plant looks happy it probably is imo, the fact is though that this poster says that his two strains lacked potency and he ran low ppms. i figure its the fact that he ran low ppm, you guys figure its the genetics. i figure that since it was two strains that it wasn't the genetics. you figure that because you guys were able to keep healthy plants at low ppm that it wasn't the feed schedule. i guess well never know.

Alienwidow said:

ya i love how those hydro plants stay so green all the way through. good looking grow. and your right. you'll never convince me to do ant type of grow with 350 ppm and half that being the tap water. looks like it works good for you though. one more thing, when i said the plant is feeding i wasn't meaning the plant was really eating stuff. thats silly, but thanks for clarifying that lol.

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What's "silly" is your efforts to miss the message of that analogy and the other posts, while nobody is actually trying to convince you of anything... as well as the effort to find explanations other than the obvious, it has nothing to do with the price of nutes (that what you call hype is about overpriced bullshit additives...). Whether I spent $20 or $100 on a grow that produces $3K worth in bud is irrelevant to me.

Sativied said:

What's "silly" is your efforts to miss the message of that analogy and the other posts, while nobody is actually trying to convince you of anything...

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did you read my last post? i could care less how low you can run them. the potency suxs remember? this isn't a crusade to teach all of rui from a soap box that you don't need to run high ppm is it? its a my potency sux thread and saying that its genetics tells the guy that he's doing everything right, and its someone else's fault besides his. ok run with that. i doubt thats the case, but if you do well then you must be right. right? you do know everything right? and so does this kid, he's like your protégée right? you watched him all the way through and followed his journal? ya you did, wait how low can you go on a potency sux thread? whatever sativied, you take over this one. maybe get him an experiment to try for his next run, like taking away more nutrients. sounds like a sound plan. lmfao. fuck that, rape em in the ass with nutrients like the bottle tells you to do and when the plant tells you to back off then do it. and then see if your potency suxs.

Sativied said:

What's "silly" is your efforts to miss the message of that analogy and the other posts, while nobody is actually trying to convince you of anything... as well as the effort to find explanations other than the obvious, it has nothing to do with the price of nutes (that what you call hype is about overpriced bullshit additives...). Whether I spent $20 or $100 on a grow that produces $3K worth in bud is irrelevant to me.

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so that 80 dollars is what your calling the nutrient companies greedy for taking on three thousand? ok bud. i stand corrected.

LMAO at the above post. More nutrients equal higher potency? Ya right.....

Bro hes saying ur shit sux cus youre using alot of nutes and burning the potency off bro. Listen to this dude! He knows alot

Alexander Supertramp said:

LMAO at the above post. More nutrients equal higher potency? Ya right.....

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wait, wheres chuck and ben? cummon, call em all in to tell this guy to run 150ppm plus tap water to improve his potency. please. i haven't laughed this hard all day.

In their absence will I do LOL

This is a quote cut from a post over at ICMAG Trippy Sativa thread ,,,,

What is more amazing to me is the golden yellow color that is spreading. I would not be surprised if it ended up being half gold, half red in the end. I have heard that the Mullumbimby Madness strain has some Colombian in its ancestry. I can't help but think that it is Colombian Gold genetics that are expressing themselves in this particular plant. For a long time I have been growing with very low nitrogen, and low fertilizer in general. This is due to some experiences where using less made the high better and stunningly stronger. This causes more non green colors to express themselves, which is how buds looked when I was a kid. We never saw green buds back in the good old days. Golden colors were always the rarest, and the most sought after. This plant is way too easy to get the green out of the buds. No matter how this turns out, I have to try again with a little more fertilizer to see what happens then.

I generally feed less than half what the nute manufacture recommends

I've never had a potency problem, this is in week 6 of flower

RM3 said:

I generally feed less than half what the nute manufacture recommends

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im feeding half right now. soil less, like you. were doing fine though.

RM3 said:

I've never had a potency problem, this is in week 6 of flower
View attachment 3336408

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is that side lighting or do you flower with those floor tubes exclusively? looks like those blue actinic bulbs in there?

Alienwidow said:

is that side lighting or do you flower with those floor tubes exclusively? looks like those blue actinic bulbs in there?

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I flower with T5's and yeppers there are a few actinics mixed in