Homosexuality a choice??

UncleBuck said:

how can you say you made the choice to be straight when you never considered the alternative?

boom, trap finally sprung.

hint: there was a trap either way, this one just destroys your premise.

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Kaendar said:

Your an idiot

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Kolasinski is a jackass

Posted by: amalaproposmale on: July 7, 2009

• In: Gay
• Comment!

While the title of my thoughts is definitely one of a position, and not going to be a fair fight, Kolasinski’s paper is written with MANY a logical fallacy, and the whole paper is based on many presumptions that only a fundamentalist could maintain despite frosting it over with the icing of secularism. But to get more to the point of the paper, the state of Maine is battling back and forth for the right of homosexual couples to marry. The legislature and governor have passed a law assigning the right to marry to homosexual couples. There is a people’s veto movement afoot to remove this law.
“People’s veto effort is likely to postpone weddings indefinitely”:
This article states how in the state of Maine, after getting enough signatures, a ballot can be placed to veto any recently passed law. While this is a helpful tool, having the many vote on the rights of the few is a dangerous thing. Imagine if you would the deep south NOT having a federal government enforcing the rights of the many. Jim Crow south would probably still be in full swing, as the minority of voters would be the disenfranchised. With the possibility of this petition, many couples in Maine will not be able to recognize their legal marriages until the whole issue is resolved in November. My case states that ultimately there is no secular reasoning for the disallowment of homosexual marriages, and furthermore the rights of the minority should not be infringed upon by the religious beliefs of the majority.
The reason I decided to title my essay as such is the fact that while Adam Kolasinski, a financial economics doctoral student, argues from an appeal to popularity, and a moralistic fallacy of “this is the way it seems to have been forever, so continue it” he also completely contradicts his own logic in one paragraph stating that a primary reason homosexual couples should not be able to marry is their inability to reproduce sexually, and then at the end of his illogical rant goes on to say that the primary reason homosexual couples should not go on to marry is so that no one can make arguments for future marriages based on their sexuality. Kolasinski states that sexual love should and should not be taken into account for this issue, this argument definitely follows the slippery slope logical fallacy as well, assuming that once two adults that love one another can marry, why not multiple numbers. He also states that a negative issue that will arise is lack of propagation of the society in terms of less birth children. This is a huge false dilemma fallacy, as is the case with China and India, propagation is not always helpful. All of his arguments are stemming from places of either false facts, false logic or dogmatic beliefs warped into secular clothing. Perhaps my title is purely an ad hominem attack on someone who is coming from a position of false authority, but I have yet to have someone posit an authentic secular argument against gay marriage that isn’t true of all populations.
Johnathon Rauch: In “Gay Marriage: The case for Marriage” Goes on to say the exact point, that while an opinion of what marriage is for, maintains no internal logical issues other than it’s being an opinion. Marriage is about love, and gay love is the same as heterosexual love. Gay couples have been proven to be just as good of parents as heterosexual parents, and a stable loving home is a stable loving home.
My feelings on it is this. The day that one can posit a truly secular reason for the denial of gay marriages, one that isn’t true of heterosexual marriages and is original, I will consider that and weigh it with the seemingly oppressive situation that we leave homosexual couples in presently. Until that day, let them eat cake… wedding cake that is.

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Kaendar said:

I had no idea.. I got those from a gay rights page.. go figure

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Kaendar said:

From a study at the University at Buffalo:


There have been numerous theories identifying homosexuality asabnormal. Some researchers (eg: Bieber, 1976) have identified abnormal patterns of upbringing and relationships that to lead to homosexuality. Homosexuality is thus said to bethe result of disturbed early experiences, including poor familylife (eg: for men - extremely poor father-son relationships and anoverly involved mother) and poor relationships with same-sex peers. Psychoanalytic theorists suggest that these experiences caused thehomosexual to be afraid of heterosexuality, so they becomehomosexual as a means of denying their fear of same-sex peers.

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Kaendar said:

Everyone chooses their sexual orientation. How do I know I chose to be straight? Cuz I coulda chose to be gay..

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UncleBuck said:

*you're

you said you made a choice to be straight, but you never thought about the alternative.

i can't choose between milk and beer if i never consider milk.

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mysunnyboy said:

you coulda chose to be gay?????? omg thats fucking hilarious. so you had feelings for others of the same sex and just didn't act on it? thats what a thought. seriously come on out K baby, the water's fine.

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Kaendar said:

Omg.. its sad how immature people act on the fucking internet.

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Kaendar said:

I believe that the atheistic worldview has no moral foundation upon which to make distinctions between right and wrong. The only way atheists can make a moral judgment is if they borrow from the Christian worldview, which adheres to moral absolutes. Still, for the purpose of this post, let's assume that it's possible for atheists to remain consistent in their worldview.

Atheists rely on a naturalistic, pragmatic morality that considers "right" to be that which is beneficial for humanity as a whole. Likewise, that which is detrimental to humanity is deemed "wrong". For example, an atheist may judge murder to be wrong on the basis that if everyone ran around killing each other, the human race would become extinct. The atheist can comfortably conclude, then, that it is good not to murder his fellow human being.

So what about the issue of homosexuality? Why do so many atheists seem to be such ​

strong supporters

of gay rights? I would think that the atheist, even from a naturalistic perspective, has no choice but to conclude that homosexuality is morally wrong. The reason is simple: If everyone were gay, procreation would cease, thereby dooming the human race to extinction.​

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missnu said:

So as atheists we are a lawless bunch of barbarians...but which religion is right? I mean different ones have different rules... So are you sure that you are one the right bus? What if the true religion hasn't been made up--I mean discovered--yet?

I mean why do you feel that being gay is wrong? Because you were told it is wrong, when in reality it has been happening to all manner of species since the beginning of time...we,come to nature ruling...when there are too many mammals of a certain type in an area part of the population will start having homosexual tendencies...it is the earth's way of trying to keep humans, dogs, deer, whatever we are talking about---from over running an area.

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Kaendar said:

Stop cherry picking my posts.. I provided a valid point and your completely ignore it.

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Kaendar said:

This thread was never about homosexuality being wrong, its about if people think they make the choice to be gay. Once again tho a certain select crowd has turned this into a flamewar, and someone created a fuckin sock puppet account. There is an overwhelming amount of pretentious know it alls here that cant respect people and have a decent conversation without throwing away every bit of decency and professionalism as possible.

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Kaendar said:

This thread was never about homosexuality being wrong, its about if people think they make the choice to be gay. Once again tho a certain select crowd has turned this into a flamewar, and someone created a fuckin sock puppet account. There is an overwhelming amount of pretentious know it alls here that cant respect people and have a decent conversation without throwing away every bit of decency and professionalism as possible.

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BustinScales510 said:

You said you thought homosexuality was immoral and abnormal, dont try to act like thats not what this is about. You are the one thats not showing respect. Just because you dont like something doesnt mean it is scientifically impossible and that people are lying about who they are.

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Kaendar said:

I believe that the atheistic worldview has no moral foundation upon which to make distinctions between right and wrong. The only way atheists can make a moral judgment is if they borrow from the Christian worldview, which adheres to moral absolutes. Still, for the purpose of this post, let's assume that it's possible for atheists to remain consistent in their worldview.

Atheists rely on a naturalistic, pragmatic morality that considers "right" to be that which is beneficial for humanity as a whole. Likewise, that which is detrimental to humanity is deemed "wrong". For example, an atheist may judge murder to be wrong on the basis that if everyone ran around killing each other, the human race would become extinct. The atheist can comfortably conclude, then, that it is good not to murder his fellow human being.

So what about the issue of homosexuality? Why do so many atheists seem to be such ​

strong supporters

of gay rights? I would think that the atheist, even from a naturalistic perspective, has no choice but to conclude that homosexuality is morally wrong. The reason is simple: If everyone were gay, procreation would cease, thereby dooming the human race to extinction.​

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Heisenberg said:

Person A: I don't like gays and I have a right to say it even if it makes you feel bad


Person B: I don't like homophobes


Person A: You have no right to say that because it makes me feel bad

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missnu said:

Well if atheists like only what is good for humanity then you tell me what would happen to the world if there were no homosexual creatures trying to keep the population cut back a bit...and you notice that as time goes on there are more and more of the population that seems to be gay...well that is because homosexuality occurs more often in highly populated areas---and everywhere is becoming more populated...so you can see the correlation...which is why people are starting to see that it is a necessary part of the world in which we live...so just deal with it...Nobody is saying you have to suck cocks, but I think anyone who wants to should...

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Kaendar said:

This thread was never about homosexuality being wrong, its about if people think they make the choice to be gay. Once again tho a certain select crowd has turned this into a flamewar, and someone created a fuckin sock puppet account. There is an overwhelming amount of pretentious know it alls here that cant respect people and have a decent conversation without throwing away every bit of decency and professionalism as possible.

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Kaendar said:

The term "homophobe" is grossly abused.

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