Is the Rev full of shit about humic and fulvic acids?

Buggins

Buggins

Active Member
So I just finished reading an article in this month's edition of Skunk (Volume 7, Issue 5, Page 54) and the Rev basically states that using liquid organic fertilizers such as General Organics Bio Thrive, or Fox Farms bottled product is like napalm for the soil biology. The reasoning is that chelating agents like humic and fulvic acid that are common in these products kill off the beneficial bacteria and fungi.

I have been using the General Organics line in my most recent grow as I wait for my supersoil to cook. I also use it to supplement if a plant turns out to be a really heavy feeder and my soil can't keep up. But now this has me a little concerned.

I brew a compost tea once every 21 days with earth worm castings in veg, and mushroom compost in bloom. I do this to inoculate the soil with a nice dose of living microbes. So if what I've read is correct, then this means I should either A - not bother inoculating the soil because my nutes will just kill all the goodies off, or B - keep with the teas and other amendments that support a living soil food web, and never feed with liquid organic nutes again.

Is this true? Do I really have to be concerned about this?

Granted I've still got a lot to learn, but I thought things like humic acid and fulvic acid were a byproduct of the composting process, and actually promote living soil?

I'm pretty confused here and would appreciate some clarification from you enlightened ones.
 
FR33MASON

FR33MASON

Active Member
While I am not too familiar with these products but like anything in too great of concentration can create a change that can shock microbes and plants alike. It's the same for hydrogen peroxide...a small amount dilluted in water can have a great benifit to plants but pour a concentrated amount and you have sterilized your soil and cooked your roots.
 
dirtyho1968

dirtyho1968

Well-Known Member
Buggins said:
So I just finished reading an article in this month's edition of Skunk (Volume 7, Issue 5, Page 54) and the Rev basically states that using liquid organic fertilizers such as General Organics Bio Thrive, or Fox Farms bottled product is like napalm for the soil biology. The reasoning is that chelating agents like humic and fulvic acid that are common in these products kill off the beneficial bacteria and fungi.

I have been using the General Organics line in my most recent grow as I wait for my supersoil to cook. I also use it to supplement if a plant turns out to be a really heavy feeder and my soil can't keep up. But now this has me a little concerned.

I brew a compost tea once every 21 days with earth worm castings in veg, and mushroom compost in bloom. I do this to inoculate the soil with a nice dose of living microbes. So if what I've read is correct, then this means I should either A - not bother inoculating the soil because my nutes will just kill all the goodies off, or B - keep with the teas and other amendments that support a living soil food web, and never feed with liquid organic nutes again.

Is this true? Do I really have to be concerned about this?

Granted I've still got a lot to learn, but I thought things like humic acid and fulvic acid were a byproduct of the composting process, and actually promote living soil?

I'm pretty confused here and would appreciate some clarification from you enlightened ones.
Click to expand...
Man, I read that too and was like huh???
 
dirtyho1968

dirtyho1968

Well-Known Member
An old post:


  • A Lumper Dawgz tea recipe.


    1 cup organic seed meal (equal parts of organic cottonseed meal, flaxseed meal, alfalfa meal & canola meal)
    1/2 cup Alaska humus (Denali Gold brand)
    1 cup homemade worm castings
    2 tbls. kelp meal

    ***1/2 cup fish enzyme (fungai development)
    1/2 tsp. BioAg Pure Humic Acid (fungai development)***

    1 or 2 tsp. molasses (not necessary but I use it when I need higher bacteria counts).

    6 gallons bubbled water

    Run it at 75F for 18 hours to achieve a high fungai tea and 24 hours for a higher bacteria profile.

    Spray on all branches, stems, leaves, everything to destroy powdery mildew and maintain that with 2x per week of neem seed oil application.

    Use as an inoculant for the soil after clones are set in veg and again at the beginning of the flower cycle. Maintain with weekly waterings of fish enzyme and seaweed extract.

    Works for me.

    LumperDawgz


    SO...

    • ***1/2 cup fish enzyme (fungai development)
      1/2 tsp. BioAg Pure Humic Acid (fungai development)***​


      ​

    So in flower​


    ​
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
maybe do a side by side experiment so you dont need a scope. the fancy bottled nutes and acids are so much more expensive than granular ferts anyway. in good soil it is completely unnecessary to do anything other than plain water, maybe some blackstrap molasses. better off to spend $$ on genetics, microbial teas and ewc imo.
 
elduece

elduece

Active Member
Buggins said:
So I just finished reading an article in this month's edition of Skunk (Volume 7, Issue 5, Page 54) and the Rev basically states that using liquid organic fertilizers such as General Organics Bio Thrive, or Fox Farms bottled product is like napalm for the soil biology. The reasoning is that chelating agents like humic and fulvic acid that are common in these products kill off the beneficial bacteria and fungi.

I have been using the General Organics line in my most recent grow as I wait for my supersoil to cook. I also use it to supplement if a plant turns out to be a really heavy feeder and my soil can't keep up. But now this has me a little concerned.

I brew a compost tea once every 21 days with earth worm castings in veg, and mushroom compost in bloom. I do this to inoculate the soil with a nice dose of living microbes. So if what I've read is correct, then this means I should either A - not bother inoculating the soil because my nutes will just kill all the goodies off, or B - keep with the teas and other amendments that support a living soil food web, and never feed with liquid organic nutes again.

Is this true? Do I really have to be concerned about this?

Granted I've still got a lot to learn, but I thought things like humic acid and fulvic acid were a byproduct of the composting process, and actually promote living soil?

I'm pretty confused here and would appreciate some clarification from you enlightened ones.
Click to expand...
hahaha. Anybody that calls himself "The Rev" is full of it.

btw I do have a big enough microscope and do use GO with SS.
 
Buggins

Buggins

Active Member
I re-read the article this morning, and he also states that when growing "True Living Organics" style, it's better to flower under MH because it more closely mimics natural sunlight, and HPS will give poor results when growing with living soil.

Seriously?!

I feel like I've been taking crazy pills.
 
Snafu1236

Snafu1236

Well-Known Member
Skunk magazine should be ashamed of that article, if it is of what you speak.

I don't read that garbage, as their title alone signifies that they don't truly appreciate cannabis.

I have not read the article and do not plan to.

I have been using humics and fulvics for over 10 years now, with excellent results. I have done many controlled studies with cloned genetics, and always see a better, healthier plant with the addition of these acids.

Use fulvic for foliar feeding as it has a smaller molecular footprint and can be metastized into the plants cells easier.

Use humic as a soil conditioner.

Your plants will love you for it. If "The Rev" is speaking otherwise, he either is misinformed, has no experience using humics or fulvics, or simply does not know what he is talking about.
 
FranJan

FranJan

Well-Known Member
Isn't it right on the front of Happy Frog Potting Mix that it contains myco's and humic acid? Happy Frog's organic, right? I don't think Fox Farms is gonna make a lot of friends nuking people's beasties.
 
hyphae

hyphae

Member
How is it that a natural chelator is that devastating to soil microbiology? I woul also like some more information
 
hyphae

hyphae

Member
@ snafu, I used to foliar feed millenium's ruby fulvic when i did hydro and they always looked great.
 
racerboy71

racerboy71

bud bootlegger
I know that the rev also hangs out over on d skunk forums.. could maybe shoot him a link to this thread and see if he dont stop by..
 
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